So just wondering what are some of the biggest reasons stopping some of the most experienced people on here from setting up their own shop? A lot of the recipes on here blow away even some of the best craft beers on the market. So is it Risk?, no desire to go to the next level? or make a job out of it?
What Stops You From Going Pro?
- Thread starter Steve3730
- Start date
Help Support Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum:
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2008
- Messages
- 65,431
- Reaction score
- 10,793
I prefer to make the most amount of money I can for the least amount of work.
Not the opposite.
Not the opposite.
BrewerBrad82
Well-Known Member
Ive been working on it for a few years. For me, the single biggest thing is funding. It is kind of a catch 22... Its hard to find investors if you do not have a building secured, and it is impossible to secure a building without proof of funds.
Assuming you mean a micro brewery:
Money, money, money.
Regulations
Time
Research into equipment, recipes etc.
Property
Taxes
Money
Drunks
Custodial duties
Money
Employees
Health care
Money
Oh and did I mention that it is very expensive to start a microbrewery??
Money, money, money.
Regulations
Time
Research into equipment, recipes etc.
Property
Taxes
Money
Drunks
Custodial duties
Money
Employees
Health care
Money
Oh and did I mention that it is very expensive to start a microbrewery??
Because I enjoy brewing once a month or so. I don't think I'd enjoy doing it every day.
Like others have said i make more money doing what I currently do. If I had $500k+ to throw at it maybe....but then it would be a business with brewers highered and me keeping my job
Steve3730
Well-Known Member
I looked into it a little after reading an article about a local nanobrewery that is expanding and what they started with. 5bbl system was about 60-70k, rent where they were at was about 2k a month and then of course other cost unknown like,licensing,insurance,llc,etc.
But that just got me thinking of what stops a seasoned homebrewer? Is it more risk or keeping hobby and work separate
But that just got me thinking of what stops a seasoned homebrewer? Is it more risk or keeping hobby and work separate
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2008
- Messages
- 65,431
- Reaction score
- 10,793
Interview only the tall brewers and they won't have to be highered.
HLSheppard
Well-Known Member
An aversion to poverty.
There was a thread on this site where someone documented their startup. If I recall correctly, they had originally budgeted something like $200,000 before they opened they were above $350,000 and almost a year past their target opening date.
It was a small microbrewery/bar.
Although I would love to try one it is way, way, way beyond what I could afford to start.
imasickboy
Drinkasaurus extraordinarius
Why would I want to do industrial cleaning for crap money? Because that's what going pro will be like.
Besides, I get to reward myself by drinking every drop of the beer I brew at home.
Besides, I get to reward myself by drinking every drop of the beer I brew at home.
oceanic_brew
Well-Known Member
I don't wanna put all the breweries around here out of business.......
But seriously I've been considering it. There's 9 breweries here with a booming craft beer scene and all seem to be doing very well with their tap rooms packed and all the craft beer events sold out.
Honestly the only thing holding me back is the fact that I've taken the one thing I loved the most in life which is my passion for music and turned it into a 20 year pursuit of a dream that's by today's standards absolute lunacy worse than the dream of commercial industrial cleaning or "brewing".
Our band gets rave reviews and sells albums all over the world, every show we play we have line-ups at the merch table and many comments stating its the best performance they've seen around....yet I will never make a living off of it and we still need to put in personal funds to travel to shows.
I'm concerned that brewing would become another thing like that in my life and in ways if I could ever please anyone with beer the way I do with music then there is no greater definition of success.
Very concerned especially since I can't get it out of my head and most likely will be approaching investors within a few months.
And here's why I wanna do it:
The music industry has left me bitter, carpentry has left me underpaid and under appreciated, but I've only been met with respect and friendliness within the craft beer industry here. People actually value it as opposed to wanting it for $ .99 as quick as possible on their iPhone or built as cheap as possible by whomever is fastest.
I know brewing and the industry has its own set of issues but it's very appealing to me considering my experiences.
But seriously I've been considering it. There's 9 breweries here with a booming craft beer scene and all seem to be doing very well with their tap rooms packed and all the craft beer events sold out.
Honestly the only thing holding me back is the fact that I've taken the one thing I loved the most in life which is my passion for music and turned it into a 20 year pursuit of a dream that's by today's standards absolute lunacy worse than the dream of commercial industrial cleaning or "brewing".
Our band gets rave reviews and sells albums all over the world, every show we play we have line-ups at the merch table and many comments stating its the best performance they've seen around....yet I will never make a living off of it and we still need to put in personal funds to travel to shows.
I'm concerned that brewing would become another thing like that in my life and in ways if I could ever please anyone with beer the way I do with music then there is no greater definition of success.
Very concerned especially since I can't get it out of my head and most likely will be approaching investors within a few months.
And here's why I wanna do it:
The music industry has left me bitter, carpentry has left me underpaid and under appreciated, but I've only been met with respect and friendliness within the craft beer industry here. People actually value it as opposed to wanting it for $ .99 as quick as possible on their iPhone or built as cheap as possible by whomever is fastest.
I know brewing and the industry has its own set of issues but it's very appealing to me considering my experiences.
nettekdl
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2015
- Messages
- 245
- Reaction score
- 48
I have the money to start up, but what's stopped me to this point is just not wanting to turn a hobby into a job. I love to brew, but I also love brewing on my own schedule. I'm not sure how I feel about having to brew on a strict schedule, I feel it may take the fun out of it for me. Also I hate paper work.
Steve3730
Well-Known Member
So sounds like most don't want to ruin their love and some don't want to risk the money, definitely makes sense.
I'm in a situation where I have the opportunity to do something. My brother and his two brother inlaws are interested in going in on a nano brewery. I have been brewing for 3 years but would probably be about another year before we'd open. They would all run a part of the business, one sales, one maintenance, one general operations and I would be in charge of the production and my sister inlaw would handle the accounting. And we'd all take part in general labor
Obviously the working with family issue is there but I'm a single guy with no kids with probably the lowest risk opportunity to have my own business that will ever come up.
All of us have opened and ran or still run our own businesses, and each role everyone is playing that is their actual profession accept me obviously.
So do I pass this up and play it safe? Or would I be nuts?
I'm in a situation where I have the opportunity to do something. My brother and his two brother inlaws are interested in going in on a nano brewery. I have been brewing for 3 years but would probably be about another year before we'd open. They would all run a part of the business, one sales, one maintenance, one general operations and I would be in charge of the production and my sister inlaw would handle the accounting. And we'd all take part in general labor
Obviously the working with family issue is there but I'm a single guy with no kids with probably the lowest risk opportunity to have my own business that will ever come up.
All of us have opened and ran or still run our own businesses, and each role everyone is playing that is their actual profession accept me obviously.
So do I pass this up and play it safe? Or would I be nuts?
oceanic_brew
Well-Known Member
If I had a person around me that was as into this as I am I would be all for it.
You have a bunch of people. If you can trust these people you would be nuts to pass it up.
Singletrack
Because it's judgement that defeats us.
Sounds fun and exciting. Consider the down side. Will you be okay if it fails? If so, then go for it. What a great experience, if nothing else.
I have a day job that I cannot give up, and a hobby I enjoy. I will not be your competition. There are many parts of the brewery business that I could not tolerate, but you may have partners to handle those, while you have all the fun -- depending on what you consider fun.
I have a day job that I cannot give up, and a hobby I enjoy. I will not be your competition. There are many parts of the brewery business that I could not tolerate, but you may have partners to handle those, while you have all the fun -- depending on what you consider fun.
Ironically I thought about opening a microbrewery in '96 when I started homebrewing, but didn't have the capital. Now that I have the capital, it'd would take me many years of backbreaking work to make annually brewing what I currently take home salary-wise, not even including the benefits or bonuses. The risk is not anywhere near the reward for me.
It's the same reasons why I never became a chef - lots of work, crappy hours, so-so pay and it would suck much of the joy from my hobby.
It's the same reasons why I never became a chef - lots of work, crappy hours, so-so pay and it would suck much of the joy from my hobby.
Yeastieboy
Well-Known Member
$$$
Steve3730
Well-Known Member
Ya this group of people I'd trust with my life.
I like brewing too much to want to do it for a living.
I'm pretty lazy, and like making $$$ for working.
I'm not a fan of "industrial cleaning" which is what pro brewing really is. I also don't want to make $20,000/year, if I'm lucky. I'd like to make four times that, and do a lot less work.
Of course, I'm mostly retired, and don't really want to work at all. Brewing is a great hobby. If I was forced to do it to make ends meet, I'd hate it.
I also love to cook at home, but never want to own a restaurant. I make soap for family and friends, but would never do it for a living. Too much work, for far too little pay, for my tastes.
I'm pretty lazy, and like making $$$ for working.
I'm not a fan of "industrial cleaning" which is what pro brewing really is. I also don't want to make $20,000/year, if I'm lucky. I'd like to make four times that, and do a lot less work.
Of course, I'm mostly retired, and don't really want to work at all. Brewing is a great hobby. If I was forced to do it to make ends meet, I'd hate it.
I also love to cook at home, but never want to own a restaurant. I make soap for family and friends, but would never do it for a living. Too much work, for far too little pay, for my tastes.
Making the same thing over and over.
kadozen
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't want to set up my own place. Too much headache. I'd be much happier working in someone else's brewery.
Natdavis777
Well-Known Member
Huge overhead. Biggest part for me. I feel like Im a great homebrewer, but doubt my abilities as a big brewer. A friend of mine who has ran 3 breweries and one of his own struggled on my 10 gal setup. Different worlds. He can walk into a 30BBL system and run it like nothing though.
Honestly, I dont want to make a hobby a full time job. If I secured my retirement early, then yes I would take a stab at it. But just as a run of mill homebrewer, I dont feel like putting up the collateral for a possible minimal returrn (thinking conservatively)
Honestly, I dont want to make a hobby a full time job. If I secured my retirement early, then yes I would take a stab at it. But just as a run of mill homebrewer, I dont feel like putting up the collateral for a possible minimal returrn (thinking conservatively)
I would in a second..... if I had a crapload of cash and could treat it as a small scale hobby. However, as of yet, I have not stumbled upon a bunch of money. The simple fact is that brewing pays crap and it is a tremendous amount of work. I am a teacher....... and I am saying I can't take the financial hit of a brewers salary in addition to the extended hours of the job. Twice as much work, half as much money.........
I can have a job, brew as much as I want - with no pressure - GIVE my beer away to my friends.... and, in the end, I am STILL money ahead.
I can have a job, brew as much as I want - with no pressure - GIVE my beer away to my friends.... and, in the end, I am STILL money ahead.
myerstyson
Well-Known Member
Salary potential and lack of (pro-level) ability. 
MaryB
Well-Known Member
Red tape, fees, more red tape, more fees... then the need for a building, local red tape, dealing with anti alcohol locals...
madscientist451
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a great opportunity to me. Is every one involved putting up the same amount of money? How will decisions be made? Is everyone going to be on a board of directors and be able to vote up or down on proposals?
Location is everything, do you have a location? Do you really think you'll be selling beer in just one year from now?
And everyone will "take part" in general labor? How are you going to enforce that? You going to put in a time clock?
As the brewer, you will have more responsibility on your shoulders than the other individuals. If the beer sucks, your brewery will close.
Put money in the budget to hire a professional brewing consultant to help you get started. 3 years brewing experienced isn't all that much and brewing on a 7 or 10 bbl system isn't the same as brewing on your propane burner in your garage.
If the brewery isn't successful, will you be financially damaged or is it no big deal to you?
I know 4 people (or groups) who started their own breweries/brewpubs. One went bust and now runs a homebrew shop and is successful; one started with a nano out of a garage and is expanding to a brew pub but has had numerous delays; one started with one brew pub and now has four and regional distribution and sells "craft" soda as well; the most recent started a 7 bbl brewery with a bunch of buddies and family investors and now they have 50+ keg accounts a, busy tasting room, just switched from self distributing to using a distributor, bought more tanks, and hired extra staff to brew around the clock to keep up.
If you are in, or close to an urban area where people have disposable income, and there is a drinking culture, there is still a lot of growth potential for a startup local brewery. I'd say go for it and good luck to you.
Steve3730
Well-Known Member
Very good points and we are in the very early stages right now, So tracking labor things of that sort have not been talked about yet. We would all put up equal parts yes and get a small business loan in all our names.
Right now we are in the homework stage all doing our research on what is needed to do it and of course my major homework is brewing. Yes I know the make or break of the entire place will fall on my production. Hence why i'm researching on here why other hobbiest haven't done it. Oh and a year was just an estimate of the absolute earliest time. We do not have a location yet one of the partners is friends with our local alderman, he is going to meet with him for lunch this week and talk to him about potential locations in the area.
My next step is to see about working as an apprentice at a brewery that one of the partners has done work for. I know I can fine tune recipes to a point on my system I know I can't go from running my propane burner to turning the key on a big bbl system
beergolf
Well-Known Member
Why ruin a good hobby?
For years I wanted to open a public nanobrewery. Over the last year or two I have really reconsidered the biggest question...."Why?" At this point I can't think of a single "good" reason to open a brewery. About the only reason I would do it would be to build it up as a successful brewery and sell it at a nice profit. Far too many headaches for far too little money. Plus my plan was to start it when I retire from the fire department. I am starting to realize that when I retire I don't want to work. I want to surf, ski, travel, fish, as well as brew beer. There just isn't time for everything I want to do!!
So now my plan is to take the money that I wanted to sink into a commercial brewery and basically build my garage and back yard into a brewery/beer garden. Thinking of someplace open to my friends and friends of friends that will be open 2x a month when I choose. Same deal as a small brewery....tasters, pints, and growler fills. I can brew what I want, when I want, and how I want!!
So now my plan is to take the money that I wanted to sink into a commercial brewery and basically build my garage and back yard into a brewery/beer garden. Thinking of someplace open to my friends and friends of friends that will be open 2x a month when I choose. Same deal as a small brewery....tasters, pints, and growler fills. I can brew what I want, when I want, and how I want!!
I personally would run from that. But I don't like to mix money and family/friends. Had a couple good relationships ruined by money.
I know this feeling! My band sells a few thousand records and we tour Europe, UK and Ireland but it is still only a hobby. I think I was fortunate to have met Mudhoney when I was 18 and discover that they also had jobs - that was the moment I realised that it will only ever be fun and not a career choice.
As for brewing as a career, just today a job has come up at a brewery an old friend works at as a partner brewer. I'm so tempted but it would mean stopping my teacher training and moving to a very small town. And moving away from my girlfriend... Dilemma!
Folks have already said it; not wanting to make less money or kill the enjoyment of a hobby. I do have to say that if I had more $$$$ and didn't have to work and could afford to gamble on a small local brewery then I'd likely try it. But it would really be a well funded hobby in that scenario. For now I have bills to pay and mouths to feed and am in a fairly lucrative career that lets me do those things and enjoy this hobby.
I'll maintain the status quo for now. But if I ever hit the lottery..... LOOK OUT!
I'll maintain the status quo for now. But if I ever hit the lottery..... LOOK OUT!
Thursday I made 12 batches of mead, and a little cider too. I'm barely recovered. This is a hobby. I don't want to cook, garden, or grow coral for a living either.
Pretty much everyone I've met underestimated how much going pro would suck. And pretty much everyone I've met ignored me when I told them that.
So...good luck?
Cheers
--Michael
Pretty much everyone I've met underestimated how much going pro would suck. And pretty much everyone I've met ignored me when I told them that.
So...good luck?
Cheers
--Michael
actech
Well-Known Member
yep all 3 things
MaryB
Well-Known Member
Pro's I know do it for the love of the beer, not for the money! Small local brewery is barely scraping by but they refuse to quit! Opening a brew pub has helped them out. I stopped in for a burger and a beer and talked with the owner for 30 minutes, got a tour of their brewery... They do pretty small batches right now, some as small as 10 gallons of their specialty off the wall hop attack beers.
Similar threads
