Better Bottle advice needed please

[Pole]

I'm going to make the jump to brewing sours shortly, but I need to order a few Better Bottles first. I could use some advice on which size(s) I should get. I usually do 5g batches, kegged, for my clean beers, so I will probably stick to the same size for sours.

Are sours traditionally racked off the yeast after the primary fermentation is done for the long term aging? If so, does it make sense to get a 6g BB for primary and a 5g for secondary (or two 3g BBs to be able to split batches)?

Any advice on how to build my sour fermenter pool would be greatly appreciated!

 

[dantheman13]

The answer to racking off of the yeast depends no if you are going to do a solera or not. If you don't solera, leaving it in primary is fine. The Brettanomyces will clean up the compounds produced by the Saccharomyces autolysis. However, if you solera, the constant feeding of the Brett can interfere with that.

That all said, I prefer 6 gallon fermenters, particularly if I am solering. First you get more beer, and if you are doing a solera you can pull a little more out.

 

[LesIsMore]

I'm in a similar position and have been debating this. One thing to consider is if you'll be racking on top of fruit into a secondary. A 5 gallon might not cut it in that case. Of course, you would always have the option of bottling some without fruit and adding the rest on top of the fruit.

 

[JayDubWill]

I have three 6-gallon better bottles and love them. I don't know why your really debating this, 6-gallon is the way to go. The price difference is what $5-$10? I hardly need a blow off tube and have the flexibility to also do 6 gallon wine kits. Now I wish I did have a couple of the three gallon ones for mead and such, but I don't really see the point of the 5-gallon bottles.

 

[Pole]

I have three 6-gallon better bottles and love them. I don't know why your really debating this, 6-gallon is the way to go. The price difference is what $5-$10? I hardly need a blow off tube and have the flexibility to also do 6 gallon wine kits. Now I wish I did have a couple of the three gallon ones for mead and such, but I don't really see the point of the 5-gallon bottles.

Excess headspace if racking to secondary was necessary was the only reason I was debating the 5g. Price is not a concern in this particular decision.

Dan, I wasn't considering a solera at this point, but I wouldn't rule it out as a possibility down the road. Sounds like 6g is the way to go though.

 

[JayDubWill]

Excess headspace if racking to secondary was necessary was the only reason I was debating the 5g. Price is not a concern in this particular decision.

Dan, I wasn't considering a solera at this point, but I wouldn't rule it out as a possibility down the road. Sounds like 6g is the way to go though.

I understand your point about headspace but can honestly say i've been using nothing but 6-gallon Better Bottles for primary and secondary for over 2 years without any issues. I like flexibility in my equipment and if I need to use all 3 of my carboys for primary fermentation I know I can do that.

One thing to consider though is if you plan on bulk aging your beers for extended periods of time. Better Bottles, just like anything plastic, are oxygen permeable. Over time your beer will oxidize. I don't know how much oxygen exposure is needed to cause oxidation but according to the BB website they permeate 1.1ml/day. The website does say this rate is on the low side for beneficial micro-oxygenation, but I believe that pertains more to wine than beer. Just a WAG on my part but I would be comfortable aging for up to six months in a BB, but any longer and I might consider glass or bulk aging in a corney keg.

 

[Pole]

I understand your point about headspace but can honestly say i've been using nothing but 6-gallon Better Bottles for primary and secondary for over 2 years without any issues. I like flexibility in my equipment and if I need to use all 3 of my carboys for primary fermentation I know I can do that.

One thing to consider though is if you plan on bulk aging your beers for extended periods of time. Better Bottles, just like anything plastic, are oxygen permeable. Over time your beer will oxidize. I don't know how much oxygen exposure is needed to cause oxidation but according to the BB website they permeate 1.1ml/day. The website does say this rate is on the low side for beneficial micro-oxygenation, but I believe that pertains more to wine than beer. Just a WAG on my part but I would be comfortable aging for up to six months in a BB, but any longer and I might consider glass or bulk aging in a corney keg.

Gotcha, thanks for the feedback. I'm all for the flexibility with the 6g.

Have you experienced oxidation with longer aging in the BBs? I ask only because I believe Mike Tonsmeire uses them regularly for some longer projects. Looking at the notes from his lambic attempt, it seems he had it in a BB for ~16 months without any oxidation issues.

 

[passedpawn]

BB are fine for sours. I've done about 10.

 

[JayDubWill]

Have you experienced oxidation with longer aging in the BBs? I ask only because I believe Mike Tonsmeire uses them regularly for some longer projects. Looking at the notes from his lambic attempt, it seems he had it in a BB for ~16 months without any oxidation issues.

No, i've never gone longer than 3 months for beer and six for an apple wine. I think I racked the apple wine 4 or 5 times in those six months and I havn't noticed any off flavors that might be attributed to oxidation. I know temperature and temperature cycling affects the oxidation rate, so if you can control the environment you can significantly reduce the affects. Here is a great article but honestly I worry more about sanitation and other things that have much larger and immediate impact on beer than oxidation.

 

[Pole]

No, i've never gone longer than 3 months for beer and six for an apple wine. I think I racked the apple wine 4 or 5 times in those six months and I havn't noticed any off flavors that might be attributed to oxidation. I know temperature and temperature cycling affects the oxidation rate, so if you can control the environment you can significantly reduce the affects. Here is a great article but honestly I worry more about sanitation and other things that have much larger and immediate impact on beer than oxidation.

Cool, I'll take a look at the article. Thanks!

I have a dedicated temp controlled chest freezer for primary fermentation, and the basement is in the upper 60s year-round, so I think I'm OK with temp control throughout the process.