Been Uping my Game and would appreciate some advice

[therealrsr]

I got fed up with inconsistent results so a couple months ago started taking steps to address. Could use some advice on next contemplated steps.

Previously I was doing all grain back patio brews with 10 and 15 gallon bayou brewing pots on a banjo burner. Pots were good value but the false bottoms left too much space. Usually 2 stage fermentation, primary bucket to glass Carboy. 3 tap converted fridge. Made several good beers, a handful of great beers, many drinkable ones, and a handful of pitches.

First step was a stand. I built a 2 tier using the 10 g. pot for HLT on banjo, Added an 11 g. team cooler with false bottom for MT, and 15 g. on 2nd banjo for boil with a whirlpool port. Added a chugger pump, 20 plate chiller replacing immersion and a SS HERMS coil to the HLT. All SS camlock fittings with high temp silicone.

Second Step was BeerSmith for pc and tablet/phone using their cloud to share across all. I find it so much better than piecing together from a handful of programs/apps. Formulate at the desk and use 7 inch tablet at stand. (If you are thinking about it, go Nike and JUST DO IT)

Third Step was Thermapen. I love to cook so I had a pretty good digital already but not fast. Switching to the cooler tun, even with HERMS, I wanted to get in and out fast. Now I get 4-5 readings in different spots in 30 seconds. Got a good $ through King Arthur Flower fyi.

Fourth Step was water chemistry. I'll never look at my tap water the same again. The difference between summer and winter water in my lines is significant and probably the source of several "what the hell happened" with a proven recipe. Now adapting when I can and building RO water when I can't.

Fifth step was a ferm chamber made from a chest freezer and Johnson Controller. Just kegged the first 64 degree held throughout Galaxy Smash and I could have drank a full pint without carbonation.

Sorry long explanation but here comes the open ended question that needed some background. "What else should I be doing to control process and assure consistent results?"

Next are my thoughts but very open to new ones as well.

Refractometer? $20 tube or digital? I am terrible about remembering to take readings cause I just haven't cared that much, I can guess the approximate ABV on most beers after a couple drinks.

Wort aeration? I splash a lot and haven't had many issues over the years, but I read so many pro's or near pro's opining on the importance.

Sparge Arm? I currently recirculate the mash for 15-20 and then sparge onto a plate sitting on top of the grain to diffuse.

Hop Rocket? I love hop bombs, have made some great ones without it and I see mixed reviews of the device's contribution. I am as much interested in using it for a bed of cones as a filter when appropriate.

Thanks

 

[gatsby174]

I would say a good grain mill so your grain crush is reliable.

 

[dsaavedra]

Hmmm well my beers got a hell of a lot better after I built an insulated cooler MLT, built water from RO, and controlled ferm temps in a minifridge with Johnson controller. But it sounds like you have these bases covered. Sounds to me like you are at the point where stepping up your game = buying things that are more conveniences than necessities - buy a kick ass chiller if you don't have one, a grain mill would be handy so you can buy grain in bulk. In the same vein, a vacuum sealer for buying hops in bulk would be a good buy.

 

[JayDubWill]

+1 for the grain mill. I would also say, since you have a pretty nice sounding system, maybe add some brewing books, and add to your knowledge. This would probably help with the inconsistencies between batches.

 

[McKnuckle]

Obviously this post doesn't reveal your entire thought process, but be critical: do you need more STUFF or do you need better technique? Or would better recipes and understanding of ingredients be timely?

What do you actually NEED?

With sanitation, predictable/repeatable process, temp control at all stages, and water chemistry, you're free to excel as a brewer. If you aren't meeting your own expectations at this point, I would bet that more knowledge and discipline in brewing technique would get you farther than another piece of kit.

 

[bbrim]

Starters. Proper pitching rate is often what separates the "homebrew" taste from beers that taste pro. You've got the temp under control, go all the way on the yeast front. Aeration is also very helpful, along the same lines here. Happy yeast=tasty beer.

 

[therealrsr]

Thanks to everyone for taking the time. I rarely post here but use regularly for questions. I have a mill and sealer and have been buying bulk for a few years now, but great suggestions.
The process and education comments rang through so thanks for that as well.
I am definately not looking to buy just for the sake of buying. The rocket and refract are perhaps spending more than needed, but they are problems I have identified.
My limited library is charlie's, Palmers online and jamil's classic styles. Any good suggestions there?

 

[McKnuckle]

I don't think I've ever made a mistake during brewing that resulted in bad beer. Different beer - sure; I've missed gravity and volume estimates many times; I've mashed too hot or too cool; I've slightly messed up my hop additions. But nothing that produced bad beer. The bad beer mistakes have all occurred after flame-out, particularly during fermentation, and have all been either yeast health, temperature, or sanitation related.

I pitched old and questionable slurry. I didn't make a starter. I made a starter with unboiled wort. I didn't sanitize a spoon and caused an infection. I fermented too warm (over and over again - DUH). I packaged too early and over-carbed the bottles. I transferred too much trub.

Most times I knew in my heart of hearts that I was messing up, but soldiered on regardless, believing it wouldn't matter. Each time I was wrong, slapped my forehead, and vowed not to do "that" again. This is how we learn. I'm nearing 50 batches now, and I get very good beer most of the time but still not all of the time! I still fight my laziness to follow strict protocol every single time.

So my advice would be to look keenly at your inconsistent results, explain your dumpers, and pinpoint the things you know you are doing sub-optimally. You're not revealing any of that in your OP... Identify the problems and then try to solve them, don't just grasp at straws.

 

[therealrsr]

So my advice would be to look keenly at your inconsistent results, explain your dumpers, and pinpoint the things you know you are doing sub-optimally. You're not revealing any of that in your OP... Identify the problems and then try to solve them, don't just grasp at straws.

That's some worthwhile wisdom. Trying to go back and think of the problems will be hard but many of your examples toggled memories, I have been brewing on an off for a long time. I have been much better about making batch notes with Beersmith so I will definitely use your advice going forward.

Starting with the notion that my goal here is consistency. Now I'm thinking of a recent brew, an imperial IPA, that I tapped last night that didn't need anything else, a fresh and clean tasting Amarillo/Cascade hop bomb. I now plan to try and reproduce it at first opportunity as a way to evaluate improved controls or lingering problems. Boring? yes but probably very worthwhile. You guys got me to think about this differently and I thank you for that.

 

[cilestiok]

If you're looking to spend money on any given thing to advance your brewing... I would invest in the brewing elements book series. I read them thoroughly and took a ton of notes and I feel like my consciousness towards the processes and ingredients enhanced exponentially.

 

[JayDubWill]

As far as books go, it sounds like you have the classics covered. If your interested in a more scientific approach check out he Brewing Elements series (appropriately named, Yeast, Water, Hops, and Malt). The other books I use are specific to style. If your in to Belgian's check out Brew Like a Monk. It's a little dated (2005), but I think it's still the go to book on those styles. I recently picked up Modern Homebrew Recipes by Gordon Strong, and he's really opened my eyes to using different malts and hops to achieve different flavor profiles. I regularly use the book to compare my ideas for a beer to what he does.

 

[therealrsr]

Started reading the Hops, interesting and extremely detailed background information so far. I started there because reviews of the series highlight it as the best, but curious if you have gotten through them all JayDubWill and your impressions. Thanks for the recommendation.

 

[kh54s10]

It sounds like you have most of the hardware well covered.

I like my refractometer so that I can see quickly what is happening during my brew day.
I bought one of the inexpensive air pump aeration systems. I guess it makes a difference though I have not had any bad batches by just shaking.
For books, get the print version of How to Brew. It is up dated. I also like Designing Great Beers by Ray Daniels.

As stated look at your processes and try to determine what differences occurred between the good ones and the bad ones.

 

[Roadie]

I would point you toward stir plate starters and O2 instead of shaking.

 

[dude_brewery]

Starters. Proper pitching rate is often what separates the "homebrew" taste from beers that taste pro. You've got the temp under control, go all the way on the yeast front. Aeration is also very helpful, along the same lines here. Happy yeast=tasty beer.

I would point you toward stir plate starters and O2 instead of shaking.

I would third the stir plate as something to consider. Pitching a healthy starter will greatly shorten fermentation lag time (reduced chance of infection/contamination), and help to ensure a clean, complete fermentation every time.

That, and then just be meticulous about recording your original gravity, final gravity, mash temp, time, sparge temp, etc... Changes in process can greatly affect the beer's character.

If you decide to get yourself a stir plate, check out http://bit.ly/craftbrewgoods. I build these plates using a cigar box as the enclosure, and back them with a lifetime warranty.

 

[BlueHouseBrew]

It sounds like you have a lot of batches under your belt and have a process that is dialed-in. I'd suggest obtaining the tools that would allow you to better understand what's going on in the mash, because if your beers are coming out good now, and you have your fermentation conditions under control, controlling the mash is probably the next best option. (This assumes that you are already propagating yeast appropriately (via a starter) prior to pitching as others have suggested.) A refractometer and pH meter (in combination with your thermometer) will give you the info you need to tweak your already good recipes to make them even better (malt-wise at least).

 

[Brewsncrabs]

Randy Mosher's Radical Brewing is a good read. Just make sure to go to his website if you try his recipes. Some have incorrect numbers in them and corrections are shown on the website. Great book with lots of great insight. His English Brown is in my fermenter right now.

 

[Mirilis]

looks to me like you have the equipment that is the most important: kettles, mash tuns, and most importantly fermentation temp control.

If you looking to expand on equipment id get an oxy wand over the refractometer (as long as you can still hydro your beers). Some inconsistent results could be from hoppping a beer that was supposed to be 1.065, but instead was 1.050 and things like that.

As far as technique, my best advice is to keep good records. Records to me are the key to consistency. I would say that if your having some so so beers, and some dumpers then I would start there.. (unless the dumpers were infected).

I would also suggest reading the thread on not using a secondary. Personally I just do a 4 week primary for most beers and then straight to the keg and that works for me. Once you get your technique down and build confidence in it then your golden..

 

[therealrsr]

Those are really cool and look well built DudeBrew, hope it takes off for you. I would be tempted but I have 2 old comps and several hard drives just taking space in the basement. No doubt mine will look nowhere near as nice.

I'll admit I am rarely a starter guy. 70% of the time I am just rehydrating packets before pitching. When I run a weizen and want the banna/clove, a Belgian funk or a huge beer would be examples where I do a starter. Probably be more inclined if I decide to build that stir plate. I get the lag every so often so good advice.

Secondary, I have read the debate enough times to know that you are probably right. I just got a thing about long times on plastic, even food safe. It's dumb but hard to overcome.

I've heard of Radical Brewing will have to add that to the future read list.

As always, thanks to everyone for taking the time to answer.

 

[Beernik]

I'd skip the refractometer. I have one. I bought it mainly because I went through a really bad phase of breaking hydros.

I was listening to a podcast with Denny Conn and he had a brilliant idea: pull your sample and pour it in a cocktail shaker. Set the cocktail shaker in an ice bath. Slide a temp probe into one of the holes in the top of the cocktail shaker. Sample cools to a good hydro test temperature fairly quickly.

The thing I found that improved my beers the most was simplifying recipes. Think about what you want to highlight about the beer (hops, malt flavor, yeast flavor, etc.) you are brewing. Do it with as few ingredients as possible.

 

[gbx]

You didn't mention your serving setup but that has a huge effect on beer quality. If you aren't pouring clear properly carbonated beer, deal with that first.

In terms of books, Brewing Better Beer by Gordon Strong is written specifically for someone who has "been uping their game and would appreciate some advice". A lot of people were turned off by his writing style and perceived attitude but if you can get past that there is a lot of very good ideas in it.

In general, unless you are collecting home brewing books skip any book written before the internet era. Their isn't a lot of good information contained in them that isn't common knowledge today. (maybe you want to learn how to manually calculate SRM or IBUs and are interested in stats about winning 1997 NHC recipes?)

 

[joshesmusica]

As mentioned, if you're having dumpers, especially with that equip setup, it's highly unlikely those dumpers are coming from before pitching the yeast. If you don't have the fermentation parameters nailed down pat, there's not really much point refining everything pre-pitch and post-fermentation.
1) Proper fermentation control. This means controlling the temp inside the fermentor, not the ambient air.
2) Pitching the proper amount of vital, viable yeast. 95% of off-flavors in your beer are coming from your yeast. If you're using dry yeast, this means rehydrating per the instructions from the manufacturer. If you're using liquid yeast, this means doing a starter to ensure that you have enough viable (alive, not dead), vital (healthy and vibrant) yeast.

To be honest, you kind of put the horse before the cart when upgrading all your equipment. If you want to brew really good beer consistently (which obviously you do), it's not necessarily the equipment that will help you do this. It's your processes. By not even measuring the gravity, this shows that you have no idea how consistent you are on everything pre-fermentation. This is number 2 on the list after ensuring that the fermentation is consistent. You have to make sure you're hitting your volumes, and gravity (pre-boil, post-boil, FG) at the very least in order to become consistent. The volume and gravity are extremely important because what happens if your efficiency all of a sudden jumps from 70 to 85%, but yet you're pitching enough yeast for 70%. Now you are under-pitching.

Lastly will be post-fermentation. How are you racking? Are you being clean and sanitary? Are you using the right force carbonation charts? If you're keg priming or bottle priming, are you accurately measuring the priming sugar? If you're ending up with 1.9 volumes of co2 in an IPA, it's gonna be a bit lackluster. If you're ending up with 2.6 in an ESB, it's going to have less malty flavor in the forefront.

Lastly, be very critical of every step. Pay attention to detail, or if you're not a detail-oriented person, take very specific notes for later. Measure everything. Calculate everything. Don't cut corners. You will see a lot of people advocate for all kinds of lazy methods on here. While those may work out sometimes, nobody is reporting making bad beer by making sure to not cut corners.

 

[augiedoggy]

Curious at why you thing the larger space under the false bottom makes a difference? I have 3 gallons of space under my bayou false bottom which doesnt seem to seem to effect anything? I added it as dead space in my beersmith so the mash volume was adjusted and I have always been well over 70% efficiency... usually around 80% actually..

the biggest improvements I had were from temp control on fermenters, using ro water and adding minerals/adjusting ph/ and using a conical fermenter which really made a difference for me since I either waited too long to transfer to a secondary or didnt at all. prior to this.

 

[dude_brewery]

Those are really cool and look well built DudeBrew, hope it takes off for you. I would be tempted but I have 2 old comps and several hard drives just taking space in the basement. No doubt mine will look nowhere near as nice.

I'll admit I am rarely a starter guy. 70% of the time I am just rehydrating packets before pitching. When I run a weizen and want the banna/clove, a Belgian funk or a huge beer would be examples where I do a starter. Probably be more inclined if I decide to build that stir plate. I get the lag every so often so good advice.

Secondary, I have read the debate enough times to know that you are probably right. I just got a thing about long times on plastic, even food safe. It's dumb but hard to overcome.

I've heard of Radical Brewing will have to add that to the future read list.

As always, thanks to everyone for taking the time to answer.

Thanks! Feel free to reach out if you come across any issues while building your own stir plate. I'd be happy to help you troubleshoot a bit.

And yes, having a stir plate definitely makes one more inclined to create starters. It's more effective than the periodic shaking method, and is fully automated after you get the starter cooled and the yeast in it. Just set it, and forget about it til brew day.

 

[therealrsr]

1)

Wow that was a lot of thought, thanks! My pitched batches came from the patio setup, been smoother sailing with the stand, etc. Biggest improvements I recognize so far are from the HERMS, chillplate speed vs immersion, whirlpool and top one is the ferm keezer.

I am lazy/forgetful/buzzed off homebrew depending on the day when it comes to readings. The refractometer was thought to be a way to address that but after all the feedback here ranking became a low priority. Maybe rethink that now for the precision you preach which makes sense to me. I will give myself credit that this laziness doesn't creep to other areas often.

I default to overpitch if anything, but your point "how would I know" is well taken.

I do tape the probe to the outside of carboy with an insulation covering, should add thermowells to my bungs for precision but certainly better. I've had past summer beers, even in coldest basement spot, get to 78-79 degrees at peak which never came out good to great.

BeerSmith is definitely helping with the notes so far, just need to keep it up.

 

[therealrsr]

Curious at why you thing the larger space under the false bottom makes a difference? I have 3 gallons of space under my bayou false bottom which doesnt seem to seem to effect anything?
...
using a conical fermenter

The ratio required to cover the bed was significantly reducing my sparge volume and at the time I was just batch sparging so leaving fermentable sugars in the tun. It shouldn't be as much of an issue now doing the fly, but using the team cooler vs. kettle for tun and 2 (vs 3) banjos in stand was what I settled on.

A conical would be sweet, I love the ss brewtech 7 gallon for under $400. But with that comes a collar for the keezer and working in a very confined space.

Thanks!

 

[therealrsr]

You didn't mention your serving setup but that has a huge effect on beer quality.

In terms of books, Brewing Better Beer by Gordon Strong

The tap system works well for me. I do not have a regulator off each manifold port so do take the average vol, but try to keep somewhat similar beers in terms of vol at a time.

I'll put Gordon's on the list to check out as well. Love the free sample function of Google play books when available.