BeerSmith 3: Here it comes. Thoughts?

[MultumInParvo]

Flipped from the original to BS 3.0 about a month ago.

Not sure I needed anything that was added in the last decade, but figured I used that sucker so much that I might as well pay the guy that made it!

So far I like it. A little cleaner than the original.

 

[ba-brewer]

Nothing conclusive. Usually gets off track and no solution found or most popular seems to be "just use brunwater".... After researching further I've seen a few responses saying Brad disagrees that there's anything wrong with it to further muddy the waters lol. Cheers

well at least the issue sort of known.

When I started building water I used beersmith, brewers friend and brunwater and I thought they all came pretty close. It is just an estimate so I did not get too hung up on it. Not sure why I standardized on brunwater but it gives reasonable results so I am just going to stick with it. I like the donation version of brunwater as you can create a database of your brews, there maybe a few other things too but dont recall them.

 

[Radboud]

Holy moly, didn't know about BS3 being released or even being in the works. I don't like subscription plans so I'd go for the single-fee option but I need to be able to use it on 3 computers (home desktop, work laptop and brewery laptop) and I'd like for the water building tool to be rock solid which at this moment it isn't according to the posts above. So I'll hold on to my $34.95 and stay with BS2 for a while longer.

 

[mscroggi]

I am relatively new to BS.. but it appears you have the option of copying recipes to the cloud, but if you just create your recipe in the cloud arena to begin with, it is parked and managed there. It appears to be a flexibility to have recipes locally, in the cloud, or both.

I just preordered the continuious yearly thing. I don't need a cloud thing, especially if it means i have to "copy" recipes and stuff to the clould every time. I use chrome remote desktop on the laptop in my brewery, and phone (when I'm in the lhbs) to remote into my desktop which runs Beersmith, and all stuff is also synced on gdrive for recipe backups.

 

[murphyslaw]

I am relatively new to BS.. but it appears you have the option of copying recipes to the cloud, but if you just create your recipe in the cloud arena to begin with, it is parked and managed there. It appears to be a flexibility to have recipes locally, in the cloud, or both.

That's why I do. Everything is created and saved in the Cloud folder. No copying or moving around.

 

[mscroggi]

Why do I have to re-purchase this app to use it on my Android tablet? If I setup recipes etc on my computer and go into the brewhouse to do the brew, why can't I use the mobile app to walk through the execution of my recipe?

That doesn't seem right.

 

[kh54s10]

Why do I have to re-purchase this app to use it on my Android tablet? If I setup recipes etc on my computer and go into the brewhouse to do the brew, why can't I use the mobile app to walk through the execution of my recipe?

That doesn't seem right.

The PC version and the mobile app have always been separate items. I use the pc version on my laptop, then move the laptop to the brew area on brew day.

 

[murphyslaw]

What About BeerSmith Mobile?

For BeerSmith mobile, purchase and licensing will still be a separate purchase via the major app stores (iTunes, Google Play and Amazon). While I would prefer to bundle these with the desktop software, the terms and restrictions set by the major mobile stores don’t allow this. I do intend to phase out the “lite” versions of the apps in favor of the full BeerSmith 3 mobile app, as very few users are choosing the lite version.
http://beersmith.com/beersmith-3-licensing-explained/

 

[alestateyall]

My BeerSmith 2 Mobile iOS upgraded to BeerSmith 3 Mobile last week. That is free. You don’t have to buy again.

 

[mpmccann]

Mine upgraded also on my phone and tablet. I noticed my BeerSmith 2 app was missing from my home page and when I looked on my app page the new BeerSmith 3 icon was there. So I just had to drag it back onto my home page again.

 

[mscroggi]

My BeerSmith 2 Mobile iOS upgraded to BeerSmith 3 Mobile last week. That is free. You don’t have to buy again.

I think the question is why you would have to purchase it for mobile if you already had purchased the app for a PC.

 

[kh54s10]

I think the question is why you would have to purchase it for mobile if you already had purchased the app for a PC.

The app and the PC program are separate things. If you think paying for one should get you the other you would have to discuss that with Brad. If you want to use the App on your phone while on lunch break at work , you will need the app.

 

[Murphys_Law]

I originally downloaded the Lite (free) version of BS Mobile and then did the in-app upgrade but the icon still says "Lite" and won't upgrade. I did a quick check and it looks like this is a known issue but I didn't see how to resolve. Anyone deal with this?

 

[day_trippr]

I'd contact Brad Smith directly for any installation/upgrade issues.

wrt BS2 Mobile automagically updating to BS3 - that happened to me a couple of weeks ago.
Appreciated it as I use it on brew days and it's nice not to have to wonder if there are incompatibilities between my desktop BS3 recipes being pushed to BS2 mobile...

Cheers!

 

[day_trippr]

So today was my first brew day using BS3 Mobile - and it was not good.
The BS3 brew day/timer function crashed every time it came up to an "event" - like a "time to add this", etc.
Most crashes allowed a re-start that would pick up from the prior event - which isn't all that helpful - but the last one happened at the beginning of the sub-180°F whirlpooling and would not allow a re-start. So I used my watch timer for that.

I literally had zero crashes with BS2 on the same Samsung Tab S2 over 20-something brew days, so I'm not a happy user right now.
If nobody here has run into this and "cured" it I reckon I'm gonna have to Go Fish on Brad's site

Cheers!

[edit] Ok, the good news is I am not alone...
http://www.beersmith.com/forum/index.php?topic=19253.0

 

[North_of_60]

I did my last brew using the BS3 timer on an iPhone 8. I used the timer for mash and boil and there were no problems. There are no alarms when an event occurs but there were none on the BS2 either, at least not one that I can hear. I think that is a bit useless.

 

[Murphys_Law]

I did my last brew using the BS3 timer on an iPhone 8. I used the timer for mash and boil and there were no problems. There are no alarms when an event occurs but there were none on the BS2 either, at least not one that I can hear. I think that is a bit useless.

Are you saying you don't get notifications when it's time to add a hop addition, for example? If that's true then check your phone notification settings. I get notified (alarm) when the timed step is due.

Apologies if I misunderstood.

 

[North_of_60]

Are you saying you don't get notifications when it's time to add a hop addition, for example? If that's true then check your phone notification settings. I get notified (alarm) when the timed step is due.

Apologies if I misunderstood.

That is exactly what I meant. I did as you said and now I get notifications. Thank you!

 

[day_trippr]

BS2 always issued audible and persistent Notifications on all of my devices.

Further developments: I checked all the permissions for BS3 and they're all enabled, but no Notifications ever appear.
I have BS3 mobile on my Samsung GS8+ as well so I made a BS3 recipe with all of the mash and boil events spaced just a few minutes apart, and the same failure modes are present there - no Notifications from timer events, then crash-a-mundo.

On a hunch, I uninstalled BS3 from my tablet and installed a full, fresh copy from Play, but all of the problems remain. So it isn't an upgrade problem. It's bad code.
Next I'm going to uninstall BS3 again and restore a backed up BS2 and hope it'll read my recipes created on BS3 on my peecee.
If that works I'll have something usable until BS3 mobile is fixed...

Cheers!

[edit] "Success", I guess. BS2 mobile loads my BS3 timer test recipe and is executing it perfectly - Notifications and all.

Can't believe someone could mess up a working app so badly that it's unusable and set it loose in the wild...

 

[day_trippr]

BS3 3.0.7 for Android is out, but the brew day timers are still broken...

 

[Murphys_Law]

BS3 3.0.7 for Android is out, but the brew day timers are still broken...

That’s a shame. What finally nudged me from Brewers Friend over to BS was the mobile timer.

 

[day_trippr]

If you run the desktop version the only reason to even have the mobile version is the brew day timer...

 

[Kosch]

I bought BS2 a good few years ago, my first using brew software. Thought it was pretty great though the GUI and workflow was pretty horrible. Bought the mobile app specifically for the timers. I took a break from brewing for the last 2 years, just got back into it a few weeks ago and saw the new 3.x version available. I was pretty excited, hoping for new GUI/workflows, but was disappointed to see it the same.

I don't need the new features and I especially don't like the push for subscription-based (I know standalone is available, but still). Also, as many others have mentioned, the BS3 mobile app crashes at the WORST possible time and also doesn't seem to notify if it isn't in foreground, which makes it pretty pointless.

I'm going to get a trial of Beer Tools Pro and see how that goes, though at this point I'm starting to like the idea of simplifying and using a spreadsheet with known equations. I think I'd rather it be simpler, be "mine", and deal with more possibility of numbers being off than juggle software. Which of course isn't to say they aren't all great additions to homebrewers toolbelts, just happens to be the way I'm headed.

 

[kh54s10]

Took a look at Beer Tools Pro. There is very little information on the website. The few screenshots posted don't look significantly different than BS. The price is a little cheaper but you used to be able to find it downloadable on other sites for less than Beersmith.com. Since it appears the only way to see how it works is to get the trial version, it gets a pass from me.

I can't imagine a spreadsheet that does what BS can do. I don't have the programming/spreadsheet knowledge where I could make my own and even come close...

Some of the new stuff, I'll probably never use. Some of the other things make it easier. I haven't yet found anything that I like better. Most, I find too simplified.

 

[murphyslaw]

I thought beer tools was defunct.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Well, after my laptop completely died with nothing recoverable off the hard drive (all past recipes and brew info lost) I decided to buy BS3. I've just used it for the first time and really like the water tab within the recipe and the pH section within the mash tab, meaning that salts and acid can be added under those tabs which automatically updates the recipe in the design tab. This is much more user friendly than in BS2. I'm really annoyed though that the water tab doesn't list the total finished water profile! This is a really simple thing that should be in there. You get a display of the mash water profile and sparge water profile, but have to use the separate water profile tool to find your finished profile. This wouldn't matter if you split your salt additions between the mash and sparge/boil in an equal ratio, but I don't - I typically add one or the other of CaCl2 or CaSO4 to the mash and the other to the boil (I'm lazy and that saves some extra weighing). Anyone using Bicarb soda would also not be adding evenly to the mash and boil.

As far as pH goes, it looks to me to give similar predictions to BrewersFriend, which I find asks for slightly too much acid compared with BrunWater. It's probably good enough though.

 

[Amadeo38]

So I looked through as much of this thread as I could and searched for other threads before asking this, but...

Can someone fill me in on why people use Bru’n Water for salt calculations instead of what’s built into BS 2.0? I remember reading somewhere that Brad uses some sort of “not widely accepted” method of calculating salt additions, but isn’t it all just based on Molar weights? Why am I not using the integrated salt additions inside Beer Smith 2.0?

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Can someone fill me in on why people use Bru’n Water for salt calculations instead of what’s built into BS 2.0?

BS seems to over estimate the acid needed to get to your intended pH. Brun water (for me, and many others) is more accurate.

 

[Amadeo38]

So assuming your mash pH will be fine, all other salt additions calculated within Beersmith 2.0 seem to be accurate?

 

[Gnomebrewer]

AFAIK they are. As I posted in this thread previously, there is an issue with BS3 where the total water profile isn't shown (it only gives mash water and sparge water separately). I'm not sure about BS2.

 

[murphyslaw]

Can someone fill me in on why people use Bru’n Water for salt calculations instead of what’s built into BS 2.0? I remember reading somewhere that Brad uses some sort of “not widely accepted” method of calculating salt additions, but isn’t it all just based on Molar weights? Why am I not using the integrated salt additions inside Beer Smith 2.0?

If I remember right, they just weren't integrated very well. Wasn't it a separate tool, apart from the recipe? I think that's much better in BS3. But there is still the problem that the mash pH tool overestimates the amount of acid needed. For that reason people use Bru'n Water for pH. Since Bru'n Water needs the mineral additions for the pH calcs, I would guess that people still use Bru'n Water for mineral additions.

 

[murphyslaw]

AFAIK they are. As I posted in this thread previously, there is an issue with BS3 where the total water profile isn't shown (it only gives mash water and sparge water separately). I'm not sure about BS2.

I'll check when I get home but I thought it does show the total water profile. I know I have some issues on my macbook where I can't quite see the whole screen unless I toggle the full screen/window views.

 

[Amadeo38]

Since Bru'n Water needs the mineral additions for the pH calcs, I would guess that people still use Bru'n Water for mineral additions.

This makes sense and is probably why it’s most parsimonious to just use Bru’n Water...thanks!

 

[Gnomebrewer]

I'll check when I get home but I thought it does show the total water profile. I know I have some issues on my macbook where I can't quite see the whole screen unless I toggle the full screen/window views.

I would very much appreciate if you'd have a look. I sent the question to beersmith, and had a prompt reply that it was there. It definitely isn't there on my screen.

 

[murphyslaw]

I would very much appreciate if you'd have a look. I sent the question to beersmith, and had a prompt reply that it was there. It definitely isn't there on my screen.

Here are two screen shots. One is the window that opens when you hit match a target profile. The adjusted profile is at the bottom, by my cursor.

The other is the main water tab. Like you say, it shows the sparse and mash profiles separately. Normally, at least for me, they are identical to the total profile.

 

[murphyslaw]

Here are two screen shots. One is the window that opens when you hit match a target profile. The adjusted profile is at the bottom, by my cursor.

The other is the main water tab. Like you say, it shows the sparse and mash profiles separately. Normally, at least for me, they are identical to the total profile.

Attached

 

[Gnomebrewer]

The other is the main water tab. Like you say, it shows the sparse and mash profiles separately. Normally, at least for me, they are identical to the total profile.

Yep, so no total water profile. I get that for most brewers the mash and sparge profiles will be the same.
For me, the mash and sparge water are different. This is because I'm lazy - I typically add either CaCl2 or Gypsum to the mash, and the other to the sparge. It means weighing out two lots of salts instead of four. Anyone who adds all of the salts to the mash will also find it annoying that there is no total water profile.

 

[murphyslaw]

Yep, so no total water profile. I get that for most brewers the mash and sparge profiles will be the same.
For me, the mash and sparge water are different. This is because I'm lazy - I typically add either CaCl2 or Gypsum to the mash, and the other to the sparge. It means weighing out two lots of salts instead of four. Anyone who adds all of the salts to the mash will also find it annoying that there is no total water profile.

The total water profile is shown on the other screenshot.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

The total water profile is shown on the other screenshot.

Only if you're targeting a particular profile, which I don't. I normally have an idea roughly what I want to add. For a lager, it might be 2g of CaCl2 and 2g of Gypsum, but I want the check what level of Calcium that gets me to; BS3 doesn't tell me that.

 

[murphyslaw]

Only if you're targeting a particular profile, which I don't. I normally have an idea roughly what I want to add. For a lager, it might be 2g of CaCl2 and 2g of Gypsum, but I want the check what level of Calcium that gets me to; BS3 doesn't tell me that.

Oh. Well, I guess you're out of luck. I think that's really a backwards approach relative to how most people use minerals.

You could set it up as a full volume mash and write down the mash water profile those additions give you. Then just use that as your target profile he way the program is intended.