BruControl: Brewery control & automation software

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Trending only as I read it for the end of fermentation.. Although getting a correct OG is nice. So far, the ESP32 will only read about 2 feet from a single walled fermentor. I cannot add the repeater (or tilt) without taking off the cover as it will not fit through a TC fitting. Just a little too large.
 
What size are your TC ferrules? My tilt fits fine through a 1.5". Also, you are not trying to put the repeater "IN" the fermenter, are you? Maybe I don't understand your configuration.
 
Going to start changing wiring tomorrow from BCS to BruControl. I think I finally understand enough for the conversion. I am definitely looking forward to as many steps as I need instead of only 64.
RiverCityBrewer said:
What size are your TC ferrules? My tilt fits fine through a 1.5". Also, you are not trying to put the repeater "IN" the fermenter, are you? Maybe I don't understand your configuration.
Click to expand...
It was a Stout 27 gal 1 1/2" TC. Would go though except the end. I might could use a bigger hammer but was too easy to pop the lid. I did not put in the repeater. Still in the box. I
might play with it later but ready to start mounting some hardware for BruControl.
 
Huh, that's really weird... mine fits through with about 1/8" clearance on all sides... maybe an odd size or deformed ferrule? Good luck with the cutover. I too switched from a BCS and haven't looked back.
 
oakbarn said:
Trending only as I read it for the end of fermentation.. Although getting a correct OG is nice. So far, the ESP32 will only read about 2 feet from a single walled fermentor. I cannot add the repeater (or tilt) without taking off the cover as it will not fit through a TC fitting. Just a little too large.
Click to expand...

Is it the repeater tube itself which is too large or is it just the orings and ends? If it's the orings and the tube is the same diameter as a tilt I think the tube will fit perfectly in a 1 1/4" ferrule. Was thinking about gluing it to a 1 1/4 ferrule and mount it on the top of the fermenter but if the tube is larger diameter that wont work off course.
 
BruControl currently only supports 4 RTDs (PT100)? Is there hardware addons that can increase this QTY?
 
aeviaanah said:
BruControl currently only supports 4 RTDs (PT100)? Is there hardware addons that can increase this QTY?
Click to expand...
You need some Max 31865 amplifiers. The BruControl board RP-3 makes it easy to wire them. You can have almost unlimited PT100s. The last Wiring map had almost all of the Ports /Pins from 2 to 49 as RTD capable (except 13, 20, & 21) on a Mega. You need an amplifier for each RTD and a Port. The RP-3 Board just makes it nice and neat to wire 4 at a time. If you need more, just add another PR-3 and the amplifiers. You need to get the amplifiers from Adafruit and I think even Amazon sells them ($$). You will need to know how to through the hole soldering. It is easy and there are lots of videos on how to.
 
oakbarn said:
You need some Max 31865 amplifiers. The BruControl board RP-3 makes it easy to wire them. You can have almost unlimited PT100s. The last Wiring map had almost all of the Ports /Pins from 2 to 49 as RTD capable (except 13, 20, & 21) on a Mega. You need an amplifier for each RTD and a Port. The RP-3 Board just makes it nice and neat to wire 4 at a time. If you need more, just add another PR-3 and the amplifiers. You need to get the amplifiers from Adafruit and I think even Amazon sells them ($$). You will need to know how to through the hole soldering. It is easy and there are lots of videos on how to.
Click to expand...

So I’ll need an rp-3 board for every RTD in the increments of (4)? And I’ll need a amplifier for each RTD?
 
You don't need an RP-3 board, but we offer them to make wiring easier. You can stack these I suppose to get groups of 4. You do need to buy the amplifiers, as a basic micro-controller cannot read RTD's natively via its analog-digital converter. These amps do this and perform well.
 
Yes, I would say get the RP-3 Boards for every 4. They make wiring much cleaner. You do need a Port/Pin on the Mega for each RTD (PT100) Probe as well. When ordering the MAX31865, make sure you get the one for PT100 and not PT1000. I made that mistake. You still need an amplifier for each probe.
 
Thanks for the help regarding the PT100's.

I am planning on creating a cellar control for the brewery and have my eye on BruControl, tho still comparing this to BCS platform. The intent is to monitor/control various FV's via 24v glycol solenoid valve, cold storage via window AC and possibly monitor glycol reservoir for an immediate warning system in the event something goes wrong. I'd love to some day convert our entire system over to a common platform as we are currently running 3 PID Kal style panel.. I would like to plan for this build with intent to grow into this.

The idea came up to have a local interface, panel mounted touch screen would be nice if anyone have information on how to achieve that? Perhaps we may run a tablet connected via wifi and rely on the LCD unit mentioned in BruControl parts list. Will the one LCD support scrolling to check the various temperatures locally?

We are also attracted to an email warning system in case a solenoid valve goes out or something like this. Is it possible to have multiple seeds of BruControl all connected to the same hardware? So one of these would be local and the others could be controlled/monitored from our house (which is miles away from the brewery).

I was thinking XLR for RTD's and M12 connectors for solenoid valves. Tho, a vendor we requested pricing mentioned "distribution block that has the common neutral and power outputs for each solenoid valve". I may go with the idea of an external distribution block rather then a series of QD's or M12 connectors. Looking for options here as I'm trying to do this on a budget but allow for the professionalism at a later date.

Exploring through the BruControl manual, one thing that scared me a bit was the note that mentioned the know how to deal with electronic noise. I know nothing of the sort. Will this be an issue with my described panel? I plan to use RTD's but this is mainly driven by the rest of the brewery using this style. You know, i could always pull parts from one place to another. Any reason to stick with 2 wire thermistor over RTD?
 
swimIan said:
Anyone know of pluses and minuses to using a lm34/35 analog temperature sensor?
Click to expand...

Nice device, but big minus is the slope.These has a slope of 0.010 V / degree... which means a 25 degree differential will only change the voltage 0.25V... meaning poor resolution on a 0-5 V input. At 220 degs (max a probe could see) that would be ~2.2V. If you input 2.2V into a micro's AREF, with 10 bit resolution (1024 divisions) you could get ~0.21 degrees F per division. Not horrible, but that's just resolution - the micro and LM34 will have error and non-linearity, so you would need to calibrate across the range (lookup table probably makes most sense).

On a 12 bit micro, the resolution drops to about 0.05 degrees which is obviously better, but will have errors mentioned above, plus likey some response to noise.

Thoughts?
 
aeviaanah said:
Thanks for the help regarding the PT100's.

I am planning on creating a cellar control for the brewery and have my eye on BruControl, tho still comparing this to BCS platform. The intent is to monitor/control various FV's via 24v glycol solenoid valve, cold storage via window AC and possibly monitor glycol reservoir for an immediate warning system in the event something goes wrong. I'd love to some day convert our entire system over to a common platform as we are currently running 3 PID Kal style panel.. I would like to plan for this build with intent to grow into this.
Click to expand...

* BC is intended to run as much or as little stuff across your brewery as you like. We recommend starting with one small part of your system to get accustomed to it - this doesn't interrupt your "operations" too much at once.

The idea came up to have a local interface, panel mounted touch screen would be nice if anyone have information on how to achieve that? Perhaps we may run a tablet connected via wifi and rely on the LCD unit mentioned in BruControl parts list. Will the one LCD support scrolling to check the various temperatures locally?
Click to expand...

* This can certainly be done, but I would skip the local LCD unless you want a simple readout. Once you start thinking menus and stuff - it's likely better to rely on the touch screen.

We are also attracted to an email warning system in case a solenoid valve goes out or something like this. Is it possible to have multiple seeds of BruControl all connected to the same hardware? So one of these would be local and the others could be controlled/monitored from our house (which is miles away from the brewery).
Click to expand...

* Yes, BC will send an email with an alarm condition, which you can define yourself or trigger via a script.

I was thinking XLR for RTD's and M12 connectors for solenoid valves. Tho, a vendor we requested pricing mentioned "distribution block that has the common neutral and power outputs for each solenoid valve". I may go with the idea of an external distribution block rather then a series of QD's or M12 connectors. Looking for options here as I'm trying to do this on a budget but allow for the professionalism at a later date.
Click to expand...

* I'm not a fan of XLR's. Yes they work but are so dang bulky. They are easy to solder though and are fairly strong. Anyway, that's my opinion - use what you are comfortable with. Regarding your valves... I'm not following you. More detail would help.

Exploring through the BruControl manual, one thing that scared me a bit was the note that mentioned the know how to deal with electronic noise. I know nothing of the sort. Will this be an issue with my described panel? I plan to use RTD's but this is mainly driven by the rest of the brewery using this style. You know, i could always pull parts from one place to another. Any reason to stick with 2 wire thermistor over RTD?
Click to expand...

* EMI is an issue with any low voltage and high voltage system sharing their vicinity's. Follow the guidelines and you should be OK. RTD's are relatively immune to noise, but I recommend shielded cables.
 
BrunDog said:
* BC is intended to run as much or as little stuff across your brewery as you like. We recommend starting with one small part of your system to get accustomed to it - this doesn't interrupt your "operations" too much at once.
Click to expand...
How about multiple instances of BC? If away from the brewery both my partner and I would like access.

BrunDog said:
* This can certainly be done, but I would skip the local LCD unless you want a simple readout. Once you start thinking menus and stuff - it's likely better to rely on the touch screen.
Click to expand...
Not trying to provide control here simply a scroll able readout. What additional components would be needed for this? Can you push me in the right direction?

BrunDog said:
* Yes, BC will send an email with an alarm condition, which you can define yourself or trigger via a script.
Click to expand...
Is it possible to email multiple addresses?

BrunDog said:
* I'm not a fan of XLR's. Yes they work but are so dang bulky. They are easy to solder though and are fairly strong. Anyway, that's my opinion - use what you are comfortable with. Regarding your valves... I'm not following you. More detail would help.
Click to expand...
I tend to agree with you, I may end up just using aviation connectors. I thought with the distribution block they were using may eliminate the need for various stand alone connectors.

BrunDog said:
* EMI is an issue with any low voltage and high voltage system sharing their vicinity's. Follow the guidelines and you should be OK. RTD's are relatively immune to noise, but I recommend shielded cables.
Click to expand...
Are you talking about this guidline?
https://brucontrol.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/BruControl-EMI-Protection-Schematics.pdf I will make sure to use shielded cables. Thanks

How much soldering is required to join screw shield to Mega?
 
Last edited:
oakbarn said:
Yes, I would say get the RP-3 Boards for every 4. They make wiring much cleaner. You do need a Port/Pin on the Mega for each RTD (PT100) Probe as well. When ordering the MAX31865, make sure you get the one for PT100 and not PT1000. I made that mistake. You still need an amplifier for each probe.
Click to expand...
Noted. Thankyou! So, if i need 8 RTD channels I simply keep stacking the RP-3 on top of eachother?
 
You can do that. We don't show that option on the website, but the boards have holes, so you can stack them with spacers. Here is a stacked TF-3 board set:

upload_2019-8-27_19-13-8.png
 
FYI we posted an updated version of BC (v1.1.4) on the website. This fixed a bug for those connecting via USB (serial) where a corrupt message caused a permanent disconnection. No need to hurry and install this unless you connect via serial.

Thanks to a user for reporting the issue and their patience! Gotta love the community which has developed - you are all a good group to work with!
 
BrunDog said:
Nice device, but big minus is the slope.These has a slope of 0.010 V / degree... which means a 25 degree differential will only change the voltage 0.25V... meaning poor resolution on a 0-5 V input. At 220 degs (max a probe could see) that would be ~2.2V. If you input 2.2V into a micro's AREF, with 10 bit resolution (1024 divisions) you could get ~0.21 degrees F per division. Not horrible, but that's just resolution - the micro and LM34 will have error and non-linearity, so you would need to calibrate across the range (lookup table probably makes most sense).

On a 12 bit micro, the resolution drops to about 0.05 degrees which is obviously better, but will have errors mentioned above, plus likey some response to noise.

Thoughts?
Click to expand...

Thank you for the response. Admittedly, I didn’t know much about the device. I was hoping to use some of the unused analog inputs instead of using the digital pins. I don’t need a lot of pins for my setup. It initially looked like it would be a good option. Your information made me think that one wire and RTD sensors are better though.
 
Last edited:
Perhaps I unfairly condemned it. Might be worth a test - certainly it’s easy to implement from a wiring perspective. Would need to make your own probes though (or at least build them like 1-wire units as they are the same shape).

There are also devices with a higher slope. Basically double the above AREF or go with a native 5V. Definitely good enough for brewing.

Auber offers these off the shelf. Imma get one and give it a whirl! I’ve tested these before but don’t remember and that was breadboard work.
 
Last edited:
BrunDog said:
Yessir, that will work. It is indeed an active low board. You will need a legit 5V power supply to power it (can't do it off the interface).
Click to expand...
So i need 12v (preferred) power supply for interface, (i assume min amperage) 5v supply for coil side relays and 24v supply for solenoids? It seems I should be able to eliminate the 5v power supply/relay board in place of 24v. In other words, I'm not sure if I can get away with 12 or 24v on the coil side (controlled by interface) for my 24v glycol solenoid valves.
 
Yes, three power supplies for this configuration. You are correct that you can eliminate the 5V supply if you go with a different relay board.

Problem is a most active high boards require the same input voltage as the coils. The Electronics Salon boards dont. They are a bit pricier, but are good quality. You can power this one off 12V and its inputs will correctly trigger on 5V inputs: https://www.amazon.com/ELECTRONICS-SALON-Mount-Power-Interface-Module/dp/B00M1MIC3C/

They also offer it without the DIN rail carrier for a few $ less.
 
aeviaanah said:
How about multiple instances of BC? If away from the brewery both my partner and I would like access.


Not trying to provide control here simply a scroll able readout. What additional components would be needed for this? Can you push me in the right direction?


Is it possible to email multiple addresses?


I tend to agree with you, I may end up just using aviation connectors. I thought with the distribution block they were using may eliminate the need for various stand alone connectors.


Are you talking about this guidline?
https://brucontrol.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/BruControl-EMI-Protection-Schematics.pdf I will make sure to use shielded cables. Thanks

How much soldering is required to join screw shield to Mega?
Click to expand...

Bump
 
Sorry - I guess I overlooked it. You can only have one instance of BC running. You and your partner could then both access it remotely - I suggest Teamviewer (teamviewer.com). Several uses have good success with it.

The LCD 4x20 display (https://www.adafruit.com/product/198) and backpack (https://www.adafruit.com/product/292) are a good option.

Yes, you can alert multiple emails.

Yes... that one.

Its about 100 points, all through-hole. You can DIY it, or we offer a complete assembled/tested kit.
 
Not really a BruControl specific question, but for those of you who use inline pH meters, what is the equivalent pH that you shoot for at mash temps versus room temp readings? Do you shoot for the same pH level as you do for room temp readings and trust the ATC, or do you shoot for a different pH level?
 
Hey @BrunDog, on your 30amp brewery universal schematic, on the two Adafruit Max31865 boards, you show the GND pins tied to each other, but not back to the ground terminal strip. Is this intentional, or an oversight? I ask not to be critical, but because I'm in the midst of modifying the schematic for my build and I intend to use RTD probes.
 
CadiBrewer said:
Hey @BrunDog, on your 30amp brewery universal schematic, on the two Adafruit Max31865 boards, you show the GND pins tied to each other, but not back to the ground terminal strip. Is this intentional, or an oversight? I ask not to be critical, but because I'm in the midst of modifying the schematic for my build and I intend to use RTD probes.
Click to expand...

That's a BFO.... Big. Fat. Oversight. Thanks for pointing it out!
 
For Tilt users, I just bought this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07VNF9ZST/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The 3d antenna seems much more effective than what I had before. I didn't do a range test, but It picks up both my Tilts in Corny kegs easily from anywhere inside the chest freezer. The previous one I had needed to be right up against the keg, which was a pain because I have 2... getting them both at the same time was a challenge.
 
Trying to understand the benefits to BC Pro over Advanced. What third party applications may come in handy?
 
aeviaanah said:
Trying to understand the benefits to BC Pro over Advanced. What third party applications may come in handy?
Click to expand...
I use a XML parser to pull the pieces of a beerxml file out and feed it into BC to automatically build my brew day. Mash times and temps, volumes, boil time, gravities, hop times and weights, etc. Similarly, I could extract data from BC and feed something else with it... A database, web server, analytics engine, etc.
 
BrunDog said:
No additional cost to upgrade later (we try not to be uncool like that), so I would say if you don't need to move data in and out of BC yet... wait on Pro.
Click to expand...
Good deal!

Just purchased this and a few other items. Looking to buy the power supplies next, at this point I don't need too much high voltage stuff, just powering mainly solenoids and monitoring glycol reservoir.. Tho I will purchase a 240v contactor for the cold storage AC control. I guess with that being said Ill need to bring in 240v to the panel rather than 110v.

https://www.amazon.com/ALITOVE-Tran...+supply+10amp&qid=1566957727&s=gateway&sr=8-1
24V to power the solenoid valves. These calc out at about .33amp/per. At 12 fermenters this is approx 4amp plus a bit of draw on the relays. I think this is well suited.

https://www.amazon.com/PHEVOS-Universal-Switching-Raspberry-Computer/dp/B07BQFQK63/ref=sr_1_7?keywords=5v+dc+power+supply&qid=1566957147&s=gateway&sr=8-7&th=1
12V/10A I think is overkill. My current thought is this will only supply power to the interface. Go big or go home? Should hurt to oversize these correct?

Let me know if I'm missing something, I'm assuming the interface will supply the 5a output for the coil side of the 24v relays for solenoid valves and for the 240v contactor for AC.
https://www.amazon.com/SainSmart-10...v+coil+relay&qid=1566950879&s=gateway&sr=8-16
 
RiverCityBrewer said:
I use a XML parser to pull the pieces of a beerxml file out and feed it into BC to automatically build my brew day. Mash times and temps, volumes, boil time, gravities, hop times and weights, etc. Similarly, I could extract data from BC and feed something else with it... A database, web server, analytics engine, etc.
Click to expand...
RiverCityBrewer, can you be more specific on a XML parser, and how to use the pieces of the beerxml file. I have pro and want to utilize that feature, but I don't understand how to use it. Thanks!
 

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