bitter taste- review my process

[eight]

My last few beers had an unpleasant bitter taste\after-taste.
I brewed a beer today, and I wanna try to make sure this one is not too bitter.

One thing that I noticed today (unfortunately it was too late to change anything at that point) is that my northen brewer hops are ~10% AA and the recipe called for ~8% AA. When I noticed it I decided to shorten the boil time by 10 minutes, but I doubt that it made much of a difference. I also used the same bitter hops for my last brew that ended up too bitter.

The second thing I suspect is that maybe because I pour everything that's in the kettle, including the trub, into the primary fermenter- the beer gets some strong off-flavors. This I can still fix, since I'm still at the wort-cooling stage.

Would love to hear your thoughts on this

 

[Ski12568]

You can add them later in the boil, 5-15 minutes or try first wort hopping FWH. I think first wort hopping smoothed out the bitterness.

If you are using extract I'm not sure how the FHW would work. You could add hops while you heat the water and let it set around 140F, for like a half hour maybe, to replicate a FHW with all-grain.

 

[Subdivisions]

Many people, including myself, dump all the trub from the brew kettle into the fermenter. It settles to the bottom by the time fermentation is done and hasn't caused me any off flavors. There have been blind taste test experiments concerning that and it doesn't make a noticeable difference.

The higher AAs on the hops will make it a bit more bitter but it sounds like you're getting a non-hop bitterness.

Are you doing all grain? If so, maybe you've inadvertently extracted some tannins from the grain

 

[eight]

I'm doing extract brewing, but I do steep some specialty grains. Do you think anything in the steeping process can cause the bitter taste?

 

[Yooper]

I'm doing extract brewing, but I do steep some specialty grains. Do you think anything in the steeping process can cause the bitter taste?

No.

If it's a harsh bitterness, it's almost certainly water related. My guess that it's tap water with a lot of bicarbonate? That would make a big difference in the harsh flavor and bitterness in the finished beer, without any other changes.

 

[madscientist451]

What is the temp of your steeping water and what grains are you steeping? Using water from a softener or distilled or reverse osmosis water. Do you know your water PH?

 

[eight]

Well, I did move apartments around the time the bitter flavors appeared...
And I do use tap water, but I don't know about the bicarbonate levels. Is there an easy way to check this or to negate its effects?

 

[uncleleon]

Don't squeeze the bag, don't go above 165 degrees, don't go over a ph of 6, and don't take any wort under 4 degrees brix.

Lingering bitterness is a problem many of us have had. Try lowering bitter addition 10%, try to add gypsum, try different things and keep drinking (tasting)!

 

[eight]

What is the temp of your steeping water and what grains are you steeping? Using water from a softener or distilled or reverse osmosis water. Do you know your water PH?

I try to keep the temp between 65-72 Celsius, the grains are the specialty malt specified in the recipe. I use tap water and I don't know the ph.

 

[madscientist451]

Going out on a limb and saying your ph is high. But its just a guess.
Can you get some PH test strips and check it?

http://www.brewinternational.com/ph-test-strip-4-6-6-2-beer/?gclid=CLLV2q__gMQCFVQ2gQodGqYAHg

 

[Yooper]

Well, I did move apartments around the time the bitter flavors appeared...
And I do use tap water, but I don't know about the bicarbonate levels. Is there an easy way to check this or to negate its effects?

The easy way to check this is to brew a batch with RO (reverse osmosis) water from the big 'water machines' at the grocery stores or Wal-Mart, or distilled water (more expensive). If the flavor goes away, you know it's your tap water.

 

[eight]

The easy way to check this is to brew a batch with RO (reverse osmosis) water from the big 'water machines' at the grocery stores or Wal-Mart, or distilled water (more expensive). If the flavor goes away, you know it's your tap water.

Haven't seen any RO machines around these parts...
Would bottled mineral water with PH 6.8 work? It's more acidic than distilled water and cheaper, so it's a double win, right?

 

[Yooper]

Haven't seen any RO machines around these parts...
Would bottled mineral water with PH 6.8 work? It's more acidic than distilled water and cheaper, so it's a double win, right?

No, definitely not. The reason is that 'mineral' water has minerals added, which mean that it would have a flavor effect. You want 'blank' water.

 

[eight]

Hmm... how about if I filter it with Brita?

 

[Yooper]

Hmm... how about if I filter it with Brita?

Brita removes contaminates, but not bicarbonate, sulfate, calcium, etc.

For an example- my tap water tastes awesome. It's so good they bottle it as 'spring water' at a city bottling plant near us.

But, it is very high in bicarbonate and makes great stouts but not anything else.

If you want to use your tap water, that's fine, but it may really limit you to beers that taste ok with it.

You could send it away for a test, and for about $26 you can get the results you'd need- but still you may have to dilute with RO or distilled water to get the results you want in the final flavor of the beer. Or maybe not. But a Brita filter won't reduce the alkalinity. You may need to add something to your water/wort. But without knowing where you are starting, it's impossible to guess what the problem is.

Making one batch with distilled or RO water would tell you if your problem is water, or process related.

 

[eight]

It's hard for me to get RO\distilled water here.
But, according to this: ( http://www.brewersfriend.com/2009/03/14/all-grain-water-chemistry-brewing-information/ ) the mineral levels in my mineral water are just fine.

I'll copy the label, so you can tell me what you think:
Ca++ 80
Mg++ 16
SO4-- 18
Na+ 5
Cl- 170
pH 6.8

 

[TheHappyHopper]

It's hard for me to get RO\distilled water here.
But, according to this: ( http://www.brewersfriend.com/2009/03/14/all-grain-water-chemistry-brewing-information/ ) the mineral levels in my mineral water are just fine.

I'll copy the label, so you can tell me what you think:
Ca++ 80
Mg++ 16
SO4-- 18
Na+ 5
Cl- 170
pH 6.8

I have just started reading up on water chemistry since I have noticed the same harsh/bitter tastes that you mention in your original post.

From what I understand (Yooper, please correct me if I'm wrong), it will also depend on the style of beer you are brewing. Darker beers seem to be more forgiving when it comes to higher mineral content - if you are trying to brew a lighter beer, like a pilsner, that mineral profile you listed would be way too high. Those mineral values are in the general, "safe to brew beer with" range, but depending on the beer style you are going for, they may impart some unexpected off-flavors.

That's what I am thinking my issue is - my last two beers were very light and as such, they ended up with an unexpected bitterness that I think was due to the mineral content/alkalinity of my city water.

Brewer's Friend has this Brewing Water Chemistry Calculator on their website, you can plug in your tap water or your mineral water into that to see what you come up with (I'm not sure how to convert that given pH value to alkalinity so you can input it into the calculator)

 

[Yooper]

It's hard for me to get RO\distilled water here.
But, according to this: ( http://www.brewersfriend.com/2009/03/14/all-grain-water-chemistry-brewing-information/ ) the mineral levels in my mineral water are just fine.

I'll copy the label, so you can tell me what you think:
Ca++ 80
Mg++ 16
SO4-- 18
Na+ 5
Cl- 170
pH 6.8

WAY too much chloride! You want to stay under 100 ppm in all cases, and preferably lower in many cases. You can get a 'minerally' flavor with that much chloride, and an off flavor in the final beer.