Why the high Gravity?

[Brewenc]

This is a very simple Paulaner Hefe clone I did. Anyone have an idea for the high gravity?

Grain Bill:
9.0 lbs Wheat LME
0.5 lb Munich (Steeped for 30 min @ 150-160

1 Oz Hallertau Tradition 60 min.

WLP 300

Est. OG .069

OG .102 @62 deg.
FG .024 @65 deg.

I do a partial boil 3 Gal. I steep my grains for approx 30 min keeping the temp at 150-160. I then remove the grains and add half of the LME and bring to boil. At boil add hops and boil for 60 min. just before flame out add the last half of LME.
Cooled wort and added enough water to equal 5 Gal. took OG of .102. used two Hydrometers and checked Hydrometers with tap water (both were within .002 of .000 Pitched yeast and fermented at 65 deg. for 17 days. Took FG of .024 @ 65 deg.

Any ideas?

 

[TheSeether]

I'm guessing the wort wasn't mixed very well when you took the OG and your samples represented abnormally high numbers whereas other samples may have found abnormally low numbers.

 

[devilishprune]

You didn't mix the wort enough and you pulled a sample from the more dense part of the carboy. If your volume is correct, then you aren't going to miss your gravity with extract. Simple as that.

 

[Oldsock]

I don't think there is anything wrong with the measurement, 9 lbs of LME is enough to make 5 gallons of 1.068 wort.

Edit: Sorry I thought 1.069 was your high reading (it is much higher than a Paulaner clone should be). Agreed with the others about not mixing well enough.

 

[Revvy]

It's a pretty common issue for ANYONE topping off with water in the fermenter (and that includes partial mashes, extract or all grain revcipes) to have an error in reading the OG...In fact, it is actually nearly impossible to mix the wort and the top off water in a way to get an accurate OG reading...

Brewers get a low reading if they get more of the top off water than the wort, conversely they get a higher number if they grabbed more of the extract than the top off water in their sample.

When I am doing an extract with grain recipe I make sure to stir for a minimum of 5 minutes (whipping up a froth to aerate as well) before I draw a grav sample and pitch my yeast....It really is an effort to integrate the wort with the top off water...This is a fairly common new brewer issue we get on here...unless you under or over topped off or the final volume for the kit was 5 gallons and you topped off to 5.5, then the issue, sorry to say, is "operator error"

If your target volume was correct, then it will be fine.

More than likely your true OG is really what it's supposed to be. And it will mix itself fine during fermentation.

 

[Brewenc]

Thanks for the clarity. I have never had that problem before but makes sense. Doesnt the FG still seem a little high?

 

[Brewenc]

I don't think there is anything wrong with the measurement, 9 lbs of LME is enough to make 5 gallons of 1.068 wort.

Edit: Sorry I thought 1.069 was your high reading (it is much higher than a Paulaner clone should be). Agreed with the others about not mixing well enough.

I have never tried to duplicate any recipe. I always make it my own...more of this...less of that. I added some malt to the original recipe. Thanks for the comment.

 

[Revvy]

Thanks for the clarity. I have never had that problem before but makes sense. Doesnt the FG still seem a little high?

It seems high but it's not REALLY high...the number is not correct. LIke I said, you picked up more wort than water and it wasn't thoroughly high....but it's NOT the true gravity of the ENTIRE batch of wort....If you got it evenly mixed, and had the correct final volume, then your gravity would be exactly what the recipe calls for. It really is, but right when you took the sample you had stratification of the water and the extract.

 

[Brewenc]

Thanks Revvy I understand that the OG was not correct. I used Pro Mash Software and came up with an est. OG of .069 using that as my highest possible gravity my est. FG would be .012-.015 sound right?

 

[Oldsock]

Thanks Revvy I understand that the OG was not correct. I used Pro Mash Software and came up with an est. OG of .069 using that as my highest possible gravity my est. FG would be .012-.015 sound right?

From a starting gravity of 1.069, using mostly extract 65% attenuation is a bit low, but not too far off. How much yeast did you pitch? How did you aerate? What were your pitching and fermentation temperatures?

 

[Brewenc]

From a starting gravity of 1.069, using mostly extract 65% attenuation is a bit low, but not too far off. How much yeast did you pitch? How did you aerate? What were your pitching and fermentation temperatures?

I pitched one vial of WLP300 @ 62 deg.
Fermented @ 65 deg.
Aerated by pouring Wort into Carboy then pouring water into wort through funnel.
I would expect an attenuation of 72%-76%

 

[Oldsock]

For such a strong beer you should have made a starter (http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html suggests 3 one month old vials of yeast at that gravity). That combined with less than ideal aeration could lead to low attenuation.

 

[Brewenc]

For such a strong beer you should have made a starter (http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html suggests 3 one month old vials of yeast at that gravity). That combined with less than ideal aeration could lead to low attenuation.

I have never had to use a starter for any beer under .070 this beer had took approximately 12 hours before it was flat out rolling. In my 6.5 Gal Carboy the Krausen started to get into my airlock. and i measured and marked a 5 gal. mark on it. Check out this link for White Labs. I do appreciate your help though. I definitely didnt get proper aeration thus the "bad" sample I took. T

http://http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/homebrew_information.html

 

[Revvy]

I have never had to use a starter for any beer under .070 this beer had took approximately 12 hours before it was flat out rolling. In my 6.5 Gal Carboy the Krausen started to get into my airlock. and i measured and marked a 5 gal. mark on it. Check out this link for White Labs. I do appreciate your help though. I definitely didnt get proper aeration thus the "bad" sample I took. T

http://http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/homebrew_information.html

You're link's not working for some reason. But I too subscribe to mr malty's pitchrate calculator, and even with brand new out of the box liquid yeast the numbers show the need to make a starter for beers from about 1.40 or so...and if the yeast is a little old, even 1.030....There's a ton of reasons why but out of hand I make a starter with nearly all liquid yeast, heck just for piece of mind alone is enough.

 

[Oldsock]

Agreed, just because it started fermenting quickly doesn't mean that you had healthy yeast. What it means is that they built up as many cells as they could with the limited oxygen, then went to work. Healthy cell walls (which is what oxygen gets you) are most important at the end of fermentation when there is a lot of poisonous alcohol in solution. Some yeast nutrient is also a good idea in extract beers since they can be low on FAN and other important compounds.

Since it was an extract batch there aren't many other options for poor attenuation since you don't have to worry about mash conversion.

 

[Brewenc]

Thx. I am pretty sure I did not get a proper mix of the wort and water addition...nor did i get proper aeration. I appreciate the words of advice. I am definitly a NEWB and mistakes are made. But tried a bottle last Thurs. and besides being young (1 weekin the bottle) it was really good.