Brewing, collecting data, and the art of making better beer

[progmac]

I thought I would share a rather enlightening exercise that I am going through. I have had a few mediocre batches lately and it is important to me that I understand what is going on with these batches and why. With brewing, it is sometimes hard to know what items of control are making a big difference and which aren't.

I have been keeping a spreadsheet of all of my brews since 2012. In the past two years, I've brewed 52 batches of beer.

I went through this spreadsheet and marked batches with green, yellow, or red. Green means the batch was good, yellow means it was okay, and red means it had significant issues. I have judges notes on some of these brews and they tend to correspond with my own critical tastings.

It is amazing what can be learned doing this.

When I look back at these batches, a few things have become apparent:

(1) I have much higher rates of mediocre or bad beer when I repitch yeast.
(2) I have noted several batches as unbalanced or where hops have a strong almost salty presence in the finished beer. These batches all had mash temps of 149 or below.
(3) I don't see any correlation to complicated mashing regimens and good batches.
(4) I don't see any correlation to complicated temperature control (beyond set-it-and-forget-it) and good batches.
(5) My BIAB batches were all terrible
(6) Wyeast 1028 produced the most good batches

Each of these points show me where to focus my time and attention.

This was a very good exercise.

 

[davekippen]

This is a great idea! I'm a data guy. Maybe I will go back through my batches and collect data in the same way. Good stuff!:rockin:

 

[Corey_SS]

Pretty interesting. Any data on what was the best hop, statistically?

 

[progmac]

Pretty interesting. Any data on what was the best hop, statistically?

I was asking myself this same question! I have all the recipes and some additional notes that I am going to go through this weekend and hopefully I'll find some more trends.

 

[bajaedition]

Great

I am a data nut

what you are finding out is how you, your equipment, and your techniques all work together and how you get best results with your system(s).

I analyze everything, but to be sure I am analyzing apples to apples I repeat the experiments with the same recipes

in order to get true data you need a base, so try the experiments with a single recipe, that way you are sure it is the experiment and not the recipe.

great work guy

 

[zarfus]

(1) I have much higher rates of mediocre or bad beer when I repitch yeast.
(2) I have noted several batches as unbalanced or where hops have a strong almost salty presence in the finished beer. These batches all had mash temps of 149 or below.
(3) I don't see any correlation to complicated mashing regimens and good batches.
(4) I don't see any correlation to complicated temperature control (beyond set-it-and-forget-it) and good batches.
(5) My BIAB batches were all terrible
(6) Wyeast 1028 produced the most good batches

I've been brewing for about 1.5 years with detailed notes as well. Here's how my data compares:
1) My best beers have been repitched yeast. Although these were also my biggest beers...
2) I have had one beer with a mash temp of 149 or below. Only thing I noticed about it is that it was my least efficient beer (probably unrelated to the temperature though).
3) Me neither
4) Me neither
5) All my AG batches have been exclusively BIAB, and they have all been noticeably better than extract batches. Looking to upgrade the AG equip soon.
6) Never used, but safale 05 is my goto with success.

Some other things I've noted over the past 1.5 years:
7) It must be coincidental, but I have never had off-flavors with my 1 plastic carboy versus my 2 glass carboys. WTF. (side note, i use carboys as secondary fermenters, never primary).
8) I have never had a good batch with a "cheap/weak" extract kit (i.e. american wheat ale, rye ale, farmhouse ale), but AG of similar recipes have all come out great.
9) I have no correlation of issues concerning leaving beer in a primary too long (some more than a month).
10) I have noticed nothing new since switching to a bigger, aluminum pot (vs old small SS kettle).
11) My efficiency is lower if I don't sparge (about 70% vs 80%). BIAB, dunk sparging.

I encourage everyone to log data!

 

[progmac]

zarfus, you bring up a lot of other areas for me to investigate!

to a few of your points:
1) on the repitched yeast thing, what I learned is that i need better sanitation surrounding my handling of yeast and probably generally. i sort of suspected this before mapping everything out and made adjustments, like getting rid of plastic fermenters, replacing some hoses, and collecting yeast from starters rather than from actual beer. i'm also going to limit yeast pitches to two or three generations. i certainly don't think repitching in itself is the problem. freshness may also factor in. i think i won't hold yeast any more than 5 or 6 weeks now.

2) On BIAB, I'm certain the problem is my implementation of it. I have drank good BIAB beers, just not mine.

6) I also have had good success with S05.

 

[JR_Brewer]

(1) I have much higher rates of mediocre or bad beer when I repitch yeast.
(2) I have noted several batches as unbalanced or where hops have a strong almost salty presence in the finished beer. These batches all had mash temps of 149 or below.
(3) I don't see any correlation to complicated mashing regimens and good batches.
(4) I don't see any correlation to complicated temperature control (beyond set-it-and-forget-it) and good batches.
(5) My BIAB batches were all terrible
(6) Wyeast 1028 produced the most good batches

Very cool, thanks for posting. I've been brewing for about the same period, and here are some of my observations on the topics you mentioned:

(1) I found the same thing. I know it's possible to repitch/wash yeast effectively, but I haven't been doing it. I now figure it's worth the extra few bucks to ensure that the time I spend brewing is worthwhile.
(2) I haven't found this. I've been very succesful with low mash temps. I wonder, is your water high in sodium or calcium content? Perhaps the more malty beers (i.e. higher mash temps) are hiding the salty flavor that's coming out with your low temp mashes.
(3) No data
(4) Not enough data to support or refute with confidence, but I believe my ability to control temps is improving my beer. (limited sample size).
(5) For AG, I only BIAB - and I think they come out pretty well.
(6) Most yeasts I've used have performed as they should. However, if you're brewing a saison with Wyeast, use the French Saison, not the Belgian Saison (use 3711 vice 3724).

Also, due to my set up, I can either do ~3 gallons of AG, or I can do a full sized brew (5-6 gallons) if I partial mash. That being said, I've learned I only like to use Dry extract. I'm finding Liquid Malt Extract is leaving the dreaded "homebrew twang." It's a flavor I'm more tuned into than most people, so I've switch over to DME when I need it.

Ok, best of luck moving forward!

 

[progmac]

Very cool, thanks for posting. I've been brewing for about the same period, and here are some of my observations on the topics you mentioned:

(2) I haven't found this. I've been very succesful with low mash temps. I wonder, is your water high in sodium or calcium content? Perhaps the more malty beers (i.e. higher mash temps) are hiding the salty flavor that's coming out with your low temp mashes.
(4) Not enough data to support or refute with confidence, but I believe my ability to control temps is improving my beer. (limited sample size).

On (2), I did have the correlation, but the issue could be something other than the low mash temps per se. Water is where I'm at right now, as well as looking at plain ol' BU/GU ratios on those batches compared with others

(4) You may be responding as such, but I was referring not to fermenting without control but to fermenting using multiple temperatures during fermentation as opposed to just setting the fridge at 64 and leaving it.

 

[RmikeVT]

Instead of "washing yeast" I follow this method, with great results:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/entries/yeast-harvesting-novel-approach.html

I've been brewing for about the same time 2 years, and have about 50 batches under my belt. I keep pretty good notes too.

Some things I've picked up on:

1) I tracked back a string of "bad brews" to an infected bucket (I needed a BJCP judge to tell me the off flavor was an infection). I analyzed all my notes and realized all the beers I marked as having off flavors came from the same bucket. Furthermore, I identified the issue to not doing a good enough job cleaning. I always sanitized everything, but looking back I was lax on cleaning. Now everything gets a Oxyclean TSP/90 and hot water soak. Problem Gone!

2) I've never made a good brew with S-04 (only two attempts), both times I think temps were too high(high 60s), which would be fine for US-05 but not the 04. I am going to give S-04 one more shot and keep temps low and see what happens. As I hate not having a go to dry english strain.

3) I consistently over attenuated based on BeerSmith mash recommendations w/ the variables being yeast and mash temp, so I increased mash temp 2 to 3 degrees above the BeerSmith recommended temp and now hit my FG's

4) Re-hydrating dry yeast reduces lag time by 12-24 hours and conditioning time by up to a week on something like a 1.050 pale ale.

5) My igloo cube swamp cooler is amazing at keeping temps regulated.

6) Knox Gelatin performs better than LHBS gelatin (L.D. Carlson), I haven't noticed any impact on hop flavor/aroma, but have noticed the beer tastes "cleaner" after a few days with gelatin.

Your mileage my vary but this is based on my system, setup and typical brewing time frames.

 

[Braufessor]

Thanks for posting. I do something similar with beers I make.... but I got some new, good ideas from what you have posted here. This is really a great, great way to hone in on key elements in your brewing process and make better beer, more consistently. Better notes, more detail is the only way to really bring some of this to light.

* one thing I have noticed is sort of simple and obvious, but until it stares you in the face, it is sometimes not evident. When I really have a beer planned out...... I have my recipe finished and printed off, I have my numbers in B'run Water, I have my salts added to my water, I have my grain crushed and ready to go - ALL THE NIGHT BEFORE. So, on Brewday, everything is set up and ready to go, and I only brew one batch instead of two........ I brew better beer. Organization makes a difference for me.

*One other thing I keep track of - just by hand on a sheet of graph paper is beers I brew, competitions I enter them in, age of beer at judging, and results.

Across the top of the graph I list the beers I brew - 1 beer in every column. Down the left, starting at the top, I list the dates by week (So This week would be Jan. 27-Feb. 2 (mon.-Sun.). So, If I brewed a beer on Monday the 27th (which I did) I put a 0 under that beer, across from the 27-2 date column. Then I fill the rest of the way down 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12.......... How many weeks old the beer is. I have comps in with the dates and circle the beers I entered and highlight the ones that placed. This helps me look back and see which beers are placing at how many weeks old and if there is a "sweet spot" where they seem to do better (or worse). It is just kind of a way of seeing all the beers, all the ages, all the comps and how they fared. Be a good way to sort of look back and identify batches that did well vs. others that did not and see if there are any correlations.

 

[pnihan]

This is all really great stuff. Progmac, what are some of the other data points that you keep track of? Are you looking at mostly temp readings, pH recordings and things of that nature, or are you also concerned with observations like grain crush and how smoothly the day went? Just looking for some insight, I'm going to start working on my spreadsheet so I'm ready for my next batch.

thx.

 

[progmac]

This is all really great stuff. Progmac, what are some of the other data points that you keep track of? Are you looking at mostly temp readings, pH recordings and things of that nature, or are you also concerned with observations like grain crush and how smoothly the day went? Just looking for some insight, I'm going to start working on my spreadsheet so I'm ready for my next batch.

thx.

Well, I was just tracking basic info (brew date, og/fg) but then i started feeding in a lot of data from my recipes.

I just polished up my tracking tool and posted a link of it in this thread:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f13/homebrew-tracker-tool-google-docs-457099/

 

[pnihan]

Great, thanks for the info. Cheers


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