1 PID controlling to 2 Elements Wiring

[handbrewing]

Hello,

I've searched and couldn't answer my questions. I'm building a 1/2 barrel 2 vessel system. The 50a controller will have 1 pid to control 2 5500w elements simultaneously in the boil kettle with one switch to turn the elements on/off.

My question: Do I wire the elements through each contactor to each SSR the same as if I was using 2 PIDs like in the 50a back to back controller? My current thinking is the only wiring change would be from the PID to SSR's and switch to contactors. Is this correct?

Does anyone have a drawing for this setup?
50a
1 PID
1 on/off switch
2 5500w elements
2 Contactors
2 SSR's

I've previously built a 50a back to back controller with 2 pids controlling the elements independently but the move to 1 pid has me questioning things.

 

[doug293cz]

Hello,

I've searched and couldn't answer my questions. I'm building a 1/2 barrel 2 vessel system. The 50a controller will have 1 pid to control 2 5500w elements simultaneously in the boil kettle with one switch to turn the elements on/off.

My question: Do I wire the elements through each contactor to each SSR the same as if I was using 2 PIDs like in the 50a back to back controller? My current thinking is the only wiring change would be from the PID to SSR's and switch to contactors. Is this correct?

Does anyone have a drawing for this setup?
50a
1 PID
1 on/off switch
2 5500w elements
2 Contactors
2 SSR's

I've previously built a 50a back to back controller with 2 pids controlling the elements independently but the move to 1 pid has me questioning things.

You just have to wire the contactor coils in parallel with the controlling switch, and wire the SSRs' control inputs in parallel to the PID control output.

You could also use a single 50 - 60A contactor to control the power to the two SSR's.

Brew on

 

[augiedoggy]

you can even simplify things by going with one 50+ amp contactor and ssr instead of one for each element as long as they are fused or breakered once the wires split off and become a smaller gauge.

 

[doug293cz]

you can even simplify things by going with one 50+ amp contactor and ssr instead of one for each element as long as they are fused or breakered once the wires split off and become a smaller gauge.

Good point on adding fuses whenever the wire size is reduced.

Brew on

 

[handbrewing]

If I were to reduce the SSR and Contactor to one each I'd still need two 30A breakers, right? between the 50+ contactor and element receptacles. If so I'd need two wires coming from each post of the contactor to the breakers, correct? I've attached a quick drawer to confirm if this is correct. Thanks for your help!

 

[doug293cz]

Yes. I would recommend putting the SSR between the contactor and elements. That way if the SSR fails, you can remove power from the SSR. The SSR is the most likely component in your system to fail.

Brew on

 

[Drumminguy81]

Yea agreed with what augie said, I am running 1 pid, to 1 63a contractor, to 1 80a ssr, to 2-30a breakers, to 2 elements. All controlled with 1 switch. Works excellent.
Only issue is if you lose an ssr you are dead in the water where as if you have 2 separate ssr's you could potentially still fire 1 of the 2 elements. I just keep an extra ssr on hand and didnt skimp on buying cheapies.

 

[Bobby_M]

I would run one dual contactors and SSRs. If you have some issue that disables an element, such as a dead short failure or a fail-on SSR, you can disable one output and finish the brew day on the good element. It's cheap insurance.

 

[handbrewing]

So I have the panel all wired up. I tested with one element connected in a kettle of water but the element wont fire. I know i'm getting power to the element but it wont fire for some reason. I've tested the element plugs with multimeter and get 120v from ground to each pole but get no reading testing both poles. Does that make any sense?

I'm running one 80A SSR to one 63A contactor then split to two 32A breakers.

What i'm i missing?

 

[doug293cz]

Sounds like you have the same hot phase connected to both sides of the element. You should read 240V when measuring between the hot poles at the element connector. Note that you should also measure 240V between the hot poles when the SSR is off, due to the few mA of leakage current thru the SSR.

Brew on

 

[handbrewing]

Yep. I had the wiring wrong between the contactor and breakers. Dummy mistake.... It's firing now though!!

Thanks!