Brutus 20 mash-out/heating Question

[tdogg]

my current rig consists of my 10 gallon boil kettle, outfitted with ball valve and thermometer. i have a 10 gallon cooler mash tun, and an unmodified 7 gallon kettle for heating sparge water. i have been doing batch sparges with decent success. next year i would like to get a march pump. i was thinking that i could set up a 2 tier brutus 20 style rig with the cooler mashtun and the 10 gallon kettle. my question is this, when its time to mash out, do you heat the "sparge" water to 190ish F and recirculate to equalize to mash out temps (170F), or start recirculating with water at mash temp (152F) and fire the kettle to raise to 170F?

could i do step mashes by recirculating while heating the kettle?

i may just get another burner for the 7 gallon kettle and do the standard 3 vessel system, but the brutus 20 set up seems so simple and compact that i thought i would look into it more.

 

[tdogg]

any advice?

 

[JuanMoore]

my question is this, when its time to mash out, do you heat the "sparge" water to 190ish F and recirculate to equalize to mash out temps (170F), or start recirculating with water at mash temp (152F) and fire the kettle to raise to 170F?

Your question is pretty unclear, but to perform a mash out, you'd need to heat the grist prior to starting the sparge process. Using a BRUTUS style rig would mean not adding or circulating any water for this step, just recirculate the wort as you fire the burner.

If you're going to continue batch sparging, there's really no benefit to performing a mash out, but as long as it's done via direct heat and not infusion, it won't hurt any either.

could i do step mashes by recirculating while heating the kettle?

Yes, that's exactly how you'd do a step mash on a direct fired RIMS/BRUTUS system.

 

[tdogg]

Ai I understand it, if i switch to 2 vessels (like a brutus 20) it would not really be batch sparging. i want to build a simple and consistent rig, possibly even at the expense of efficiency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdogg
could i do step mashes by recirculating while heating the kettle?
Quote Juan moore
Yes, that's exactly how you'd do a step mash on a direct fired RIMS/BRUTUS system.

does this work even if i dont have a RIMS tube/heating element? i was thinking that this rig would ONLY have the burner under the kettle for heating. i would drain the mash tun into the kettle slowly. at the same time i would pump water from the kettle into the MT and heat the kettle, thus recirculating and heating the wort/sparge water to 170F as i recirculate. is this how most Brutus 20 people do it?

 

[JuanMoore]

Ai I understand it, if i switch to 2 vessels (like a brutus 20) it would not really be batch sparging. i want to build a simple and consistent rig, possibly even at the expense of efficiency.

True, but it's not fly sparging either, really just a dilution of the sugars. There are many ways to operate a two vessel system like a brutus 20, but if I were to do it, I'd probably apply heat as I started incorporating the water and recirculating, but wouldn't really worry about getting to or holding mash out temp to halt conversion. With a couple of quick stirs as it recirulates, the SG should become homogenous fairly quickly and easily, at which point the entire volume can be transferred to one kettle, and the boil can commence. How you plan to use the system is up to you though.

does this work even if i dont have a RIMS tube/heating element? i was thinking that this rig would ONLY have the burner under the kettle for heating. i would drain the mash tun into the kettle slowly. at the same time i would pump water from the kettle into the MT and heat the kettle, thus recirculating and heating the wort/sparge water to 170F as i recirculate. is this how most Brutus 20 people do it?

The brutus 20 plans I have seen are for a direct fired RIMS system, which has burners under both kettles. With only one burner, you'd either need to switch vessels before the boil, or be limited to using infusions for steps/temperature control. If you use infusions and keep the kettles where they are, you won't want to recirculate during the mash, since it will cause a lot of heat loss, which you wouldn't have an elegant way to counter.

 

[tdogg]

i was thinking that i would keep using a cooler for a mashtun, and only recirculate if i needed to raise the temp. would diluting the mash while recirculation cause any issues with PH or otherwise? im guessing not, since it seems like its impossible to oversparge with a 2 vessels system.

 

[shortyjacobs]

So you want to mash in at 1.5 qts in the cooler, leave it for an hour in there, meanwhile fill your kettle with your "sparge" water, (really, the rest of your water for boiling, since you aren't really sparging), and then recirc through the kettle/cooler to equilibrate SGs, then pump all to the BK to boil. Right??

Here's what you do. Heat the BK "sparge" water to 170*, and start recirculating. Meanwhile, fire your kettle to maintain temp in it at 170* as the 152* mash wort gets pumped up into it. Once SGs equalize, close the valve on BK out, pump it all up to the BK, and boil. As soon as you close the BK valve, you can crank up the heat in the BK to get started on your way to boiling.

 

[tdogg]

sounds good, thanks!