2 x 5500 watt ripple elements in 1 kettle

[Thefatdoghead]

Hi Guys,

I'm at the point where I am installing the ebrew supply 5500 watt ripple ulwd elements in my kettle and HLT.

So 2 elements in each kettle. 4 elements total.

Has anyone got any suggestions as to where to mount each element?

I was thinking if I go 45deg from the back of the kettle and have one slightly night than the other (to prevent them touching once in)

Just wanted to see anyone else's opinions or ideas.

Thanks and sorry if this has been posted before. I had a bit of a search but couldn't find much.

Pictures are of my control panel 50A and a element kit being assembled.

 

[EventHorizonBrewing]

How big are those?

 

[SoCal-Doug]

Mount them low (maybe where the external box is an inch or so higher than the bottom of the kettle) and rotationally where they don't touch or obstruct anything else like temp probes, thermometers, pick up tubes, etc. Beyond that, its wherever you prefer to run your wires.

Of course i'm curious why two? I have single 5500W elements in 15.5 gallon keggles and they heat up and hold temp wonderfully. With 12 to 14 gallons, i'm seeing a 2.5 to 3.0 (herms/wort) to 3.5 to 4.0 (hlt) degree per minute rise with a 75 degree ambient.

Maybe those kettles are much larger than the picture makes them appear?

 

[EventHorizonBrewing]

That's why I asked. I think this system might be a little overkill.

 

[jangevaa]

Maybe to keep things simple, stack them vertically? Make sure to use a float switch. Most seem to offset their elements by 45 degrees though, as you said. If those are 20 gallon kettles, one would be sufficient. Not a bad idea if these are 30 gallon kettles to use both though if you have the power available for it.

 

[Thefatdoghead]

They are 30 gallon ss brewtech kettles.

I have float switches. I thought having the elements at the back of the kettle at 45 deg would be more aesthetic to the eye and keep the cables neat and tidy but happy for any other input?

 

[EventHorizonBrewing]

I think stacking would take a little away from the thermal efficiency. Personally I'd set a 45 degree to 90 degree offset to maximize the efficiency.

 

[BrunDog]

Agreed... go 90 degs apart and vertically as close as practical. Keep in mind they often sag a bit when doing your layout.

 

[Thefatdoghead]

Never thought of sagging elements. Thanks Brundog!

 

[augiedoggy]

Mount them low (maybe where the external box is an inch or so higher than the bottom of the kettle) and rotationally where they don't touch or obstruct anything else like temp probes, thermometers, pick up tubes, etc. Beyond that, its wherever you prefer to run your wires.

Of course i'm curious why two? I have single 5500W elements in 15.5 gallon keggles and they heat up and hold temp wonderfully. With 12 to 14 gallons, i'm seeing a 2.5 to 3.0 (herms/wort) to 3.5 to 4.0 (hlt) degree per minute rise with a 75 degree ambient.

Maybe those kettles are much larger than the picture makes them appear?

I am in the process of building a 3 bbl electric brewery and in only using 4 5500w elements for that... I only turn my 5500w element up to 75% now with 12-13 gallons... I see this is 30 gallons so 2 elements are justified for time savings BUT even with smaller kettles there would be a time savings for getting the liquid UP to temp with 2 elements here so...

 

[LarMoeCur]

@AugieDoggy - where are the pictures of that 3 bbl build?

 

[augiedoggy]

@AugieDoggy - where are the pictures of that 3 bbl build?

Still waiting for the kettles to finish being built and shipped... im not starting the control panel builds until the weather turns crappy here.. too much going on

 

[Thefatdoghead]

That was my thinking. I didn't want to be waiting around for hours while the kettle came up to a boil.
I'm hoping for 15 min to come to boil.
Waiting for temps to rise is why brewday drag out.
Cost a little more to go 4 element but worth it I think.

 

[sandyeggoxj]

I have 30 gallong kettles with one 5500w ulwd element in the HLT and one in the BK. eHERMS. BCS controlled all on a 30-amp circuit. I can only run one at a time due to limitations in power. It takes me ~2 hours to heat 23 gallons in the HLT and 20-26 gallons in the BK. I have stout tanks and the f@#$ing sight glass on the bk doesn't show until 10 gallons of volume so when I heat my strike in there it takes a lot of water. Once I have 3 gallons of wort in the BK during sparge I can fire up the element on 100% and by the time I'm done sparging I'm within a few minutes of a full boil. I have boiled as much as 24 gallons with no problems.

Would I run 4 elements if I could? Hell yeah. But I can't. I get by it just takes a tad longer.

 

[Thefatdoghead]

I have 30 gallong kettles with one 5500w ulwd element in the HLT and one in the BK. eHERMS. BCS controlled all on a 30-amp circuit. I can only run one at a time due to limitations in power. It takes me ~2 hours to heat 23 gallons in the HLT and 20-26 gallons in the BK. I have stout tanks and the f@#$ing sight glass on the bk doesn't show until 10 gallons of volume so when I heat my strike in there it takes a lot of water. Once I have 3 gallons of wort in the BK during sparge I can fire up the element on 100% and by the time I'm done sparging I'm within a few minutes of a full boil. I have boiled as much as 24 gallons with no problems.

Would I run 4 elements if I could? Hell yeah. But I can't. I get by it just takes a tad longer.

That was one of the hardest things for me to work out.
I'm on 240v here in oz so it was pretty easy to run a 16mm twin cable and throw in a 63 amp RCD
That cost about $200 for the cable and rcd.
Then it's just the extra contractors and other elements.
Possibly 1000 bucks more to go the 4 element.

 

[BrunDog]

No hijack intended, here as I hope it’s relevant.

I have been contemplating incorporating time sharing into BruControl, such that limited capacity systems can maximize the net power available. For example, a 30A system would provide power to a “priority” element, then for the remaining time of its cycle that element is off, another element could be powered. Therefore 2 elements which draw ~25A could be combined “on” to draw 25A net over time.

 

[augiedoggy]

No hijack intended, here as I hope it’s relevant.

I have been contemplating incorporating time sharing into BruControl, such that limited capacity systems can maximize the net power available. For example, a 30A system would provide power to a “priority” element, then for the remaining time of its cycle that element is off, another element could be powered. Therefore 2 elements which draw ~25A could be combined “on” to draw 25A net over time.

This has actually come up before in other threads... I'm not sure if anyone actually accomplished it though.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Off topic but have you looked into Brew Hardware element enclosure? Easier than JB weld and whatnot and a hell of a lot better looking. That Kal box is a bit old school and solved an issue when there was nothing else available...now there is.

With one on each side it might look a little Frankenstein

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...y_s/1895.htm&usg=AOvVaw1yyk5L1nZxJS07yxwqbjt6

 

[augiedoggy]

Off topic but have you looked into Brew Hardware element enclosure? Easier than JB weld and whatnot and a hell of a lot better looking. That Kal box is a bit old school and solved an issue when there was nothing else available...now there is.

With one on each side it might look a little Frankenstein

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...y_s/1895.htm&usg=AOvVaw1yyk5L1nZxJS07yxwqbjt6

I agree here... lots of better options for this now..

 

[sandyeggoxj]

That was one of the hardest things for me to work out.
I'm on 240v here in oz so it was pretty easy to run a 16mm twin cable and throw in a 63 amp RCD
That cost about $200 for the cable and rcd.
Then it's just the extra contractors and other elements.
Possibly 1000 bucks more to go the 4 element.

Yep, looking back I agree. In actual practice is pretty simple. But it still takes 2 hours to heat a bunch of water. I rent so I can't drop a circuit. Wish I could. You'll appreciate all the elements.

 

[Thefatdoghead]

Off topic but have you looked into Brew Hardware element enclosure? Easier than JB weld and whatnot and a hell of a lot better looking. That Kal box is a bit old school and solved an issue when there was nothing else available...now there is.

With one on each side it might look a little Frankenstein

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...y_s/1895.htm&usg=AOvVaw1yyk5L1nZxJS07yxwqbjt6

I did see those after I went and bought the junction boxes from ebrew.
I can always upgrade in the future but I have them now.
The holes are going to be 1 1/4 for the elements so that's not an issue with changing the housings later.
I really would like to go for the weldless triclover fittings so I can remove the cables to clean the kettles.
I'll get it going and see how it runs first. Change it down the track.

 

[augiedoggy]

I did see those after I went and bought the junction boxes from ebrew.
I can always upgrade in the future but I have them now.
The holes are going to be 1 1/4 for the elements so that's not an issue with changing the housings later.
I really would like to go for the weldless triclover fittings so I can remove the cables to clean the kettles.
I'll get it going and see how it runs first. Change it down the track.

I bought two of these for $62 ($31 each) total with shipping... I have the email address for the company I purchased mine from towards the end on my thread below..