Advice on MLF for first batch of wine. HELP!

[amcclai7]

I have been brewing for many years but have always enjoyed wine (especially dry reds) and decided to take the plunge.

I bought two kits at different price points, varietals, and concentration levels.

https://shop.brewcraftusa.com/original-alljuice-zinfandel-23l-mms17
- A full volume (No dilution required) Zinfandel which is supposed to be really good and is fairly pricy.

https://shop.brewcraftusa.com/vinifera-noble-malbec-10l-vn111
- A more economically priced, concentrated (10L topped to 23L) Malbec that is supposed to create good wine but is much more of an entry level product.

Already being a brewer I had all the necessary equipment and sanitation measures in place.

It is 3 weeks in and both wines are completely done and are right around .995

I took a taste of both and was shocked at just how good the Zin was. While lacking in complexity, it was jammy, fruity as could be, and had very little harshness to it at all.
The Malbec was a bit more harsh as it had a slight bitterness to it and was much more acidic. I did not take a pH on either but I have a good meter and can easily do that soon.

Here is where I am perplexed. I have read many articles about MLF and have found that there is a lot of conflicting info. I have seen (all from what appeared to be reputable sources)...

-Almost all reds should undergo MLF
-If you dont do MLF it might happen in the bottle
-Don't do MLF with a kit wine
-MLF can make your wine more susceptable to spoilage because it raises the pH
-You have to add lots of nutrients for MLF
-Only add nutrients for MLF if it stalls. Otherwise there will be too much food leftover for potential spoilage bacteria.

I really love a silky oily texture in all wines, but especially reds. Also, coming from a fermentation background I don't like to ever do anything half-ass and skip steps but I also don't want to risk having to dump 12, or even 6, gallons.

Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

P.S. The one thing I did see in common is that you want to start it ASAP after fermentation. Have I already waited too long, or at the very least should I stir the lees back into the wine before starting?

 

[Yooper]

The key here is that it's a kit wine- MLF isn't done on kit wines because all of the acid adjustments are done, and generally the must is sulfited as well.

 

[jgmillr1]

Hopefully this will help explain on the "why's" for the guidelines you mention.

-Almost all reds should undergo MLF

Generally true for dry, oaked, red wine styles. Some will partially put a wine through MLF or only do it to a percentage of the barrels. MLF softens the wine by converting malic to lactic acid but also destroys a lot of fruit aroma esters in the process.

-If you dont do MLF it might happen in the bottle

This is possible if the bacteria were present and sulfites insufficiently present. Proper sulfite additions accommodating the pH will prevent this. Plenty of wines are not put through MLF and do not have issues.

-Don't do MLF with a kit wine

As @Yooper mentioned above, it is not typically done on kit wines due to acid adjustment. This is because the added acid may contain citric acid (which MLF will turn into a butter bomb) and non-organic malic acid (which the MLF bacteria can only metabolize the L-malic, not the D-malic form).

-MLF can make your wine more susceptible to spoilage because it raises the pH

Yes, pH usually rises as malic is converted to lactic. You'll need to watch this and (1) plan ahead by adding tartaric acid, (2) sulfite appropriately for the pH, or (3) choose to not fully to MLF. The wine will only spoil if it is under-sulfited and/or exposed to oxygen. The higher pH means you must be on it more intensively.

-You have to add lots of nutrients for MLF.
-Only add nutrients for MLF if it stalls. Otherwise there will be too much food leftover for potential spoilage bacteria.

There are usually sufficient nutrients remaining in the new wine, especially if MLF is done immediately after fermentation and the wine is still loaded with yeast. I've never added nutrients for MLF and have successfully put thousands of gallons through it. MLF bacteria do not consume ammonia-based nutrients like yeast and it is those which are potential risks for spoilage later.

 

[amcclai7]

Thanks for all the helpful replies. So the advice would be, its a kit wine and even on the high-end one don't do the MLF? That makes sense to me, especially with the Zin because it is very fruit forward (which I like) and was most likely grown in an extremely warm climate which means malic acid concentration would be low anyway. The Malbec worries me a bit because it is quite acidic but I guess the risk is too high considering it was more of an entry level kit anyway.

While I have your attention I do have two brief questions:

Are there types of red grape must that you can buy that have not been treated in this way? Ones that would allow the winemaker more freedom to do things like MLF?

Now that fermentation is done should I go ahead and rack into secondary? I still have oak to add and I suppose degassing might be on the list as well, but I'll take it one step at a time.

 

[Yooper]

While I have your attention I do have two brief questions:

Are there types of red grape must that you can buy that have not been treated in this way? Ones that would allow the winemaker more freedom to do things like MLF?

Now that fermentation is done should I go ahead and rack into secondary? I still have oak to add and I suppose degassing might be on the list as well, but I'll take it one step at a time.

Definitely- you can buy pressed juice (great for whites) and grapes by the lug at winemaking shops when they are ripe. The thing is with reds- you want to ferment a bit on the skins and then press so it's not easy to buy must that will give you exactly what you want. I bought a frozen bucket of grapes that worked great, but I did press them afterwards with my cider/wine press. I also bought a bucket of juice for sauvignon blanc, since I don't need to ferment on the skins.

For kits, follow the instructions. The higher end kits make a really nice wine, and you can add some sulfites when finished and bulk age a bit for a nice wine that can age a bit. The cheaper kits are non-complex and still ok (like a $5 bottle of wine) but nothing that you'd want to age or to serve to discerning guests.

 

[jgmillr1]

The Malbec worries me a bit because it is quite acidic but I guess the risk is too high considering it was more of an entry level kit anyway.

The wine is still very young and will smooth out as the yeast settles. You could always blend in a little of your Zin later should you find it to be unbalanced.

Are there types of red grape must that you can buy that have not been treated in this way? Ones that would allow the winemaker more freedom to do things like MLF?

I've heard of people using Brehm to get frozen must. Haven't used it myself though. You can order untreated juice year-round from Walkers. You can also work with your LHBS to buy pails of juice that are untreated. The Chilean juices are now being delivered. Your LHBS may also work with a local vineyard to offer grapes in the fall, depending on where you are.

Now that fermentation is done should I go ahead and rack into secondary? I still have oak to add and I suppose degassing might be on the list as well, but I'll take it one step at a time

If the primary is sealed nicely, I'd give it another week or two undisturbed to settle before racking. It will degas on its own over time and when you rack it. It will be in your secondary longer, so that is where you can use oak.

 

[DoctorCAD]

At 3 weeks, you are just getting warmed up. Take care of the wine for 6 months and taste it again before bottling. It will have changed a lot. Drink at 12 to 18 months later and it will still be improving.

 

[amcclai7]

Thanks for all the replies!

I will definitely look into getting some more untreated juice/must or even raw grapes this fall for my next batches. Thanks for all the suggestions. Also, yes, I am not expecting a red wine, or any highly alcoholic fermented beverage, To taste great after 3 weeks (although a mix of about 80% Zin and 20% Malbec from the small samples I took actually knocked my socks off...considering the lack of age, you read my mind jgmillr1). I will certainly wait for them to come around and follow all the necessary steps in the meantime.

Finally, while people are being generous, The oak that came with the kit was in two forms, chips and another package that looked somewhat like sawdust. I have always had much better luck with my beers using cubes or staves. The chips always gave me a raw wood, Popsicle stick flavor that I didn't care for. However, I know that wine generally is aged in new oak, while if beer goes into a barrel it generally goes into one that has already been used.

Any thoughts on this? Use what I am more familiar with, or stick to the kit instructions exactly?

 

[jgmillr1]

Finally, while people are being generous, The oak that came with the kit was in two forms, chips and another package that looked somewhat like sawdust. I have always had much better luck with my beers using cubes or staves. The chips always gave me a raw wood, Popsicle stick flavor that I didn't care for.

The sawdust (granular) oak form is perfect to use in the primary. It doesn't appreciably add oak flavor but helps with reducing vegetal notes in the wine and can aid in color stability by providing tannin. When used in the secondary, low quality or untoasted chips lead to flavors described as "pencil shavings". Toasted american or french chips are better and cubes, spheres, staves, spirals even better. There is no harm in substituting better quality oak additives than the kit provides.