Advice for Brewer Applicant

[BrotherBock]

Hey All,

Hoping those that work in the industry can give me some advice.

I may have a meeting very soon with a few people about a brewing position at a new start up. They are in the process of building right now. I don't know how big their system is.

I have 5 years homebrewing experience. Most of which is heavily concentrated in the last three. I've won 3 awards and gotten some decent scores on other beers. Though I lack experience on a commercial system I know I have the aptitude to learn.

The ad said "brewmaster" but was lacking specifics on desired applicant qualifications. I get the sense they're hiring brewers in general as they are looking to get a good team of brewers going and I know I can be valuable.

So my questions are:

• Most job interviews I've had I put on a suit or something nice. Is it safe to assume I can "dress down" a little for this? Maybe just clean, not ripped pants and a clean shirt like a decent button up plaid?
• What's a reasonable salary (or wage) for an assistant brewer? Brewmaster?
• What can I do to reassure them I'd be valuable given my lack of commercial experience?
• What are key things to know about the brewing process when going from homebrew scale to commercial?
• Should I bring any homebrew? Recipes? Awards?
• What other advice can you give me?

 

[m00ps]

Id probably wear a button up shirt and khakis or something. No idea on the wage expectation but Id definitely bring some homebrew (preferably chilled). Id leave it in the car though, dont walk into the interview with it in your hand. Just casually mention it while tlaking to them

Ive talked a lot with the head brewers / owners of 2 breweries that recently opened up here and it sounds like there is a lot of emphasis on consistency and managing your pipeline. As a homebrewer, if your batch isnt ready, you cna let it sit a few weeks. But in a commerical brewery, if you are out of your customers favorite beer, and your new batch isnt even done clearing yet, youve got an issue. During the interview, Id talk about managing your pipeline so you have a consistent supply of your few staple brews (even if thats not the case). Consistency is more important commercially than at a homebrew level. One of the breweries has had issues with their yeast for their porter and the first 3 batches were all different. They tried adding vanilla to it once since it attenuated too far and they needed to make it seem more sweet, stuff like that. Also theres a lot of supply chain stuff I know nothing about. Hopefully as a brewer you wouldnt have to deal with that sort of thing

 

[Yooper]

Mention how crazily anal you are about cleaning- most brewer positions involved a ton of industrial cleaning and shoveling of mash tuns. I'm not kidding- brewing is HARD work and recipes and technique really aren't difficult at all.

 

[BrotherBock]

Good advice so far, thanks.

 

[treacheroustexan]

+1 on the cleaning. Brewer is pretty much just another term for a janitor. Best of luck! Report back to us if you do interview!

 

[Gavin C]

khaki's shirt and a tie.

A tie never hurts.

Mentally expand on that point you made

"I know I can be a good addition to your team and here's why"

This will get asked in every job interview.

Why do you want this?,
what can you bring to the table?
why should we hire you?
What questions if any do you have for us?

Have good answers prepared and try them out on someone. Always good to have a sounding board.


BTW, a sixer of cold homebrew would easily fit in a lap-top bag. no harm in having a lap-top bag with you. (no one's to know what's in their).

If it comes up in the interview about brewing experience, as i'm sure you'll be able to direct the flow somewhat, post the question if you could leave it with them as a token of gratitude for accepting you for an interview and a demonstration of your passion for the craft.

Best of luck with it.

 

[sandyeggoxj]

I'd be wary of bringing alcohol into a brewery because it demonstrates that you don't understand liquor laws and regulations. Those matter.

 

[BrotherBock]

Had a rather informal meeting (2 hours) with the two owners at a bar/restaurant. Overall the interview went as well as I thought it could.

But a couple things about it gave me pause. They had a lot of grand visions but not a lot of specifics about what they wanted from me exactly (running a brewhouse obviously), but nothing in the way of what kind of beer they wanted, what the atmosphere of the taproom would be like. One owner had some homebrew history, but the other (who was the main funder) didn't give me a strong indication of why he even wanted a brewery.

This is the only interview I've ever had where religion, demonic imagery on beer labels, concealed weapons, and Donald Trump came up. It didn't take a rocket scientist to see where this guy's personal views lied. And it doesn't seem like a large leap (based on a couple other comments) to think that his personal/political beliefs are going to bleed into the atmosphere of the business. That being said, it was the most frank and honest interview I've ever given or had.

Personally, I don't care AT ALL about people's politics/religion. It doesn't, in my mind, have anything to do with making good beer and running a brewery. The fact that it even came up was weird to me.

They were certainly interested in me but had some other people to talk to before they made any decisions, understandably. But the more I think the more I'm psyching myself out and thinking maybe these guys don't have a clear enough vision of what they want and the atmosphere may not be set up for success.

I'd relish the opportunity to work in a brewery. Everyone has to start somewhere and having student loans, a kid and a mortgage can not afford to start some 30K assistant brewer position (which this position would not be).

Anyway, I'm done with my rant. Best, but weirdest interview ever for a dream job that with a brewery that seems to lack specific vision and could be clouded by politics. Needless to say I'm conflicted. Also.....maybe I'm selling myself short and buying too much into the notion that "you need to be certified," "properly educated" to do a specific job. And not giving enough credit to what self-education and experience can give someone...but if I was starting a brewery I would not hire a homebrewer with no commercial experience to run a brewhouse.

 

[chezhed]

If they have no vision, they cannot see.

run...run away.

 

[Gavin C]

Sounds like the interviewer was very unprofessional.

Pass!

 

[BrotherBock]

If they have no vision, they cannot see.

run...run away.

Kinda what I'm thinking.

It's not that they have no vision. I think they have very grand visions. But lack specifics. Maybe a little of not being able "to see the forest for the trees," but reversed.

 

[sablesurfer]

If this is not the job you want to die doing, then maybe just come at it as experience on a commercial system? That will be very valuable, and this could be your way in. Just realize that if there is no vision or practiced recipes, there is a LOOOONG road ahead of these guys.

(Are they even planning a smaller test system to work out the recipes???)

 

[Hobanon]

Best case, you can run the show since they don't have any specifics in mind.

Worst case, they'll run over every idea you have since they don't have any specifics in mind.

Either way, I'd go for it. It has the potential to make your life miserable, but it also has the potential to make you a long-term pro brewer. Needless to say, I'm kind of jealous

 

[BrotherBock]

If this is not the job you want to die doing, then maybe just come at it as experience on a commercial system? That will be very valuable, and this could be your way in. Just realize that if there is no vision or practiced recipes, there is a LOOOONG road ahead of these guys.

(Are they even planning a smaller test system to work out the recipes???)

That's the other thing. Experience with them opens doors later. But if they're set up to fail, it doesn't do me any good either.

Without saying too much, cause I promised our discussions were confidential (not like I'm revealing who they are or anything), they were planning on starting off with a sizable system. And probably a R&D small homebrew scale system. Were I too get hired I'd be bringing in recipes.

Which reminds me of the other thing that struck me as them being out of touch with the culture. The one owner (not the homebrewing owner) was very focused on ownership and non-disclosure of recipes. I tried to tell him that that is anathema to the culture of brewing and mos tbreweries are very open with their practices. That giving the recipe to someone does not mean they can brew the same beer. Nor does it mean they can start brewing it and out compete you. But I think it fell on deaf ears.

The more I talk this through the more negatives I see. We'll see what they decide. But if this brewery will not have the culture or professionalism I want it may not be a good idea to start a whole new career with them. Perhaps a PT grunt work job with them where I'm not as invested and can still pull some brewhouse experience is better.

 

[BrotherBock]

Best case, you can run the show since they don't have any specifics in mind.

Worst case, they'll run over every idea you have since they don't have any specifics in mind.

Those are my fears and hopes, exactly. The main thing that gives me pause is the uncertainty of the business (based on their visions) and the culture (based on their comments and personal beliefs). I have people that rely on me and bills to pay. Dreams are great and worth pursuing of course. But in the end, I don't matter. The only thing that does is my family. I'd shovel pig **** for 8 hours everyday if I knew it could provide.

 

[RJ_InPA]

As a former home brewer turned pro brewer/brewery owner I can offer some advice from my perspective. If you want to get into the industry without formal education you either need to know someone who is willing to give you a job, start your own brewery, or start volunteering your time around a capable, well run brewery that is producing quality brews. Help out on brew days, wash kegs, tanks, floors, bathrooms, whatever is asked of you. After creating a good working relationship with the owner/brewmaster ask to be involved in recipe development on small scale batches. Bring in you own brews and share with the "guys" around the brewery. Show them the quality beer that you can make. Maybe they eventually hire you on or maybe you gain enough knowledge/experience to be a candidate at another location. Those are just my thoughts from my perspective. Hope it helps and if you're in central PA I could always use an extra hand on brew days.

 

[Hello]

OP: First, there are a number of breweries that open where the owners have a complete lack of vision or even understanding of the process as a whole. Some guy brews a few batches of beer, grabs a buddy and suddenly they want to open a brewery. No vision will be their road to downfall, lack of understanding will be their demise. However, you may be able to swing some commercial experience out of them and collect a salary as they go under.. If you can afford to work for the wage they're offering, then I say do it as a resume builder for as long as you can stand it.

To me, it sounds like this brewery may not even open. If there is such a clear lack of direction now, people aren't going to want to put the money up to get things started. They're going to need a great deal of money.

Did they tell you they can't pay you even $30K? That's not exactly out of the realm of standard for a head brewer. Depending upon what they're offering, it may not even be worth it.

I'd be wary of bringing alcohol into a brewery because it demonstrates that you don't understand liquor laws and regulations. Those matter.

Explain. I've brought in my home brew to breweries and have been doubly encouraged by brewery owners to do so.

 

[drainbamage]

Sorry it didn't go better.

As others have said, if you can stand to do it for a while, the experience could be a great stepping stone to better opportunities. Take advantage of the time there to learn how everything works and build connections at other breweries.

On the other hand, if you currently have a stable job and they seem too unfocused to even make it off the ground, steer clear. Family definitely comes first.

 

[BrotherBock]

Did they tell you they can't pay you even $30K? That's not exactly out of the realm of standard for a head brewer. Depending upon what they're offering, it may not even be worth it.

No, if I was their brewmaster I'd get more than that. I was trying to say that this position, if I was hired, would give me a liveable wage. Despite my concerns the wage/salary would be comparable to what I make now, which is what I'd need. I was saying I can't afford to pursue a brewing career making only 30K assistant brewer salary. This world is too damn expensive.

 

[Hello]

No, if I was their brewmaster I'd get more than that. I was trying to say that this position, if I was hired, would give me a liveable wage. Despite my concerns the wage/salary would be comparable to what I make now, which is what I'd need. I was saying I can't afford to pursue a brewing career making only 30K assistant brewer salary. This world is too damn expensive.

Agreed. I think you'd be shocked to know that the average salary for a head brewer in a small craft brewery can be quite low.

http://www.craftbeer.com/brewers_banter/getting-a-boot-in-the-brewhouse-door-2
http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Industry=Brewery/Salary