Whats with the big beer frenzy?

[sfgoat]

At the risk of committing some sort of sacrilege in the homebrewing community, what is it really that makes these so popular? I get that everyone has their own tastes and preferences but I just can not stand most. Without a doubt I almost always get a box full of big beers in a swap or as a gift.

Don't get me wrong, I have had a couple that were very good but it is not a frequent occurrence for both homebrews and commercials.

In the few comps that I have judged in the biggest categories were the ones that the big beers fall into and honestly most just taste offensive at best. But worst of all are the ones that try to cover up the alcohol taste with excess roasted products or chocolate and fruit. Most of these just taste like crap medicine and when you say so you get emails saying that you are an idiot that doesn't know beer. I may not be the best at it but seriously if you make crap I will tell you.

But really I just don't get it. Especially during the summer but hey to each their own.

Thanks for hearing me out.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

I don't like to criticize others for their beer choices, so if people like the big beers, they're welcome to them. They're not my cup of tea either.

I almost never drink barleywine our imperial stout, and most DIPAs are too cloying. Only a few are palatable to me.

That's just me, though. I'm biased to spicy, sour, salty, and bitter flavors. Sweet doesn't do it for me.

But hey, like I said, for those who like it, good for them.

 

[kaconga]

Big beers mean different things in different parts of the world. In my local craft beer scene a session beer is anything 6% and under. 10% and up is usually a half pint pour at a brewery. This is obviously not in line with the rest of the country and especially not the world. Personally I love the reactions that high abv can have with esters to create unique flavors.

 

[Qhrumphf]

I'm with you. I like and brew big beers from time to time (my Quad is 13.9%), but I've got a real sweet spot for true session beers in the 2.5-4% ABV range. My "house" homebrew is an Ordinary Bitter at about 3% and my fav commercial beer is 4.2%.

I think a lot of it is American "more is better" sort of a cultural thing.

 

[sfgoat]

I don't consider it a big beer really unless it is over 8% I suppose and I have had some that were amazing. I think personally, the simpler the better in bigger beers. It just seems to get all muddled when people are adding a bunch of stuff to try and bring crazy flavors to their beer.

I got one in a swap that I tried yesterday and dumped. Just way too overbroad on the roasted barley. I definitely picked up on some cocoa in it as well as a heavy artificial cherry flavor. It was like someone put cherry syrup over straight coffee grounds and I just ate a spoonful of it.

I guess I just get a little perturbed when I give an honest opinion on a beer and get emails back complaining about what I had to say. When my boss gives me a review I don't email him and call him an idiot. I take the information and try to improve.

 

[PJoyce85]

While I do enjoy big beers, I also do not drink them in summer unless it's a special bottle.

I like making big beers because I really enjoy seeing how it changes and evolves through the aging. Also, I don't brew during the winter so making a beer ~6 months in advance that will age well, will give me a supply through the winter.

I do agree that most big beer flavors can be an assault on the senses. A friend and I recently submitted a Bourbon Barrel RIS to NHC and we were heavily knocked for not enough bourbon and oak flavor. We brewed that beer with the intentions of the oak and bourbon flavors being complimentary to the RIS backbone. If I wanted bourbon instead of a beer, I would order bourbon. I think part of the problem is a lot of people think bigger is better; more hops, more flavorings, etc., and in most cases, simply holding back would make much better beer IMHO


Sent from my iPhone using Home

 

[Hopinista]

Pretty sure session beers are seriously -in- right now...

 

[sfgoat]

Pretty sure session beers are seriously -in- right now...

Of course they are. Session beers will always be in as they are appropriate for all seasons and occasions.

 

[Qhrumphf]

Pretty sure session beers are seriously -in- right now...

Depends. They're becoming more common as a craft offering, and all the big guys are certainly sessionable, but they still get nowhere near the same amount of craft beer love as bigger beers.

 

[Billy-Klubb]

I hereby deem this thread sacrilege!!!

 

[Hopinista]

i hereby deem this thread sacrilege!!!

+1.

 

[Homercidal]

There is a perception of value inherent in the cost of the beer purchased and the rarity of it. A big beer requires more ingredients and often more time spent aging (Maybe in Oak Barrels). More ingredients costs more and cellar time equates into further expenses.

Therefore a big beer costs more.

People want to think they are getting more for their money, so when they buy a Big Beer and drink it, they want to like it more or they might feel guilty for having wasted more money on something they don't like. The same applies for rare or exclusive items.

Big Beers often have more and more complex flavors. Not everyone likes that, but for a lot of people there is a special event that goes with drinking a big beer. It's a careful exercise in flavor perception marathon. It's the showcase portion of the day, not a "wash down dinner" or "gulp while I play horseshoes in the backyard" beer. It consumes all of your attention as you consume it.

So in any case, it's worth more, in perception.

Of course there is the bottom line, which is, do you REALLY like it? In a lot of cases, no. I would not waste my money on any fancy, foreign, expensive, sour beer. I don't like sour beers. On the other hand, I do like many other styles of beer, like Stouts, IPAs, etc. I could certainly see myself spending a few dollars more for a rare and/or expensive beer like KBS, Pliny, Dark Lord, etc. It may be a one time thing, or it may be an annual event.

I don't consider them "have-to-have" beers, but sampling a treat beer can be a treat.

Then again, there are several COMMON beers that I like a lot, and often enjoy just as much as some of the fancy and expensive beers I've tried, like Bells Oberon, Bells Two Hearted, a well made Homebrew Wit, many homebrew IPA and APAs I've had, etc.

I don't think Big Beers are going to go away, but I think many people who broke into the craft beer scene a few years back are now deciding that maybe they've been there, done that, and can feel confident in their decision to pass on the expensive beers and just enjoy a quality, less expensive beer. They will sometimes hunt down that rare beer now and again, but not to the extend they once did.

Different strokes for different folks. There is a reason big beers are expensive, and there is a reason Founders sells a session IPA in a can. There is a need for a drinkable, yet flavorful beer that people can take to the beach, or camping, or wherever bottles are not allowed, or could more easily break.

 

[sfgoat]

There is a perception of value inherent in the cost of the beer purchased and the rarity of it. A big beer requires more ingredients and often more time spent aging (Maybe in Oak Barrels). More ingredients costs more and cellar time equates into further expenses.

Therefore a big beer costs more.

People want to think they are getting more for their money, so when they buy a Big Beer and drink it, they want to like it more or they might feel guilty for having wasted more money on something they don't like. The same applies for rare or exclusive items.

Big Beers often have more and more complex flavors. Not everyone likes that, but for a lot of people there is a special event that goes with drinking a big beer. It's a careful exercise in flavor perception marathon. It's the showcase portion of the day, not a "wash down dinner" or "gulp while I play horseshoes in the backyard" beer. It consumes all of your attention as you consume it.

So in any case, it's worth more, in perception.

Of course there is the bottom line, which is, do you REALLY like it? In a lot of cases, no. I would not waste my money on any fancy, foreign, expensive, sour beer. I don't like sour beers. On the other hand, I do like many other styles of beer, like Stouts, IPAs, etc. I could certainly see myself spending a few dollars more for a rare and/or expensive beer like KBS, Pliny, Dark Lord, etc. It may be a one time thing, or it may be an annual event.

I don't consider them "have-to-have" beers, but sampling a treat beer can be a treat.

Then again, there are several COMMON beers that I like a lot, and often enjoy just as much as some of the fancy and expensive beers I've tried, like Bells Oberon, Bells Two Hearted, a well made Homebrew Wit, many homebrew IPA and APAs I've had, etc.

I don't think Big Beers are going to go away, but I think many people who broke into the craft beer scene a few years back are now deciding that maybe they've been there, done that, and can feel confident in their decision to pass on the expensive beers and just enjoy a quality, less expensive beer. They will sometimes hunt down that rare beer now and again, but not to the extend they once did.

Different strokes for different folks. There is a reason big beers are expensive, and there is a reason Founders sells a session IPA in a can. There is a need for a drinkable, yet flavorful beer that people can take to the beach, or camping, or wherever bottles are not allowed, or could more easily break.

Eloquently put.

 

[MindenMan]

I'm with you here, BIG beers? I don't get it either. There are those folks that love the BIG beers, DIPA's and the such. I think it is a "phase" people are going through. I mean no one any offense, please. There has been wheat beers in Europe for hundreds of years, and IIPA's, and BIG beers as well. And fairly soon, I believe, America will go nuts on another style, and then another... My wife is a hop head, and I was not. It was due to the IPA's' I had tasted were one dimensional, and to me were awful. But, after I tried other IPA's, some I enjoy drinking now.

 

[Galek]

For gifts and swaps I understand completely. Big Beers are usually more expensive, especially the bombers. Don't know what to get your beer friend? That big bottle is expensive, Imperial Russian Stout...sounds like it would be a good type.

There are those who see the high alcohol content and want that. Out of college I definitely fell for that on occasion, when I was only starting to get away from BMC but still wanted to at least get a buzz. I actually think this is where a lot of people are, just getting into craft beers and thinking bigger is better.

Lastly some are pretty good. I like a barleywine in the middle of winter, or to sip an Imperial stout over the course of a 2 hour movie before bed, I may drink 3-5 bombers of it over the year. I would never brew it though, no idea how I would get rid of 5 gallons of the stuff.

 

[headbanger]

I've got to side with Billy on this one, I've never had a properly aged "big" beer I didn't like. That said, I've brewed some of my own that were pretty dam hot, all but undrinkable, coming off the yeast. The same beer is some of the best I ever brewed after several months in the cooler, exhibiting flavor complexities you just won't get from "small" beers regardless.

 

[TheVenerableMead]

Bigs are really variable. I like the ones with heavy malt & caramel flavours. Old Foghorn Barleywine is a favourite. George Gale Prize Old, however, is a bit different and tastes a bit like port. Sam Smith's Yorkshire Stingo was kind a disappointment; not awful, but not what I expect from the Tadcaster brewery. I personally consider anything above 7% a big beer. Try a few more. You may find one you like.

 

[cfonnes]

Nothing like sipping a good barley wine or ris while sitting if front of a fire on a cold winter evening.

 

[Billy-Klubb]

Nothing like sipping a good barley wine or ris while sitting if front of a fire on a cold winter evening.

or right after mowing the lawn on a hot July afternoon! who's gonna beer bong some RIS with me?:rockin:

 

[Qhrumphf]

or right after mowing the lawn on a hot July afternoon! who's gonna beer bong some RIS with me?:rockin:

Why not skip the formalities and go eyedropper? Or go the fast route and just mainline it.

 

[Billy-Klubb]

Why not skip the formalities and go eyedropper? Or go the fast route and just mainline it.

I'm trying to bring back beer bongs for big beers.

true story: me my my brothers watched some wannabe "hardcore" try to beer bong some ABW around 9%. that kid ended up puking & passed out before the party got started.

 

[sfgoat]

I'm trying to bring back beer bongs for big beers.

true story: me my my brothers watched some wannabe "hardcore" try to beer bong some ABW around 9%. that kid ended up puking & passed out before the party got started.

Haven't done that kind of drinking since my early army days. Don't think I could handle it anymore. Lol.

 

[banesong]

Depends. They're becoming more common as a craft offering, and all the big guys are certainly sessionable, but they still get nowhere near the same amount of craft beer love as bigger beers.

I like beer overall, but love low (2-4) abv beers. I can drink a kolsch in the dead of winter. Admittedly, I have also drank a RIS after mowing the lawn too. Give me a mild, a bitter or a Scottish 60/- any day, any season.

 

[seabass07]

A lot of us like big beer and we buy them. So they keep making them. What's not to get about the "big beer frenzy"?

 

[gratus fermentatio]

I really enjoy the malt forward "big" beers. I'll sit & pound doppelbock all day long, even in the summer. I'll enjoy an RIS whilst grillin' & chillin' but I can't pound 'em. I've never brewed anything less than 7% ABV & usually shoot for about 8%, even with brown ale. I know it's a little outside the style, but I don't care, I like it that way. Being able to make a 9% brew that goes down just as smooth & tasty as a 4% brew is sort of my goal.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to get as drunk as I can as fast as I can, but I do like to feel it when I drink. When somebody is feeling a bit tipsy after 1 or 2 of my beers, it makes me feel like I'm doing things right.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Regards, GF.

 

[mattmmille]

IMO, there's a time and a place for all styles and who cares if you like a stout in the Summer...or a barleywine? I may not know art, but I know what I like. And if I like Elvis on black velvet, somebody will paint and sell it to me. I'm still learning about some styles and want to experience them all. My brother, on the other hand, likes warm Coors Light. I don't judge...much ;0)

 

[Laughing_Gnome_Invisible]

My brother, on the other hand, likes warm Coors Light. I don't judge...much ;0)

He should at least be congratulated for having an understanding about why so many crap beers are advertised as always being several degrees below zero. All you have to do now is show him a style that better suits his desire for taste!

 

[VApatriot]

I like a good barleywine every now and again or a belgian triple sometimes. What I don't get is the super hoppy beers. No, nothing to taste here but hops, lots, and lots, and lots of hops. Sure, a decent IPA is fine for me once in a while, but I like a more balanced beer, not just all bitterness. Well to each his own I guess.

 

[sfgoat]

Well to each his own I guess.

^^^^I think this is the big thing.

My original rant got a little off point but I consider myself a fan of all styles of beer as long as it's properly executed. My big feelings on this are that I get a few hate emails every once in awhile because I scored a beer low because they were poorly put together. Way too much complexity in some so the flavors are muddled or just plain disgusting because it seemed they made one additive way too prevalent. The last email I received was because I scored one low because it had doo much roasted barley that it tasted like eating coffee grounds right out the can with a spoon.

My recent dislike for these beers is because more often then not they are terrible. Even on a commercial level they tend to be aweful. Some are great and you'll never hear me say I won't try something I haven't had before in hopes that it will be good. But alas I was a bit knocked over during my original post and it came across a bit off.

 

[kaconga]

^^^^I think this is the big thing.

My original rant got a little off point but I consider myself a fan of all styles of beer as long as it's properly executed. My big feelings on this are that I get a few hate emails every once in awhile because I scored a beer low because they were poorly put together. Way too much complexity in some so the flavors are muddled or just plain disgusting because it seemed they made one additive way too prevalent. The last email I received was because I scored one low because it had doo much roasted barley that it tasted like eating coffee grounds right out the can with a spoon.

My recent dislike for these beers is because more often then not they are terrible. Even on a commercial level they tend to be aweful. Some are great and you'll never hear me say I won't try something I haven't had before in hopes that it will be good. But alas I was a bit knocked over during my original post and it came across a bit off.

Big beers can definitely be awful. I agree that many 9% and up beers are poorly executed. I feel the same way about beers below 4%. They always seem to be lacking in flavor when they don't have to be made that way. Overall I think there is just more beers and that means there are more mediocre beers. It probably is still at the same ratio though.

 

[fearwig]

You pay a lot for commercial craft beer in America, whether it's a big beer or not, so I think given that people tend to lean toward buying the stuff you sip over session ales. What you drink the most affects your tastes and preferences, and that affects trends on a large scale.

I didn't drink many small craft beers until I started homebrewing. I still don't often buy craft beers under 5% unless I have a very high expectation of quality (I did buy Boulevard's Pop-Up Session IPA last week and was impressed). I'm more likely to make a 4% beer than to buy one.

 

[Laughing_Gnome_Invisible]

I still don't often buy craft beers under 5% unless I have a very high expectation of quality (I did buy Boulevard's Pop-Up Session IPA last week and was impressed). I'm more likely to make a 4% beer than to buy one.

+1 This is exactly why I started brewing! I didn't want to pay an arm and a leg for an import or lower ABV session bitter. It was really that simple.

 

[mikeasu]

+1 This is exactly why I started brewing! I didn't want to pay an arm and a leg for an import or lower ABV session bitter. It was really that simple.

Beginning to see your point. Kegged my first mild last week, almost nailed my target at 3.9% ABV - great toasty/biscuity flavor, lightly hopped - but if I found an similar import 6 pack at Total Wine, probably run me $9 - think my ingredient cost for this mild easily came to less than $30.

 

[sfgoat]

Beginning to see your point. Kegged my first mild last week, almost nailed my target at 3.9% ABV - great toasty/biscuity flavor, lightly hopped - but if I found an similar import 6 pack at Total Wine, probably run me $9 - think my ingredient cost for this mild easily came to less than $30.

Start buying in bulk and you can get that cost down to $15.

 

[mikeasu]

Start buying in bulk and you can get that cost down to $15.

Ahh, then I have to deal with storage of ingredients, etc...at better than .55/bottle (ingredient cost / 48 - know I can get 48 12 oz bottles out of a batch), was very impressed. Of course, it's on draft, so I'm pulling 16 oz pints or more...

 

[fearwig]

If you buy sacks of grain and pounds of hops, your prices can really be crazy low on smaller or especially low-hops beers, $10-15 for a 5 gallon batch. A 1.050 hefe is like $8. Grain $0.80-$1/lb versus $2/lb, hops $1/oz instead of $3/oz--you really pay a huge premium for small quantities.

I did struggle with storage this spring. I was hanging my grain in ikea bags from nails in the basement rafters until the mice figured out how to climb along the electrical wiring and down the bag handles. Once the first one figured it out I had to move them, they were having little mouse parties in there. At least they had the courtesy to pull the grains out of the bags this time, rather than climbing inside and pooping in my wheat! They even squeezed through the lid of a closed rubbermaid tote. Amazing. My cat can't kill them fast enough.

Anyway, one sack of grain fills two homer buckets almost perfectly, so I stocked up on those and it's all good. As long as you keep grain dry and not unreasonably hot, it's good for a year or maybe a lot more--if the mice don't eat it first. My wife is pretty sick of all the leaf hops in the second freezer, though!

 

[mikeasu]

Anyway, one sack of grain fills two homer buckets almost perfectly, so I stocked up on those and it's all good. As long as you keep grain dry and not unreasonably hot, it's good for a year or maybe a lot more--if the mice don't eat it first. My wife is pretty sick of all the leaf hops in the second freezer, though!

That's all unmilled grain lasting a year, correct? Just gotten into all grain the past year, was wondering how long my crushed grains would last before brewing w/o going bad a bit - like, could I buy everything I need for a batch, make a starter one weekend, and brew the next? Right now, I tend to buy and mill the grains at the LHBS and brew the next day. If I do a starter, I make an earlier trip the week before to get the yeast and extract.

 

[Qhrumphf]

That's all unmilled grain lasting a year, correct? Just gotten into all grain the past year, was wondering how long my crushed grains would last before brewing w/o going bad a bit - like, could I buy everything I need for a batch, make a starter one weekend, and brew the next? Right now, I tend to buy and mill the grains at the LHBS and brew the next day. If I do a starter, I make an earlier trip the week before to get the yeast and extract.

Yes, the shelf life of crushed grain is substabtially less. You should be fine going a week with crushed grain. If it's a couple months I'd be concerned.

 

[fearwig]

That's all unmilled grain lasting a year, correct? Just gotten into all grain the past year, was wondering how long my crushed grains would last before brewing w/o going bad a bit - like, could I buy everything I need for a batch, make a starter one weekend, and brew the next? Right now, I tend to buy and mill the grains at the LHBS and brew the next day. If I do a starter, I make an earlier trip the week before to get the yeast and extract.

Crushed grains are "freshest" when "fresh" but it's really all perceptual, there's no definite point at which they become bad, just think "use ASAP". If you have a reason to wait a week, that's fine. Unmilled grains are good for a very long time, I think one year is very conservative but it's a commonly stated figure. I don't buy more base grain than I can use in a year.

I would not throw out unmilled grains that are a year old, especially e.g. my sack of crystal 20 that I just whittle away at--I'm not looking for delicate aromatics from crystal and it's just ~5% of most recipes. I would not overpurchase Maris Otter or biscuit or something I expect a certain malt character from.

To answer your question you can definitely keep them a week, it's no problem. I recommend getting a cheap corona/drill setup like I have though, it'll make you happy!