Tranfering from one keg to another - I don't understand these directions?

[Fishin-Jay]

Another efficient way of racking beer from one keg to another is to siphon the beer from one keg to another. For that place the source keg above the destination keg. Connect the gas-in of the destination keg and the gas-in of the source keg to the same CO2 regulator. This results in the same pressure in the destination and source keg. Now take a long jumper hose and first connect it to the bev-out of the destination keg and then to the bev-out of the source keg. Nothing is flowing yet. To get the siphon started disconnect the CO2 on the destination keg and briefly pull the pressure relieve valve on that keg. Now that the pressure is slightly lower in the destination keg the beer will start flowing and the siphon is started. Reconnect the gas-in of the destination keg to the CO2 system so the CO2 from that keg can flow into the source keg. This process will take a while, but you don't need to monitor it.

I think I'm having a particularly dense moment, but I've read and re-read these instructions about 10 times and I can't seem to wrap my head around how to do this. Has anybody ever taken pictures of this process?

 

[Demon]

- Purge receiving keg with co2
- hook up a line connecting the liquid out on sending keg to the liquid out on receiving keg
- Leave sending keg hooked up to co2
- Pull pressure relief on receiving keg periodically
- Counter-pressure keg to keg transfer complete

 

[Yooper]

- Purge receiving keg with co2
- hook up a line connecting the liquid out on sending keg to the liquid out on receiving keg
- Leave sending keg hooked up to co2
- Pull pressure relief on receiving keg periodically
- Counter-pressure keg to keg transfer complete

Exactly! The easy way to do it is with two black QDs and a length of beerline. Hook those up, and then put one on the "out" of the keg that has the beer in it. Don't move that first keg, as you'll stir up the sediment.

Put some gas on the receiving keg, just to purge it out, and then hook it up the second black QD on that keg. Pull the pressure relief valve.

The beer will flow. Pull the pressure relief valve every so often on the receiving keg, to keep the flow going.

One tip that I found works best for me is to turn the gas down on the regulator to the sending keg, as it helps reduce foaming. About 5-6 psi works good.

 

[Fishin-Jay]

Thanks folks! That's way easier!

The directions I pasted came from the lagering tutorial. The part about hooking the receiving keg back up to the CO2 while transferring has me baffled. Why wouldn't the pressure just equalize once both gas ports are connected to the same source? And, if you're using CO2 to push the beer, why does one keg have to be higher than the other? The physics of those instructions just aren't adding up for me.

 

[Yooper]

Thanks folks! That's way easier!

The directions I pasted came from the lagering tutorial. The part about hooking the receiving keg back up to the CO2 while transferring has me baffled. Why wouldn't the pressure just equalize once both gas ports are connected to the same source? And, if you're using CO2 to push the beer, why does one keg have to be higher than the other? The physics of those instructions just aren't adding up for me.

You're right. Those instructions don't make sense, and of course it doesn't have to be higher. You've got it!

 

[tenbricks]

You're right. Those instructions don't make sense, and of course it doesn't have to be higher. You've got it!

You're right, it doesn't have to be higher for your method, which is just to use CO2 to push beer from one keg to another.

What the lagering tutorial is talking about is something different, siphoning from one keg to another, and as for any siphon, the donating keg obviously will need to be higher. The CO2 doesn't do the pushing. The two liquid out ports are connected, and the two gas in ports are connected - it's a sealed system. As the liquid siphons from the higher to lower through the liquid ports, the gas returns from the lower back up to the higher keg through the gas ports, which is why you have to hook up the gas again. Pressure will stay the same throughout, and eventually an equilibrium is reached with the all the liquid in the lower keg, CO2 in the upper.

I'm not saying this is a better method, and I've never tried it. It is clever, though. I think I'd connect the two gas-out ports directly during the transfer, rather than have them connected through the gas manifold, but I'm sure it works fine either way as long as there isn't a check valve.

 

[SpeedYellow]

Jay - is your receiving keg already pressurized or is it empty? Different procedure based on your answer. To wit:

If it's already pressurized, then simply hook up the liquid out to liquid out, I.e. the two black QDs connected by beer line. Nothing will happen, of course, since both kegs are hooked up to the line CO2 at the same pressure. Now simply turn off the CO2 to the receiving keg, and slowly release a little co2 from the receiving keg with the relief valve to get beer flowing. Release a little pressure a bit at a time until done.

But if the receiving keg isn't already pressurized, that procedure would waste co2. Here, just release almost all the pressure from the sender, then hook up the liquid lines. Then just push gas over by pressurizing the sender to a couple psi. You can purge the receiving keg first if desired.

 

[SpeedYellow]

By the way Jay, the siphoning process does indeed work, although IMHO it's too much trouble having to elevate a keg. Think of it this way, when you siphon a liquid normally, both the sender and receiving vessel are at exactly 1 bar. In the keg-siphoning process, both vessels are again at the same pressure (more like 1.8 bar) as long as both are connected to the same co2 line. If they weren't at identical pressure, you're not siphoning with gravity; you're pushing with pressure.

The process in your first post to be perfectly accurate and clear to me. Just a hassle. Oh, but actually that process as described won't work if you use a manifold that has gas check valves. Problem is that liquid wants to flow down to the receiver, but then pressure would build in the receiver if you have check valves. I use check valves in every line, so that siphon method simply wouldn't work.