Yeast Starter Life

[Bigarcherynut]

Recently I began making yeast starters. On January 1st I made a 2.3 liter starter for a beer I was going to brew on January 6th. Unfortunately I ended up in the hospital with a heart issue. I got out and now back in for a procedure on Wednesday the 15th. Is my starter going to be ok to use? It was at 68 degrees for 3 days then I cold crashed it and was going to decant and pitch when I brewed but that didn't happen. What will I need to do? Hoping to brew maybe Sunday or Monday of next week 19 or 20th. Thanks

 

[IslandLizard]

Oh, jeez, hope you're OK!
Take it easy, don't overexert yourself.

If that yeast is still in the fridge, a ~1/2" settled yeast cake under 2.3 liters of clear starter beer, proceed as intended. Decant, leave enough behind (an oz or 2) to resuspend the yeast cake (wait until right before you pitch), let the slurry come to room temps, swirl up and pitch into your well oxygenated (or aerated) wort.

 

[Bigarcherynut]

Oh, jeez, hope you're OK!
Take it easy, don't overexert yourself.

If that yeast is still in the fridge, a ~1/2" settled yeast cake under 2.3 liters of clear starter beer, proceed as intended. Decant, leave enough behind (an oz or 2) to resuspend the yeast cake (wait until right before you pitch), let the slurry come to room temps, swirl up and pitch into your well oxygenated (or aerated) wort.

Thanks and should be fixed up tomorrow but will have a week's weight restriction so no brewing till then.

Sounds good about the starter. New at them but wish I would have done these a while ago. Much better fermentation on my big beers. I do have a good layer and the wort is still on top.

Thanks

 

[IslandLizard]

Did you have the starter on a stir plate? If so, you could have as much as 400 billion cells from that 2.3 liter. You can easily save some out (ranch) for a next starter, and again, and again...

This is my favorite yeast calculator, very recommended:
BrewUnited's Yeast Calculator
Mr. Malty is good too, especially the "pitch from slurry" tab.

to good beer and good health!

 

[Bigarcherynut]

Did you have the starter on a stir plate? If so, you could have as much as 400 billion cells from that 2.3 liter. You can easily save some out (ranch) for a next starter, and again, and again...

This is my favorite yeast calculator, very recommended:
BrewUnited's Yeast Calculator
Mr. Malty is good too, especially the "pitch from slurry" tab.

to good beer and good health!

I did use a stir plate. Not being home, I think I need 418 billion cells and the starter size was 420 billion cells. As long as I haven't lost any I'll have enough for this batch. With my recipe calling for this many I am also adding a quart of caramelized wort that I started as a gallon and a half and boiled down to one quart. This will add some gravity points so hopefully the starter is big enough to cover that. I've never done the caramelized wort but this recipe called for it. I'm brewing a clone of Founder's Backwoods Bastard. I have looked at both My Malty and Brewers Friend starter calculators. I'll look at the other one you have.

Thanks

 

[IslandLizard]

With 400+ billion you should have plenty of cells for a 1.100 wort. You could run a vitality starter with that decanted slurry for 4-6 hours on brew day and pitch that whole. It revitalizes the cells, but 3 weeks in the fridge shouldn't have degraded them much. After 2-3 months in the fridge I'd start to consider it, especially if the cell count is marginal already.

Oxygenate (or aerate) that wort well. Aside from a healthy pitch, that's probably most important for high gravity brews. You could oxygenate a second time, 12-18 hour after pitching, but before active fermentation has started (e.g., krausen is forming).

 

[Bigarcherynut]

With 400+ billion you should have plenty of cells for a 1.100 wort. You could run a vitality starter with that decanted slurry for 4-6 hours on brew day and pitch that whole. It revitalizes the cells, but 3 weeks in the fridge shouldn't have degraded them much. After 2-3 months in the fridge I'd start to consider it, especially if the cell count is marginal already.

Oxygenate (or aerate) that wort well. Aside from a healthy pitch, that's probably most important for high gravity brews. You could oxygenate a second time, 12-18 hour after pitching, but before active fermentation has started (e.g., krausen is forming).

I figured I'd wait till I got out of the hospital to reply so I could see my numbers.

My current recipe OG will be 1.110. Along with that I have a quart of caramelized wort that has an expected OG of 1.535. That quart is to be added to the main wort and boiled down. I'm not sure how to figure what the entire boiled down wort will come to for OG. My yeast starter needed is 400.6 billion cells for the main 5.5 gallon of wort. My starter size is 2.75 L and 433 billion cells. I'm hoping this covers the addition of the quart of the caramelized wort that's OG is to be about 1.535. As long as my starter will be at it's full level I should be ok.

I did look up the vitality starter and not quite sure what it is. Something else I don't understand is, If I make a starter with the calculators I know by using a pack of liquid yeast how large it is I start with. If I take some of the starter and save it, how do you even know how many cells you are starting with. The same goes for harvesting yeast from the fermenter. Are you guessing at cell count?

Thanks

 

[day_trippr]

fwiw, I keep a number of yeast strains running (via over-built starters) and have been relying on the yeast starter calculator provided by the burgeoning conglomerate that owns HBT

From there I base my pitches and stored quantities on proportionate volume after splitting the product of a starter (single or multi-step) run. So if the calculator says the end of a step series provides [edits applied to cell counts] 1.5T cells total and I have 12 ounces of thick clean yeast and I split that three ways (for two carboys and a stored 4 ounces) I'm figuring I have .5T cells for each pitch and storage. When I grow the next pitch from the stored sample I assume .5T cells plus whatever elapsed time is applicable and start again from there.

It's clearly still on the "estimate" scale but has proved near 'nuff for practical purposes over the years. The only time I ever had an obvious underpitch was from a bottle-dreg thing that had no clear starting cell count and I definitely needed one more step...

Cheers!

[ps: I've never done a "vitality starter". I have no idea if it makes any sense.]

 

[Bigarcherynut]

fwiw, I keep a number of yeast strains running (via over-built starters) and have been relying on the yeast starter calculator provided by the burgeoning conglomerate that owns HBT

From there I base my pitches and stored quantities on proportionate volume after splitting the product of a starter (single or multi-step) run. So if the calculator says the end of a step series provides 1.5B cells total and I have 12 ounces of thick clean yeast and I split that three ways (for two carboys and a stored 4 ounces) I'm figuring I have .5B cells for each pitch and storage. When I grow the next pitch from the stored sample I assume .5B cells plus whatever elapsed time is applicable and start again from there.

It's clearly still on the "estimate" scale but has proved near 'nuff for practical purposes over the years. The only time I ever had an obvious underpitch was from a bottle-dreg thing that had no clear starting cell count and I definitely needed one more step...

Cheers!

[ps: I've never done a "vitality starter". I have no idea if it makes any sense.]

Thanks much. I would imagine that it's a process that requires close watch on sterilization when transferring yeast into a measuring cup and then into sterilized storage containers. What do you use to store your yeast in? The calculator you use does not have an entry for age of the slurry. How to you calculate the estimated amount of cells as the sample ages?

Thanks again,
Bill

 

[day_trippr]

It has an entry age for the "yeast", and you can set the cell count in 100B "pack" multiples.

So, don't think "slurry", start with the cell count that led to the stored quantity, then set the number of 100B cell "packs" accordingly and work from there. If you stored 300B cells three months ago, plug those numbers into the calculator and work from there.

Like virtually every home brewer, I don't do "sterilization", I strive for the best "sanitation" I can achieve without heroics. In 16 years of home brewing I've never had an evidently infected batch of anything, so that strategy works...

Cheers!

 

[Bigarcherynut]

It has an entry age for the "yeast", and you can set the cell count in 100B "pack" multiples.

So, don't think "slurry", start with the cell count that led to the stored quantity, then set the number of 100B cell "packs" accordingly and work from there. If you stored 300B cells three months ago, plug those numbers into the calculator and work from there.

Like virtually every home brewer, I don't do "sterilization", I strive for the best "sanitation" I can achieve without heroics. In 16 years of home brewing I've never had an evidently infected batch of anything, so that strategy works...

Cheers!

I see now about the date. I guess I was thinking sanitizing sorry.

I was thinking storing yeast in pint ball canning jars. Anything better than that?

 

[day_trippr]

[shrug] That's exactly what I use

Cheers!