Bottling tips to reduce oxygen?

[adrock430]

Hi all,
Been brewing a few years and have stashed a couple older beers at this point up to 3 yrs now. Problem is, they're getting too oxidized to last that long, especially strong dark beers. I know these beers keep that long, so how do I reduce O2 when bottling?

I keg, but not these beers because I want to shelf them. Beer is racked to bottle bucket gently.

Do people bottle prime from the keg, what's your operation when doing so? I know you can bottle after carb, but I'd rather not do that.
Thanks! Adam

 

[TimmyWit]

Not sure what your current process is but one tip that comes to mind is be sure you have a clamp where your tubing connects to your auto-siphon. Without it, little oxygen bubble can creep in.

 

[adrock430]

I don't do that, will add that to process for sure

 

[Supergrump]

Here's a tip I got from Gordon Strongs Brewing Better Beer: when you bottle, let the bottles sit for a while (15 to 30 min?) with the caps resting on top, but don't seal the caps right away. The primed beer will begin to ferment and the resulting co2 will push some air out of the bottle. Try not to disturb the bottles when you get around to capping them.

I'm not sure if it actually works. I have a hard time believing there's enough co2 to force out a lot of air, but it doesn't hurt. I also find it streamlines the bottling process a bit. I fill all the bottles quickly without having to pause to cap each one as they're being filled.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

O2 absorbing caps come to mind, but their O2 absorbing effectiveness is only so good for so long. If you know you'll be storing a beer for that long maybe consider wine bottles and syn-corks.

 

[Calder]

Here's a tip I got from Gordon Strongs Brewing Better Beer: when you bottle, let the bottles sit for a while (15 to 30 min?) with the caps resting on top, but don't seal the caps right away. The primed beer will begin to ferment and the resulting co2 will push some air out of the bottle. Try not to disturb the bottles when you get around to capping them.

I'm not sure if it actually works. I have a hard time believing there's enough co2 to force out a lot of air, but it doesn't hurt. I also find it streamlines the bottling process a bit. I fill all the bottles quickly without having to pause to cap each one as they're being filled.

I do that all the time, and have many big beers that are several years old with no issues. I think the act of transferring the beer and bottling also gets some of the entrained CO2 to come out of the beer. Sometimes I find bottles frothing up while I am bottling; this is CO2 coming out of the beer, not new fermentation. I think this is what fills the airspace. I bottle, rest caps on bottles, clean up, and then use the capper.

O2 absorbing caps come to mind, but their O2 absorbing effectiveness is only so good for so long. If you know you'll be storing a beer for that long maybe consider wine bottles and syn-corks.

Standard wine bottles will break under pressure.

 

[FloppyKnockers]

Standard wine bottles will break under pressure.

Fine...Champagne bottles.

 

[MacOne]

I'm a little lost on this one. So I'm guess I'm jumping in on the thread for some education. Hope the OP doesn't mind.

In wine, the ageing process brings out different nuances to the flavour. It gives time for the full on fruit to drop down a little, tannins especially and develop into something more complex and different. Having a cork in a big red on its side allows a certain amount of flex and breathing to develop these flavours. I'm not saying it goes so slack as to allow a load of air in and oxidise it but what I am saying is that the process of slight contact over time is part of the process.

So what I don't get is that if the bottle is sealed by a cap and the brew contains CO2 and that's inside the bottle where is the oxidising coming from? Is it that over time the CO2 makes it way out of the bottle due to the seal therefore being replaced by air?

Or, is it like some wines, that it was the wrong wine to age? People don't actually like the flavours that ageing bring? The ageing temp has been too fluctuating? Lots of things really....

But as beer doesn't last in my house a month and I've had wines stored and drunk after 15 years I'm really intrigued by the ageing process and hoping to learn not hijack a thread

 

[Supergrump]

...
So what I don't get is that if the bottle is sealed by a cap and the brew contains CO2 and that's inside the bottle where is the oxidising coming from? Is it that over time the CO2 makes it way out of the bottle due to the seal therefore being replaced by air?

Or, is it like some wines, that it was the wrong wine to age? People don't actually like the flavours that ageing bring? The ageing temp has been too fluctuating? Lots of things really....

Oxidization is a result of the oxygen that's trapped in each bottle before it is sealed. Transferring beer from primary to secondary, or from carboy to bottling bucket will allow oxygen to be absorbed into the beer. It's also very challenging to remove all oxygen from the bottles before sealing, which is the topic of discussion for this post.

Some beers don't age well, for sure. Bigger, malty beers age very well and flavors evolve over time when aged under proper conditions.

back on topic, if you have some cash to burn, and kegging equipment at hand, you could invest in the Blichmann beer gun. It purges the air from the bottle with co2 before filling.

 

[adrock430]

I'm thinking I may just bottle from the keg using some contraption with low psi, maybe purge bottles first with co2, but the blichmann gun is out of the question money wise.

 

[tjpfeister]

Oxygen still gets in past the caps. Steve Dresler of Sierra Nevada has some articles out there. There is some osmosis effect that allows it over time that I do not fully understand.

That said, to avoid the initial dose of atmosphere, I offer my technique for bottle filling off a keg. Once the bottle is filled from the bottom using a modified picnic tap, I carefully bang the bottle down on a cutting board (carefully!) With cap resting in place, as the resulting foam begins to push the cap off, BAM, cap on foam.