Berliner Weiss - how long to age?

[krebs119]

I bought NB's Kinderweiss kit: http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/kinderweisse-extract-kit.html

Along with the matching Wyeast Berliner Weiss yeast. I plan on brewing it as the directions indicate, and possibly adding a some acidulated malt to it. My question is, how long will this take until it's done fermenting/souring?

NB's site says 6 weeks. Some places I've read say "bottle it as soon as the fermentation is done" which should be short since it's a small beer. I've also read some places saying "let it age 6 months +".

I'm fine in any case. One of my kegs in my kegerator is just for sour beers and currently has a Lambic on tap. This keg is dedicated to sours, so I intend on adding the Berliner to it when it's done - I just wanted to know when to plan on brewing it since it might be a while before I kick the keg.

thanks in advance...

 

[Calder]

I just brewed my first one, and plan on opening the first bottle tonight. I started it 5 weeks ago.

I let it sour with lacto at 90 F for a week (no yeast), then pitched a large starter of yeast. 2 weeks later it was in the bottle. It was quite sour when the yeast was pitched.

From what I have read (no experience), they take a while to sour if you add the yeast and the lacto together. I think those yeast packs have about 10% yeast; this allows the lacto to get started quick, but the yeast is up and working within a couple of days, and once there is some alcohol, in it, the lacto slows down.

Lacto also likes high temperatures for optimum growth, somewhere around 100F. If it gets too cold (low to mid 60s), Lacto will stop working.

Obviously since I have only done 1, and added the lacto separately, I don't know how the mix works. I would suggest you do not make a starter (you will just raise the yeast population rather than the lacto and get less souring), and straight pitch the mix into wort at around 100 F and keep it at that temperature for a couple of days. This will let the lacto work before the yeast builds up sufficient population, producing alcohol that will slow the lacto down. Obviously, for this beer, good sanitation procedures are essential.

 

[monkeybox]

I'm pondering the same question. I brewed a no boil berlinner Weiss about 6 weeks ago and pitched the wyeast blend. I've left it undisturbed so far. For some reason I have 3 months in my head, but I'm not sure where I got that.

 

[elproducto]

My BW that scored a 43 was really good after about 3 months in the bottle.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

Care to share the recipe? I want to try and organize a club brew and do a sour...preferably a good Berliner.

 

[krebs119]

El Producto - what method did you use to brew? What yeast and at what temp?

I don't exactly have a way to keep the BW in the 90/100 degree range. It will likely be in the high 60s/low 70s until I turn my heaters on in the house, then I can get it around 80 for a while.

I don't plan on making a starter for this, and I do keep everything clean an sanitary. I have a dedicated carboy, keg, racking equip, etc just for sours.

 

[krebs119]

Bumpity bump bump....

I don't think I ever got a solid answer on this. Anyone have other thoughts on the length?

 

[RiverRat280]

At least 3 months but doesn't need more then 6 months....generally but you really need to go by your taste buds.

 

[Calder]

Bumpity bump bump....

I don't think I ever got a solid answer on this. Anyone have other thoughts on the length?

It depends how you sour it. If you add the lacto after the beer is brewed, it could take a couple of years. If you sour it before you ferment the wort, it will be ready as soon as it is clear and carb'd. If you add both sacc and lacto at the same time, it will be somewhere in between. It really depends on how quickly and how well your Lacto sours the wort, and how sour you want it.

 

[krebs119]

Well, as I said above, I'm using the Wyeast mix - so both Lacto and Sacc at the same time. Someone had mentioned fermenting around 90 deg, but I don't have that option. It will likely be in the 60s at best.... I'm wondering if anyone has any real experience with results under these conditions...

 

[bertsbeer]

http://***********/stories/recipein...r-ale/209-berliner-weisse-napoleons-champagne

 

[cardinalsfan]

Well, as I said above, I'm using the Wyeast mix - so both Lacto and Sacc at the same time. Someone had mentioned fermenting around 90 deg, but I don't have that option. It will likely be in the 60s at best.... I'm wondering if anyone has any real experience with results under these conditions...

Mine has been going for almost 2 months. Pitched lacto for a week before the 3191 blend. No pellicle and has yet to drop clear. Planning on taking a gravity reading and tasting tonight. I want to keg it soon so I can carb it and have it ready for a homebrew fest on Nov 2nd.

I'll chime in tonight after I've tasted it and let you know where it's at.

 

[cardinalsfan]

Update!! It's down to 1.002 as of last night. Sample wasn't super tart but what tartness was there lingered well. I'm really bad at tasting warm, uncarbonated samples. I hope to keg this soon and start on my Gose.

 

[krebs119]

Great! Thanks for the update! Is there anything you feel you wish you.had done differently?

 

[monkeybox]

Cardinals fan, can you post your recipe and brewing process?

 

[cardinalsfan]

Great! Thanks for the update! Is there anything you feel you wish you.had done differently?

I only wish I had heated the beer while the lacto was working. That, or a sour mash to get more tartness out of it.

Cardinals fan, can you post your recipe and brewing process?

1.045 OG - 1.002 FG
6 IBU, 5.4% ABV, 4° SRM

Ingredients
0.40 lb Acid Malt
0.33 lb CaraHell
2.75 lb Pilsener (German)
1.25 lb Wheat (German)

Hops
1.00 oz Spalt (U.S.) Pellet, 30 mins

Yeast
Lacto and Wyeast 3191 BW Blend

This is a 3 gallon recipe.

Made a lacto starter with apple juice and let it sit in the hot garage for a week. Brewed the recipe above, mashed at 152* BiaB style with a mashout. Pitched the lacto and let it sit for 1 week then pitched the 3191 with no starter. Fermented around 65* and raised temps as I went. Finally moved to the beer closet at around 2 weeks after pitching the 3191 and let it sit at 75*. I'll be kegging it this weekend.

I think the tartness will come through once this is carbed and the carbonic acid will help. I'm really excited about the Gose i'm pitching onto this yeast cake since the 3191 tends to get more sour each time you use it and I'll be doing a sour mash with this one.

 

[krebs119]

Any thoughts on why you didn't get a pellicle?

thanks again for the info!

 

[Rob_B]

Sometimes pellicles form and sometimes they don't. It's the bugs way of protecting themselves from oxygen. I have a lacto starter in the garage that an awesome pellicle formed in right away but after the fermentation started getting vigorous it dissapeared. It still hasn't popped back up but that's because the co2 purged any oxygen that was in the flask.

In another Berliner Weiss I have I racked after primary and added some brett to it. This one went from no pellicle to super sweet pellicle in a matter of days. Pellicle watching beats the pants off airlock gawking any day!

 

[cardinalsfan]

yup, what Rob_B said. The bung and airlock on my better bottle was pretty tight so I doubt much oxygen got in.

 

[lunshbox]

I've had my BW going at it for about a month with lactose and each. It is slightly tart and down to 1.001. I am going to let it go for another couple of months and see how it ages out.