Brewing a pilsner ..help with rest and secondary fermentation

[simonpt]

Currently brewing Cooper's 86 day pilsner it's fermenting at 13°c
I am wondering would you rest it for a few days (doing the diacetyl rest) at higher temperatures around 18-20)
And then do a second fermentation ?
What I'm asking is would it be ok to use a demijohn for secondary fermentation and if so do I just bung it or still fit an airlock and bring down to near zero for this stage and how long would you lager it for ? Before bottling
Thanks for any assistance

 

[mongoose33]

I always do a diacetyl rest of about 48 hours at 71 degrees (about 21.6 centigrade).

I never do a secondary "fermentation." After the rest, I'll slowly drop it down to lagering temperatures (0-5 degree C), keg it, then leave it to lager.

If you're bottle conditioning you'll have to bottle before dropping it to that 0-5 degree range.

 

[simonpt]

When you say keg what do you use ? A plastic pressures barell or a proper stainless keg ?

 

[RealRayDizzle]

Last couple Lagers I made I fermented at 54-58 deg (12-14c) for 3 weeks then pulled bucket out of cooler to room temp (70-75 deg - 21-24 C ) for 2 days after that keg (stainless ball lock) it and lager at 34 deg (1c ) for 2-3 weeks.

If you are planning on bottling I believe you would add priming sugar, bottle, then leave at room temp for 3 weeks. after that back in the cooler at serving temp for 2 weeks to clear up chill haze.

I have not bottled lager with priming sugar in a while so anyone else that has done this often please chime in and correct me if needed.

 

[simonpt]

Last couple Lagers I made I fermented at 54-58 deg (12-14c) for 3 weeks then pulled bucket out of cooler to room temp (70-75 deg - 21-24 C ) for 2 days after that keg (stainless ball lock) it and lager at 34 deg (1c ) for 2-3 weeks.

If you are planning on bottling I believe you would add priming sugar, bottle, then leave at room temp for 3 weeks. after that back in the cooler at serving temp for 2 weeks to clear up chill haze.

I have not bottled lager with priming sugar in a while so anyone else that has done this often please chime in and correct me if needed.

I don't have any stainless kegs I could ask my friend he has kegarators .. only have glass demijohns (carboys) to hand for use in the lagering phase

 

[Deadserious]

For my lagers I do a 44°F (6ish C) let that slowly raise over the course of 14 days to 55°F (13C). No need to do a diacetyl rest, since you didn’t ferment warmer at all, with getting to 12-13C you have cleaned up any if any diacetyl that could be there. Then I slowly cold crash then keg.

 

[simonpt]

For my lagers I do a 44°F (6ish C) let that slowly raise over the course of 14 days to 55°F (13C). No need to do a diacetyl rest, since you didn’t ferment warmer at all, with getting to 12-13C you have cleaned up any if any diacetyl that could be there. Then I slowly cold crash then keg.

Well it's currently brewing at 14°c and has been since pitching the yeast not alot of airlock activity yet ... May pitxht fresh yeast yet not sure

 

[Deadserious]

With a lower fermentation rate I’ve noticed a slower fermentation. But that’s the idea it aids in a fermentation with fewer risks of diacetyl prediction and esters forming. As long as you pitched a healthy starter I wouldn’t worry.

 

[simonpt]

With a lower fermentation rate I’ve noticed a slower fermentation. But that’s the idea it aids in a fermentation with fewer risks of diacetyl prediction and esters forming. As long as you pitched a healthy starter I wouldn’t worry.

Well it was pitched Wednesday evening around 6pm ..now 6pm Sunday evening and not alot of activity yet ... Really contemplating repitching with a proper lager yeast now it's down to brewing temp .. maybe the supplied yeast is just really slow at starting :s would you advise against adding a different type of yeast to the one already in ?

 

[Deadserious]

Well it was pitched Wednesday evening around 6pm ..now 6pm Sunday evening and not alot of activity yet ... Really contemplating repitching with a proper lager yeast now it's down to brewing temp .. maybe the supplied yeast is just really slow at starting :s would you advise against adding a different type of yeast to the one already in ?

How do you know it’s not fermenting? Don’t trust air lock activity. I’ve made that mistake before. Ultimately it’s your beer, personally I’d let it buck, but you could raise the temp 1-2°.

 

[simonpt]

How do you know it’s not fermenting? Don’t trust air lock activity. I’ve made that mistake before. Ultimately it’s your beer, personally I’d let it buck, but you could raise the temp 1-2°.

Well I'm brewing it in a cold cupboard didn't really have control over the temp but it seems steady at 14 with the refrigerator thermometer I have in there and the stick on ones

 

[mongoose33]

When you say keg what do you use ? A plastic pressures barell or a proper stainless keg ?

I use stainless kegs. I'm not even sure there are kegs that aren't stainless.

If you can find the right equipment and can afford it, kegging is great. I also bottle a fair amount of beer, and you can do it right from the keg after the beer is carbonated.

 

[simonpt]

I use stainless kegs. I'm not even sure there are kegs that aren't stainless.

If you can find the right equipment and can afford it, kegging is great. I also bottle a fair amount of beer, and you can do it right from the keg after the beer is carbonated.

Well I have 50 new 500ml bottles and caps and capper etc
I may invest in kegs and dispensing equipment soon or see if my friend with sell me one of his Cornelius kegs lol

 

[mongoose33]

Well I have 50 new 500ml bottles and caps and capper etc
I may invest in kegs and dispensing equipment soon or see if my friend with sell me one of his Cornelius kegs lol

I don't know your location so this may or may not be helpful to you. If you can take your time accumulating equipment, you can find really good deals on Craigslist or other online sources. The trick is knowing what things cost so you know a good deal when you see one.

<this is all information from my area in the US; YMMV>

A 5# CO2 tank will cost roughly $60 new; if you buy a used one cheap, it may need to be recertified, which will cost. I had a used 10# tank recertified and filled for $38 here, which was a good deal.

A 2-gauge regulator, new, will cost in the area of $60; you can get them from Ritebrew for about $50 (a taprite brand).

Used cornelius kegs go for about $50 for ball-lock post kegs. Pin-lock kegs go for $25-35, and there's a reason for that, most today are ball-lock kegs.

The quick disconnects to connect the gas to the keg and the liquid line out will run roughly $3-5. Tubing is circa 30-50 cents per foot.

A picnic tap (Quick disconnect, tubing, serving tap) will run from $7-12.

You may find someone selling a "kit" of these things for a pretty good deal. Here's an example:

https://madison.craigslist.org/for/d/verona-home-brewing-equipment/6805253844.html

It appears this person is selling a keg, CO2 tank, and regulator for $50. That's such a good deal I might make a move on it, as it's just down the road an hour from me. Not sure what kind of keg (pinlock or balllock) but if it were a pinlock I'd probably just replace the posts to make them balllock and replace the lid.

Anyway, if you can be patient, know what you need, and know what a good price is, you can do well.

 

[simonpt]

I don't know your location so this may or may not be helpful to you. If you can take your time accumulating equipment, you can find really good deals on Craigslist or other online sources. The trick is knowing what things cost so you know a good deal when you see one.

<this is all information from my area in the US; YMMV>

A 5# CO2 tank will cost roughly $60 new; if you buy a used one cheap, it may need to be recertified, which will cost. I had a used 10# tank recertified and filled for $38 here, which was a good deal.

A 2-gauge regulator, new, will cost in the area of $60; you can get them from Ritebrew for about $50 (a taprite brand).

Used cornelius kegs go for about $50 for ball-lock post kegs. Pin-lock kegs go for $25-35, and there's a reason for that, most today are ball-lock kegs.

The quick disconnects to connect the gas to the keg and the liquid line out will run roughly $3-5. Tubing is circa 30-50 cents per foot.

A picnic tap (Quick disconnect, tubing, serving tap) will run from $7-12.

You may find someone selling a "kit" of these things for a pretty good deal. Here's an example:

https://madison.craigslist.org/for/d/verona-home-brewing-equipment/6805253844.html

It appears this person is selling a keg, CO2 tank, and regulator for $50. That's such a good deal I might make a move on it, as it's just down the road an hour from me. Not sure what kind of keg (pinlock or balllock) but if it were a pinlock I'd probably just replace the posts to make them balllock and replace the lid.

Anyway, if you can be patient, know what you need, and know what a good price is, you can do well.

I'm In the UK Nottingham

 

[mongoose33]

I'm In the UK Nottingham

https://nottingham.craigslist.org/

I don't know if there's much there, but there are other sources, including posting on social media asking if anyone has kegs or such for sale.

 

[simonpt]

Yh there's bits about and two brewing shops close to me ..one just down the road with tons of supplies

 

[mongoose33]

Yh there's bits about and two brewing shops close to me ..one just down the road with tons of supplies

It's a lot like fishing...you don't always catch a big one, but as long as you keep casting you'll get some nibbles...and you'll land some good ones.

 

[simonpt]

It's a lot like fishing...you don't always catch a big one, but as long as you keep casting you'll get some nibbles...and you'll land some good ones.

We still taking about beer now not women ? Lol just got a deal on two plastic pressurised kegs ..£15 they are £32 each new