Cold Crashing and gelatin. Add when??

[Hank_McCoy]

So I'm posting on this thread since im new to home-brewing and still using ingredient kits using extracts and bottling. No kegging. So my question is at what stage of fermentation can I cold crash my fermantator in the fridge and add the gelatin? And secondly, would it be better to transfer into your secondary carboy to further displace adjuncts and proteins. My obvious goal here is beer clarity without kegging.

 

[IslandLizard]

Welcome to HBT!

Cold crash only after you're sure fermentation has finished.

How do you know it's finished?
When all signs of fermentation have ceased, take a hydrometer sample and another one 3 days later. If they are the same and it's close to your expected FG, fermentation is (usually) done.

At that point it's generally deemed safe to package/bottle.

You may want to clarify the beer a bit more, before bottling. Cold crash the beer first before adding the dissolved gelatin, no need to stir, although you could give the top a gentle one. Let it do its work for a few days (4-7). Repeat if needed.

The closer you can keep it to 32F the better and faster it clears, but ~36F works fine too. Make sure it doesn't freeze up!

Omit secondaries, they're not needed. Everything will sink to the bottom after a rest period leaving clear beer on top. Cold crashing speeds that process up, gelatin helps too, but is not always needed.

Rack or siphon the clear beer into your bottling bucket with priming solution. Prevent sucking air, and any splashing, as that will aerate your beer and oxidize it over time, which is bad.

When racking or siphoning, start from the middle area of your fermenter, half way between the trub layer and the top of the beer level. As the beer level drops, lower the cane slowly.

Once you get to the last few inches of beer left, tilt the fermenter toward one side to keep the well from which you're siphoning deep. Again beware of losing prime and sucking air, keeping the bottom of the cane under the beer level at all times.

Right before or when you see yeast/trub being sucked up, pull the tubing out of your bottling bucket, to prevent air gurgling through it.

Give the bottling bucket a very slow and gentle stir to distribute the sugar solution then bottle away.

Notes:

• If you're using a racking cane, one of those flexible rubber carboy caps with those 2 "teets" is recommended, it holds your racking cane in place. You can start the siphon by blowing air in through the 2nd opening.
• Using an inverter tippy on the bottom of your racking cane or siphon pulls beer in from the top rather than the bottom, so it disturbs the trub layer far less.
• It helps to have an extra set of hands available when racking, especially when you're not used to the process yet.
• You can always rehearse with a carboy or bucket of water.
• Set your carboy/fermenter on a slightly damp towel or washcloth, so it won't slide.
• Have a rolled up towel ready to wedge under the carboy/fermenter when tilting it, toward the end.
• Wet, damp, condensated carboys are very slippery. Be careful, they can cause a big mess and serious injury when they break (large, sharp, glass shards). Plastic (PET) carboys are much safer as are plastic (#2) buckets, which come with a handle.

 

[Mitch S]

Everything @IslandLizard said.

You can always rehearse with a carboy or bucket of water.

I always rehearse, usually with StarSan, prior to the transfer to the bottling bucket. Not only can you iron out the kinks in your process, you also just sanitized everything you need to bottle!

Another process to consider in the future, which you will see referenced a lot within these forums, is whirlpooling. Basically, it's spinning the wort that has been cooled to pitching temps fast enough that solids move towards the middle. Then, you siphon your wort from the side into your fermenter of choice. This won't eliminate the need to cold crash or add gelatin, but should contribute to better beer clarity.

 

[Hank_McCoy]

Everything @IslandLizard said.


I always rehearse, usually with StarSan, prior to the transfer to the bottling bucket. Not only can you iron out the kinks in your process, you also just sanitized everything you need to bottle!

Another process to consider in the future, which you will see referenced a lot within these forums, is whirlpooling. Basically, it's spinning the wort that has been cooled to pitching temps fast enough that solids move towards the middle. Then, you siphon your wort from the side into your fermenter of choice. This won't eliminate the need to cold crash or add gelatin, but should contribute to better beer clarity.

-Thank you so much for the info and quick response. I've also became a fan of dry hopping. How and when can I continue Dry Hopping with the involvement of cold crashing and the addition of gelatin?

 

[IslandLizard]

I've also became a fan of dry hopping. How and when can I continue Dry Hopping with the involvement of cold crashing and the addition of gelatin?

Dry hop at the end of fermentation or after fermentation has completed. Dry hopping is typically done for 3-5 days (7 days is often considered the upper limit) and as close to packaging as possible. If needed cold crash for 1-3 days after the dry hop is done, with or without gelatin.

Many of us add dry hops loose, others bag them. If bagged, use large, roomy, fine mesh nylon hop bags so the hops can swim in the beer, and the beer can permeate the hops. A bit of agitation once or twice a day helps with dispersion and extraction. Such as a swirl or a very light and gentle stir. Bags can be weighed down with glass marbles or a stainless fitting and suspended with unflavored dental floss, so you can agitate/dunk them.

Remember, air (oxygen actually) is a big enemy to beer (it oxidizes) and kills hops flavor and aroma. So try to prevent or at least limit air exposure. If you have a CO2 tank with a regulator, you can flush the fermenter headspace after dry hopping or after lifting the lid (buckets, fermonsters, big bubblers, etc.), which should be avoided as much as possible.

Again, there's generally no need for secondaries. Pretty much everything can be done in the primary vessel, which again helps avoiding air/oxygen exposure.

 

[cactusgarrett]

+1 to everything said above.

Also, "cold crash" sounds very immediate, but an argument can be made to drop the temp gradually, if you have the means. Fermentation may be done, but dropping the temp 5°F per day could prevent the yeast from getting shocked and allow them to continue to further clean up the beer and off flavors. People mind this more for lagers, but ales benefit from this, too.

 

[Hank_McCoy]

Very good. I appreciate the excellent info from you guys. I will surely apply this to my next batch. Thanks again and take care.

 

[IslandLizard]

Another thing to note.
When obvious signs of fermentation have stopped (e.g., no more bubbling, krausen fallen), that does not mean the fermentation has completed, or the yeast is done.

Most of us typically don't consider fermentation finished unless it's at least a week after those obvious signs have disappeared, sometimes longer, occasionally shorter. It's called the conditioning phase, and important to how the final beer will taste.

 

[Hank_McCoy]

Another thing to note.
When obvious signs of fermentation have stopped (e.g., no more bubbling, krausen fallen), that does not mean the fermentation has completed, or the yeast is done.

Most of us typically don't consider fermentation finished unless it's at least a week after those obvious signs have disappeared, sometimes longer, occasionally shorter. It's called the conditioning phase, and important to how the final beer will taste.

Oh yes indefinitely so. My routine after pitching yeast has been let ferminate for a week. Then transfer to secondary carboy and dry hop for a another week. Then bottle and carbonate for a week. Total three week grace period until first taste. Now for the next time I'll introduce the cold crash/gelatin for the clarity and the win.

 

[IslandLizard]

My routine after pitching yeast has been let ferminate for a week. Then transfer to secondary carboy and dry hop for a another week.

Secondaries are not really needed, even for dry hopping, fruit, additional sugars, etc. and can be even detrimental to your beer (incomplete fermentation, infection and oxidation risks), especially in novice, unskilled hands:

Omit secondaries, they're not needed. Everything will sink to the bottom [regardless] after a rest period leaving clear beer on top.

Leaving the beer in the original (primary) fermenter is fine, even for extended conditioning, or short aging periods, 6-12 weeks. For longer aging times, or doing real secondary fermentations, a secondary vessel can be the better choice, leaving minimal headspace.

 

[Hank_McCoy]

If I still have your attention Id like to ask about using whirlfloc tablets. Is it ok to use a whirlfloc tablet to any kind of brew and the end of your boil or are they only meant for certain types of beers like Belgium?

 

[IslandLizard]

If I still have your attention Id like to ask about using whirlfloc tablets. Is it ok to use a whirlfloc tablet to any kind of brew and the end of your boil or are they only meant for certain types of beers like Belgium?

Whirlfloc, Irish Moss, etc. are kettle finings, meant to coagulate hot and cold break (proteins), so they sink to the bottom faster and more complete. After whirlpooling or a brief rest, clearer wort can then be transferred to the fermenter, leaving behind a fluffy deposit on the bottom of the kettle.

Their biggest benefit is less trub in the fermenter, not necessarily clarity in the final beer. All trub should all settle out at the end of the fermentation anyway, sometimes with the help of cold crashing/gelatin.

Can be used for any beer style, perhaps except turbid mashed wort for sours, and Witbiers.

 

[CodeSection]

@IslandLizard , I was considering using fining gelatin as well to help clear my beer. My LBS salesman convinced me not to do it since I bottle. His said the gelatin would cause problems with carbonation since I would be reducing or eliminating the needed yeast.

Your post suggests otherwise. Possibly I misunderstood. So, would I have problems with carbonation if I cold crashed and used fining gelatin prior to bottling using a priming solution and bottling bucket?

 

[IslandLizard]

@IslandLizard , I was considering using fining gelatin as well to help clear my beer. My LBS salesman convinced me not to do it since I bottle. His said the gelatin would cause problems with carbonation since I would be reducing or eliminating the needed yeast.

Your post suggests otherwise. Possibly I misunderstood. So, would I have problems with carbonation if I cold crashed and used fining gelatin prior to bottling using a priming solution and bottling bucket?

Even after gelatin fining and cold crashing there is plenty of yeast left in suspension to carbonate your bottles. It may take a little longer, but 3 weeks on average should do it.

It's after long aging (3+ months) or with very strong beers you should add some fresh yeast at the time of bottling as the old yeast will have autolyzed (died). Sometimes they use champagne yeast for that, as it is very alcohol tolerant.

 

[Hank_McCoy]

Thank you so much for all you great input and knowledge. My question pertains to dry hopping. I've got into dry hopping before my new found love for cold crash/gelatin. Id like to combine the two processes now. Would i be able to do that all in same week together in the fridge or will dry hopping only work at room temperatures and tack on an addition week?

 

[Calder]

@IslandLizard , I was considering using fining gelatin as well to help clear my beer. My LBS salesman convinced me not to do it since I bottle. His said the gelatin would cause problems with carbonation since I would be reducing or eliminating the needed yeast.

Your post suggests otherwise. Possibly I misunderstood. So, would I have problems with carbonation if I cold crashed and used fining gelatin prior to bottling using a priming solution and bottling bucket?

I use gelatin every beer, and bottle. Never had a problem carbonating bottles.

 

[IslandLizard]

Thank you so much for all you great input and knowledge. My question pertains to dry hopping. I've got into dry hopping before my new found love for cold crash/gelatin. Id like to combine the two processes now. Would i be able to do that all in same week together in the fridge or will dry hopping only work at room temperatures and tack on an addition week?

YVW!

Dry hopping is best done at room temps, when active fermentation has or has about completed. Dry hopping may very well coincide with the '3rd stage' of fermentation, the conditioning phase. There are a few exceptions, some beers are dry hopped toward the end of fermentation, with a few points left to go, such as some IPAs and NEIPAs. They usually get a 2nd dry hop charge 3-5 days before packaging.

Dry hopping should be ideally timed to your packaging date. 3-5 days is plenty for dry hopping. This may be extended to a week, with diminishing returns. If left much longer than that, hops may start to introduce (mostly unwanted) grassy notes, depending on variety and harvest conditions.

After dry hopping, cold crash for 1-3 days, with or without finings, everything will settle on the bottom, so you can rack/siphon (mostly) clear beer from the top.

I already addressed some of these, among other things in #5 [URL='https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/goto/post?id=8512299#post-8512299']↑ [/URL].

 

[Hank_McCoy]

Oh yes I see ive already asked this question. Thank you again for your wise words of wisdom. Im brewing an Imperial Pale and looking forward to the outcome with your help. Cheers!

 

[IslandLizard]

Oh yes I see ive already asked this question. Thank you again for your wise words of wisdom. Im brewing an Imperial Pale and looking forward to the outcome with your help. Cheers!

Just keep air (oxygen) away from your beer. It kills hop aroma and overall hop experience.

For hoppy beers access to CO2 to purge or flush headspaces during fermentation, doing closed transfers, and kegging are almost a necessity. Using forced carbonation you can drink the day after kegging.