Yeast Alergy

[sennister]

Not sure this is the best place for this so if there is a better place mods please redirect the thread..

Anyhow ever since our second child was born my wife has developed an allergy to yeast. I don't know that there is a hypo-allergenic strain of yeast that can be used in brewing but if there is that might be an option as well.

My wife can tolerate yeast in low doses as in have a commercially produced beer that is highly filtered and pasteurized as long as it is limited to 1-2 glasses max. She enjoys beer but simply can't drink it but seems to do better with some other forms of alcohol (mixed drinks). If she has too much she has reactions which have gotten bad enough to cause strep.

Anyhow as a homebrewer what types of options do I have for making a beer for her? I have seen where people have used whole house filters in an attempt to filter out some of the yeast and other stuff. I am not a fan of the amount of waste that I would be looking at with that option. I am leaning more toward a plate filter option that I have seen but if it really won't work that well then I won't bother.

As for my brewing process/equipment as it may help with my options....

I am an extract kit brewer for now. I am probably 3/4 of the way there with collecting and assembling equipment for switching to all grain and will be jumping right in with a HERMS brewery. I basically have my Keggles, pump, heat sources and just need to punch more holes and do the plumbing. I do not bottle. I skipped that process and jumped right to kegging and have 5 ball lock kegs of which I can use 4 in my keggerator. I also two CO2 tanks (10lbs and a 20lbs) as well as a spare single and double regulator. I mention this as it is easy for me to jump the beer from one keg to another with a plate filter or some other medium if that is my best option. The only thing I am looking at needing for equipment is the filter set up. I assume it also comes into play as I am not bottling where I would need the yeast to carbonate the beer since I do force carbonation.

So what do I have for options? If there is a good process that I can do to try and clear up the beer more, I don't know that I would do it for every batch. However I could see myself setting up one of the taps for her should the process be effective enough that she could also enjoy it. She has tried a couple of my beers but small samples only and while she liked it, she did start to have a reaction.

Thanks

 

[reed1911]

I would speak to an allergist and ask if it is possible that she is allergic to a certain strain (sacc. or brett.). Chances are good that you may be able to make an all brett. beer that she can drink. Does wine also affect her as well? Or is it only beer? Other than that filtration is a good bet. Considering that we all have multiple strains of yeast living on our skin, there is something specific she is having a reaction to, and you should be able to find a workaround using a strain that does not affect her as much or at all.

 

[austinb]

Is that a self-diagnosis or a doctors diagnosis of a yeast allergy? The BMC beers as well as plenty of the larger craft breweries use filters that basically filter out all if the yeast. And liquor should not have any yeast at all because the yeast does not evaporate out with the alcohol in the distilling process. My guess is that it is not actually the yeast itself but something else in the beverages and since she seems to have issues with all types of alcohol maybe it is the alcohol itself? As was already mentioned I think she should see an allergist before you start trying to figure out different yeasts.

If it is in fact yeast then as was suggested you could try an all Brettanomyces beer but it will taste slightly different.

Lager yeast and ale yeast are also two different species in the Saccharomyces genus so she may be more sensitive to one than the other so you could try brewing lagers if she does better with those.

 

[sennister]

Thanks for the replies!!!

I would speak to an allergist and ask if it is possible that she is allergic to a certain strain (sacc. or brett.). Chances are good that you may be able to make an all brett. beer that she can drink. Does wine also affect her as well? Or is it only beer? Other than that filtration is a good bet. Considering that we all have multiple strains of yeast living on our skin, there is something specific she is having a reaction to, and you should be able to find a workaround using a strain that does not affect her as much or at all.

Yeah one would assume that she would allergic reaction to all wild yeast in addition to the specific strains the we use in brewing. That said the contact would be different. I would imagine you are exposed to a much higher dose drinking an unfiltered beer than you would just living in an environment. Also she does have other allergies and takes allegra daily to control that. This may possibly be the wild yeast allergy which allegra can control in mild day to day exposure. She has the same reaction to both beer and wine. Though doesn't have the issue with mixed drinks (distilled alcohol). She does drink malt beverages (Mike's Hard Lemonade) but I don't know the process of making it. Is it a process more like beer or more like a distilled alcohol? Thanks for the suggestion of an All Brett. Beer. I will look into it more.

Is that a self-diagnosis or a doctors diagnosis of a yeast allergy? The BMC beers as well as plenty of the larger craft breweries use filters that basically filter out all if the yeast. And liquor should not have any yeast at all because the yeast does not evaporate out with the alcohol in the distilling process. My guess is that it is not actually the yeast itself but something else in the beverages and since she seems to have issues with all types of alcohol maybe it is the alcohol itself? As was already mentioned I think she should see an allergist before you start trying to figure out different yeasts.

If it is in fact yeast then as was suggested you could try an all Brettanomyces beer but it will taste slightly different.

Lager yeast and ale yeast are also two different species in the Saccharomyces genus so she may be more sensitive to one than the other so you could try brewing lagers if she does better with those.

It is a little of both. Self diag though trial and error. She did speak with a Dr about it but not a specialist. Our Med coverage pretty much sucks when it comes to stuff like this so to go see an allergist to get a full work up would be totally out of pocket. Haven't done it because not sure what is to be gained. After the work up they say, hey avoid yeast. This was pretty much what her General Dr said to her hen she brought it up at a routine physical. She does have the reaction with many breads, beer and wine if consumed in larger quantities. The big common aspect to all of these is the yeast. One could assume we are also talking about a broad range of strains. It is odd that she was fine before the second child. The first one brought on an allergy to garlic which she still has.

I do know that the big guys use filtration where I am not and I am looking at options to possibly add that, like I said to maybe a beer or two. I don't know I would do it across the board but if it helps her enjoy it as well, I get less grief. Get the CFO on board and funding an operation gets easier. :rockin: As mentioned above, the reactions are primarily around bread, wine and beer. Not distilled alcohol so much. So she normally drinks margaritas if we go out. The beer reaction on commercial beer is much more subdued compared to mine. For instance she can drink 1-2 over a few hours of commercial beer and be fine. If she drinks any more than that and she could have issues. If she drinks half a pint of mine = issues. So what is the difference? Well filtration. I could also maybe try and add Irish Moss or something else to help clarify but not sure if that would help clear out the yeast population. I also don't know if the plate filter that I am considering would be adequate at filtering yeast. Maybe I just have to go with a finer filter media.

I haven't brewed a lager yet. So far everything has been ale. However I do have a Red Lager kit which is next in line to get brewed. I just completed my modification of an old wine fridge to make a fermentation chamber with heat and cooling capability (STC-1000 controller). I have tested it out on the last two batches of ales for the at least the primary fermentation stage and it has worked great. This weekend I will try and move the Oatmeal Stout to secondary to free up my bucket and the fermentation chamber to do my first lager. Will brew it this weekend or in the next week or so when I have some free time. I have been pushing these ales in line in front of the lager to stock up a bit on beer for the kegerator so I can leave the ale in the chamber for a few months. The 15 gallons of Ale should last me until the lager is done and I can get something else going behind it being I am the only one drinking it other than occasional guests.


Thanks for the tips so far..

 

[sennister]

I had to do a search on Brett beer and I see mention that a type is Saison. I have seen some talk about this beer type but have never tried one. I will have to dig into this a little more but maybe I will try one of these beers.

Is there an All Brett style beer that is in extract kit form that anyone knows of? I am a little ways off from starting up all grain yet but of course once I go that route I will be fine.

I also see references to sour beer in this type. Are there any concerns about my fermentation equipment. I have seen where people dedicate buckets, auto siphons and other racking equipment to sour beer once you start down that path to prevent it from happing when not intended. I don't see my self in converting entirely over to something like this but I might make a batch or two of a few to see if it helps. I get that not all Brett style beers are sour but just wasn't sure if this style yeast is something that I might be concerned about in other brewing of it hitting it with Starsan will clean it up just fine.

Thanks

 

[austinb]

I still find it odd that she still reacts if she has more than a few commercial brews, it is my understanding that with the sterile filtration they do at the big BMC breweries that 100% of the yeast is filtered out and if it was the yeast then she would have no issues with it. I would say have you considered gluten but the issues with wine rule that out. I wonder if it isn't the yeast but a yeast byproduct that is also in bread but is not evaporated into distilled liquor and maybe beer filtration helps but doesn't get all of whatever it is out.

 

[austinb]

Also if filtered commercial beers seem better and she would really like to drink at least 1-2 of your beers then I think getting a filtration system would be the way to go. Filtration is probably a better idea than all Brett because that would really limit what styles you can do. I'm pretty sure you can get sterile filters for a homebrew setup which should remove all or probably at least 99.999% of it. Just make sure you crash cool the beer and maybe run it through a coarser filter before the sterile one or it will plug up really quick.

 

[sennister]

I still find it odd that she still reacts if she has more than a few commercial brews, it is my understanding that with the sterile filtration they do at the big BMC breweries that 100% of the yeast is filtered out and if it was the yeast then she would have no issues with it. I would say have you considered gluten but the issues with wine rule that out. I wonder if it isn't the yeast but a yeast byproduct that is also in bread but is not evaporated into distilled liquor and maybe beer filtration helps but doesn't get all of whatever it is out.

I guess it is is possible that it is a by-product of the yeast. Any idea of the manufacture process of a malt beverage like Mike's Lemonade? She normally doesn't pound them down so maybe they are filtered enough like a commercial beer. I haven't asked her if there is no reaction or if it is very mild. I know she is fine with distilled alcohol as that is what she normally drinks. The Mike's is more a convenience thing if we are at the lake or some place without a full bar.

I may give the plate filter a shot as well as look into the other beer options.

 

[austinb]

No idea about the mikes hard lemonade process but I would guess it is just lemonade with alcohol added. It says malt beverage on it which I believe would mean that the alcohol was from some sort of grain, probably corn sugar that was fermented, distilled and then added to the lemonade.

 

[biertourist]

If it's actually a yeast allergy (certainly seems in question still); you can get a plate filter and filter your beer in between two corney kegs; it'll cost you roughly $4 extra per batch. (You'll want to chill the beer as cold as you can get it and lager it for a while before filtering it so that there's less yeast load on the filter and it filters faster.)

If it's a gluten allergy, you'll want to avoid wheat in your beers and you can use "Clarity Ferm" from White Labs to enzymatically reduce the gluten to VERY low levels. -Just pitch one $2 tube when you pitch your yeast and let it go for a month.

Given all these considerations it might be a good time to consider temperature control for lagering and corney kegs if you don't already have these things. Lager brewing normally means at least a month of fermentation anyway and filtering certainly helps them look like a commercial lager. -You can increase your beer quality and decrease the risk of allergies in one fell swoop.


Adam

 

[biertourist]

No idea about the mikes hard lemonade process but I would guess it is just lemonade with alcohol added. It says malt beverage on it which I believe would mean that the alcohol was from some sort of grain, probably corn sugar that was fermented, distilled and then added to the lemonade.

It's time for another episode of everyone's favorite game show: "State the Obvious!" -YEAAA!

--Read what you wrote again... "Malt beverage" -does that possibly say something about where the sugar may have come from? (Hint: Not corn.)



Adam

 

[duboman]

Have you considered she might have an issue with gluten? You mention bread and other non alcoholic things so perhaps she needs a gluten free diet or has a mild gluten allergy.

You can brew gluten free beer

 

[sennister]

If it's actually a yeast allergy (certainly seems in question still); you can get a plate filter and filter your beer in between two corney kegs; it'll cost you roughly $4 extra per batch. (You'll want to chill the beer as cold as you can get it and lager it for a while before filtering it so that there's less yeast load on the filter and it filters faster.)

If it's a gluten allergy, you'll want to avoid wheat in your beers and you can use "Clarity Ferm" from White Labs to enzymatically reduce the gluten to VERY low levels. -Just pitch one $2 tube when you pitch your yeast and let it go for a month.

Given all these considerations it might be a good time to consider temperature control for lagering and corney kegs if you don't already have these things. Lager brewing normally means at least a month of fermentation anyway and filtering certainly helps them look like a commercial lager. -You can increase your beer quality and decrease the risk of allergies in one fell swoop.


Adam

I mentioned in one of my posts above that my next beer is a Red Lager. It will be my first lager now that I have my STC-1000 thermostat set up and running a heater in an old wine fridge. I am having no issues at controlling temps at 0.5C with the Ale that I am doing now and have done test runs down into Lagering temps. I will do this Lager the normal way, no filtering and see what happens. As mentioned it might be ale strains. They have a plate filter at the LHBS. So I can pick one up and can get the temps down as well as have an extra ball lock keg so it won't be a problem doing this. I have seen where you use two keg couplers with the filter in the middle and push out the out on the unfiltered side and in the out on the filtered side.

I have seen the Gluten Free section. I guess I could always try that.

 

[sennister]

Have you considered she might have an issue with gluten? You mention bread and other non alcoholic things so perhaps she needs a gluten free diet or has a mild gluten allergy.

You can brew gluten free beer

I might try it as another batch. We don't think it is a gluten issue but who knows.

 

[pdxal]

If she has the issue with wine it is not gluten.
Yeast allergy=filtration with a very fine filter.
:rockin:

 

[sennister]

If she has the issue with wine it is not gluten.
Yeast allergy=filtration with a very fine filter.
:rockin:

Yes, she can drink wine but the results are about the same as commercial beer.

Any idea on how many micron I need to go down to? I would imagine the finest I can find is what the answer will be.

 

[pdxal]

Smallest possible micron filter, why take any chance of any yeast being in the beer if your wife will have a reaction? You'll strip away some flavors, but her health and enjoying the beer would be worth it.

 

[Hoppity]

You can do a skin test on her with small samples of various yeasts over a period of time. That's what Allergists do anyway. I'd keep an EPI pen handy. Just in case.