All grain re-mashing

[Thirdthorpe]

I was reading in a book I snagged from my lhbs about mashing techniques and they mentioned something I haven't heard anyone talk about before. The concept was called re-mashing and basically instead of sparging you do a secondary stir and mash with the same grains after draining your first mash. Has anyone had any experience with this? If so, what kind of efficiency did you get?

 

[Thedutchtouch]

is the wort from the secondary mash added to the wort from the first? if so i think most people call this batch sparging. if it's used to make a completely different beer, it's referred to as partigyle. efficiency will vary based on individual practices, mash temps/times/etc but from my reading, batch sparging seems to be just as good as continuous/fly sparging, and is easier to pull off.

 

[erikpete18]

Depending on how you do it, there's probably not a lot of "mashing" still going on in the second set. You should have had full conversion after the first mash, and would only get a little more enzyme activity. I'd agree that it sounds similar to a partigyle, although I didn't think a partigyle necessarily meant more mashing, just the separate boiling of the first runnings and the sparge. It might be referring to "capping" a mash. I've done partigyles before where I'll throw a few more pounds of grain in after the first runnings and mash for another hour while the first boils, and I'd always heard that called capping. You can either do that to get a few more gravity points, or to add some separate specialty grains.

 

[fartinmartin]

I do it a lot, my main reason is limited equipment for the boil, so I do two beers from one lot of grain, beer A from the first running a, beer B from subsequent runnings. You can always adjust the SG of the second with adjuncts where you want to.
I think this is partygyle ?

 

[Thirdthorpe]

What I was actually referring to was a passage from the mashing section in "Beer Captured". I'll just copy the exact passage;
"If you do not have an adequate sparge arm, use a method called re-mashing, which was implemented by some of the first brewers, and still used by some breweries today. After the mash water has drained close the spigot, fill up the mash tun with 168 degree F (75.6 degree C) water, gently stir the mash and let it sit for 15 minutes. Then slowly drain the mash water off. Repeat this process until the gravity of the runoff is 1.008 or the pH rises above 5.8."
I was wondering if anyone has had any experience with this if it is in fact separate from batch sparging.

 

[BrodieBruce]

That sounds like batch sparging to me

 

[MarcusKillion]

sounds like a batch sparge to me . I read that batch sparging is a little less efficient than fly sparge.

 

[Piratwolf]

That sounds like batch sparging to me

This. It's exactly what I do.

 

[Thirdthorpe]

On average how many times do you need to rerinse the grains before you've gotten to the OG?

 

[craigger64]

yep! that's batch sparging

 

[texcan2000]

Except with batch sparging you add your sparge water to bring the grain bed up close to 170F. 185F water gets me to 168F on my system. Stir like crazy, stir some more. Once the mash stops circling, Vorlaf and drain. No need to wait 15 minutes. Denny has done a lot of experimenting with this.

 

[Onkel_Udo]

Except with batch sparging you add your sparge water to bring the grain bed up close to 170F. 185F water gets me to 168F on my system. Stir like crazy, stir some more. Once the mash stops circling, Vorlaf and drain. No need to wait 15 minutes. Denny has done a lot of experimenting with this.

The 170 F is not universally agreed on and some even use room temp water nowadays...still a batch sparge.

To the OP, the number of times you have to batch sparge to hit your numbers depends on you equipment. For me it is a single batch on all but the biggest beers...even to capture 13 gallons for an 11 gallon batch. I play with my mash water volume to make sure I do not have to do two batch sparges but those trying to do 5 gallon batches from a 5 gallon cooler MLT, will likely do two batch sparges for even moderate gravity beers.

 

[Thirdthorpe]

Right on. Its good to get that cleared up. The only sparging experience I have is with fly sparging but batxh sparging sounds way quicker. I wonder if stepping up the grain bill by about 10% would compensate for any lost efficiency.

 

[Onkel_Udo]

Right on. Its good to get that cleared up. The only sparging experience I have is with fly sparging but batxh sparging sounds way quicker. I wonder if stepping up the grain bill by about 10% would compensate for any lost efficiency.

Pick a recipe where it does not matter is the OG is a little low (APA/IPA/Dry Stout) and use the same grain bill. Check your efficiency after. Preferably make a recipe you know well. Add some DME to bring it up if it is low.

 

[MarcusKillion]

About this 15 minute wait to mash . If you batch sparge twice or even once perhaps would that not take about 15 minutes to do ? i.e. pour in water stir good , vorlaugh and then drain must take that long or longer as it takes a while to drain . Maybe that is where the 15 minutes mash comes into play.

 

[Bobby_M]

Right, it's batch sparging. It can also be called English Sparge or Partigyle in some cases depending on what you do with the various runnings. Where I have heard of the term remashing is where you take the runoff from a first mash and stir in a new fresh grist to get a super high gravity wort out of it.

 

[texcan2000]

The 170 F is not universally agreed on and some even use room temp water nowadays...still a batch sparge. To the OP, the number of times you have to batch sparge to hit your numbers depends on you equipment. For me it is a single batch on all but the biggest beers...even to capture 13 gallons for an 11 gallon batch. I play with my mash water volume to make sure I do not have to do two batch sparges but those trying to do 5 gallon batches from a 5 gallon cooler MLT, will likely do two batch sparges for even moderate gravity beers.

Temperature doesn't matter, thanks! I researched the topic and found Kai's work. One question, could I then add hotter water to the grain bed to raise my temperature above 170F to reach a quicker boil? Or would that cause tannin extraction?

 

[JLem]

Temperature doesn't matter, thanks! I researched the topic and found Kai's work. One question, could I then add hotter water to the grain bed to raise my temperature above 170F to reach a quicker boil? Or would that cause tannin extraction?

Only if the mash pH is too high (above 6?). If your mash pH is in the 5.2-5.6 range, you can boil the mash and still not extract tannins (which is why decoction mashing works).

 

[texcan2000]

Thank you JLem, that is great to know!