Angry Wolf IIPA Critique

[modobrew]

This is my first attempt at creating my own recipe. I have typically made clones but have decided that I want to venture out and see what I can do. I'm a total hophead and tend to love the Pliny the Elders, Headytoppers, Surly Abrasives, and DFH 90 Mins of the brew world. Let me know what you guys think. I'm definitely looking for opinions on how to make the recipe better. :rockin:

Recipe: Angry Wolf IIPA
Style: Imperial IPA
Type: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 13.61 gal
Post Boil Volume: 12.48 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 11.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.081 SG
Estimated Color: 12.0 SRM
Estimated IBU: 121.9 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 79.3 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
25 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 75.8 %
5 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain 2 15.2 %
1 lbs Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 3 3.0 %
2 lbs Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 4 6.1 %
3.75 oz Warrior [15.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 73.1 IBUs
2.50 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 39.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 1.0 min Hop 9 0.6 IBUs
1.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 8 9.2 IBUs
2.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 11 0.0 IBUs
2.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
4.0 pkg Nottingham Yeast (Lallemand #-) [23.66 m Yeast 10 -
2.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining 7 -

Mash for 60 mins at 152F. Batch Sparge.

Thanks all!

 

[ajodom10]

Sound delicious, cant wait to try it. When will you be brewing this one?

By the way... Love the name!

 

[phenry]

I'd say that's way too much crystal malt for my liking. Try subbing some of it out for Munich or Vienna if you want a little more depth to your grainbill. Also, I'm pretty sure I've heard Citra gives a nice cat piss flavor when used for bittering. I'd put the Citra for late additions and just up the Warrior @ 60. Also, probably look at adding some more late additions. You'll be amazed at how many hops you can throw at a batch and still be left wanting more when everything's said and done.

 

[heywatchthis]

I would agree with too much crystal. The beers you've listed would all have less than a pound per 5 gallons of crystal malt total. You have the equivalent of >2 lbs/ 5gallons. While I personally think this would be a good beer, it likely won't be what you're looking for. I would reduce the amount of 40L to 1.5 lbs (or less if you can) and keep the carapils.

Also, I don't think that 4 oz of dry hops and 2.5 oz of finishing hops will get you the hop forward flavor/aroma you're looking for. The Pliny clone has 3.5 oz of finishing hops and ~4 oz of dry hops in 5 gallons...if you're looking for that kind of beer, multiply your finishing and dry hop amount by a factor of ~3.

 

[ACESFULL]

I would agree with too much crystal. The beers you've listed would all have less than a pound per 5 gallons of crystal malt total. You have the equivalent of >2 lbs/ 5gallons. While I personally think this would be a good beer, it likely won't be what you're looking for. I would reduce the amount of 40L to 1.5 lbs (or less if you can) and keep the carapils.

Agree with the above... Except for the carapils... Why not just mash @ 154 would get the same mouth feel and reduce your bill a little more. Oh yeah and use MOAR HOPS!!

 

[djfriesen]

Disregard. Didn't read the recipe very well.

 

[modobrew]

Thanks for all the help guys. I'm going to update my recipe and post the changes. I'm still trying to learn everything so your help is much appreciated. My plan will be to reduce the crystal and replace with Vienna. I'll then remove the citra bittering and replace with warrior. I'll add the citra later, upping all hop qty. Thanks again!

 

[modobrew]

Ok guys, I have modified the recipe based on your input. Let me know if you think this is looking like it is heading in the right direction. I switched out the Crystal 40L for Crystal 60L, just to try to bump up the color a little.

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 13.61 gal
Post Boil Volume: 12.48 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 11.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.082 SG
Estimated Color: 8.6 SRM
Estimated IBU: 180.5 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 79.3 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
25 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 75.8 %
1 lbs 8.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 60L (60.0 SRM) Grain 3 4.5 %
1 lbs Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 4 3.0 %
2 lbs Corn Sugar (Dextrose) (0.0 SRM) Sugar 5 6.1 %
7.00 oz Warrior [15.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 136.1 IBUs
3.25 oz Citra [12.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 9 18.3 IBUs
3.00 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 1.0 min Hop 10 1.7 IBUs
4.00 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 8 24.4 IBUs
4.50 oz Centennial [10.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 12 0.0 IBUs
4.50 oz Simcoe [13.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 13 0.0 IBUs
4.0 pkg Nottingham Yeast (Lallemand #-) [23.66 m Yeast 11 -
2.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins) Fining 7 -
3 lbs 8.0 oz Vienna Malt (3.5 SRM) Grain 2 10.6 %

Any other recommended modifications?

 

[modobrew]

Does the above look improved over my original? thanks for the input.

 

[Lennie]

8% of fermentables as crystal is a good amount, I think you'll like that.

Why Nottingham yeast? I'd think you might be better off with US05. With the citrusy hop schedule you aren't going to notice the fruity character of the yeast, and the British yeasts have a tendency to drop early and attenuate poorly. With a big beer I've found the worse result is too sweet rather than too dry. Just a thought.

I've used those hops in various combinations and they are very nice.

 

[modobrew]

Thanks Lennie, I've yet to use US05, so maybe this beer would be a good chance to use it. Does it tend to have good attenuation?

 

[Lennie]

Yes it'll give you a good 5% better than Nottingham, it takes a little longer to clear but that is why it attenuates better.

 

[Dirty]

I agree with Lennie. S-05 is a machine and you will like how the hops will shine through.

Check this out by Nathan Smith for help on building IIPA.

http://destroy.net/brewing/IIPA.pdf


Rock Chalk

Chris

 

[modobrew]

Thanks dirty. I will definitely read through that. I think you guys have convinced me to use US05. That might be why my surly abrasive clone didnt finish out. Was shooting for a FG of 1.013 but only hit 1.020. Thanks again for the assistance.

 

[Lennie]

If you do use British ale yeasts, you want to let them ferment in the mid-60's for a couple of days then move it to a warmer place so it doesn't cool off and drop out quite as fast. I also rouse the yeast daily, and you still end up with a pretty modest attenuation. Its great for a bitter, but not so muh for an IPA or IIPA.

Good luck, I have an IIPA and and IPA both going with US05 right now. The IPA is all Pacific Jade hops and the IIPA is done with the Falconers Flight blend.

 

[Dirty]

If you want that "English Ale" flavor Stone use WLP007 for their house yeast. It will attenuate dryer than other English Ales like Notty.

Rock Chalk

Chris

 

[seatbelt123]

Modobrew - Looks like a solid recipe. I'll chip in as an advocate for S-05. It's a work horse, cheap and always on standby. I just sprinkle it directly onto my ales.

Keep us posted on how this turns out. If its great I may have to make a Blue Devil version.

BTW - Durhamite here. Which LHBS do you use? Check out Bull City homebrew. Great inventory and the prices are better than on line (and ABM off of 440). Can't say enough good stuff about them.

 

[modobrew]

Thanks for all the help guys. I learn more and more everyday from this site. US05 it shall be. Looks like it should do exactly what I want.

As for the Notty in my last ale, I must have let the temps drop too soon, resulting in the yeast falling out much earlier than I wanted. Note to self, be sure to move to warmer location after a couple of days. Got it.

Seatbelt123 - I think you should keep it an Angry Wolf version! HA! We have a game with you guys coming up here soon. As for the LHBS, I typically use ABM as its only about 10-15 mins from my house. I might have to check out Bull City though. Might be more of drive, but if the prices are better, it might be worth it. I'll definitely let you know how it turns out, hell, I might even be able to bottle you a couple to get some feedback. It's currently second in line to be brewed, right behind a vanilla bourbon porter.

 

[modobrew]

Just curious if my hop schedule/amounts look ok to you guys? Does this look like something you'd want to try? Thanks again everyone!

 

[Keffa]

Okay, here's my biggest qualms with your recipe:

Why use Citra for a bittering addition? I know it's higher alpha and would add a good bit of IBU to the beer, but it's FAR too good as an aroma and flavor hop to waste it for bittering. Seriously, I'd sub them out for Columbus or another high AA bittering hop and utilize the Citra later on.

Second, you don't have enough late additions, IMO. 1.5oz Simcoe at 10 minutes and 1oz of Centennial at 1 minute isn't going to be very noticeable against the bitterness from your 60 minute additions. I'd do something like 1.5oz of both at 10 minutes and 1oz of both at KO and steep them for 10 minutes, then do your dry hop.

Also, as some of the others have posted, it's too much crystal malt. I'd do something like 5 lbs of Vienna instead of the Crystal, and keep the Carapils for the head retention.



Otherwise looks like a solid beer.

 

[modobrew]

Thanks keffa for the feedback. I think you might have missed my updated recipe a little further down on the first page. I think the updated version might have taken care of some of your suggestions. Do you mind looking it over and letting me know what you think about it? Thanks again!

 

[Keffa]

Looks pretty solid. Guess I didn't see the update


The Crystal is still kind of high, but this is homebrewing, after all. Your recipe, do what you like.

 

[modobrew]

Haha, no problem Keffa. I figured you must have missed it. Thanks for the feedback. I'll take a look at the Crystal, maybe I'll take it down a notch. I'm just about ready to brew this one. I have over a lb of Citra and Simcoe at home just waiting to be put in something.

 

[modobrew]

A year later we finally got around to brewing this one. Our efficiency was off, only hit 1.072 instead of the 1.082. A little bummed about that, but should still be a nice hoppy IIPA. It's currently fermenting so I'll get back when she's kegged and ready to go. It smelled delicious though and the sample we pulled tasted pretty damn good. Cheers!

 

[modobrew]

Sampled this after fermentation finished out. Hot damn! Might be one of the best we've brewed and that was before dry hopping! Can't wait to get this one in my keezer. If anyone brews this, let me know what you think.