Ok, so I acquired a spunding valve. I want to use it. So what are the basics and what styles benefit from it the most? And what can I expect come time to keg?
Spunding.. when, why, what styles?
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From what I gather the styles that aren’t dependent on a particular flavor from the yeast are the ones you want to spund.
Well best reason for a spunding valve is to naturally carbonate the beer in a keg instead of using CO2. To do this, you need to transfer the beer to the keg before it's finished fermenting, usually 4-6 points from final gravity. People do this by doing a fast ferment test, after pitching your yeast, you pull off maybe 500 ml of wort and store in a sanitized container and swirl it every time you pass by than after a few days, take a gravity reading of it...once it's done, it will give you an idea of what the FG of main batc should be.
Most people that use this method also cut a few inches off the dip tube in keg, because you are transferring beer before cold crashing it, so will have lots of trub. They use the keg to carbonate in and once carbed, transfer to a serving keg via closed transfer. From low oxygen site I follow, they do ales at 30 psi at 68 degrees (set spunding valve to 30) and lagers at 10 psi at 48 degrees. Then if pressure builds up above your set valve, CO2 escapes out of valve.
Another option is carbing a beer with priming sugar in a keg, using a spunding valve to keep it from being over carbed. This option you would do when beer was fully fermented and crashed. You use a lot less sugar to prime a keg than you do for bottles, so use a priming calculator with this method.
Lastly, lots of spunding valves are prone to leaking. So I would test yours first. Fill empty keg with 30 PSI, put spunding valve on and set to 35. Then wait a few days to see if pressure on valve drops below 30, if it does, it's leaking. I have gone through 4 before settling on the DuoTight one sold by More Beer, but I don't use it a lot.
Most people that use this method also cut a few inches off the dip tube in keg, because you are transferring beer before cold crashing it, so will have lots of trub. They use the keg to carbonate in and once carbed, transfer to a serving keg via closed transfer. From low oxygen site I follow, they do ales at 30 psi at 68 degrees (set spunding valve to 30) and lagers at 10 psi at 48 degrees. Then if pressure builds up above your set valve, CO2 escapes out of valve.
Another option is carbing a beer with priming sugar in a keg, using a spunding valve to keep it from being over carbed. This option you would do when beer was fully fermented and crashed. You use a lot less sugar to prime a keg than you do for bottles, so use a priming calculator with this method.
Lastly, lots of spunding valves are prone to leaking. So I would test yours first. Fill empty keg with 30 PSI, put spunding valve on and set to 35. Then wait a few days to see if pressure on valve drops below 30, if it does, it's leaking. I have gone through 4 before settling on the DuoTight one sold by More Beer, but I don't use it a lot.
OP
OP
My conical is good up to 15 psi, is there any benefit to setting the spunding valve at 5 psi and letting it roll throughout fermentation in the conical then transferring to a serving keg?
Yes. Do that.
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That will work fine if that is enough carbonation for your taste/beer style. If you want to naturally carb by spunding to a higher PSI, then the keg transfer method outlined in post #3 is the way to go. I generally go for 30 PSI at 60F. This puts my beers at around 12 PSI when crashed to 30F, which is how I like to serve the styles I usually make.
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Or if you wanna make a lager without having to ferment at low temps. Im gonna give it a try this weekend.
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This is often brought up but not exactly true.
Lager yeast see hydrostatic pressure from the head pressure caused by the liquid height in the tall cylindroconical fermenting tanks used in large commercial breweries. Hydrostatic pressure is not the same as gauge pressure or simply the pressure inside the tank vs out. Secondly, pressure directly effects the solubility of CO2 and higher pressure causes the gas to build up in the yeast cells which they don't particularly like. Fortunately though there are currents in these large tanks caused by temperature differentials as well as CO2 evolution that forces the beer to circulate from top to bottom and back. At any given time the yeast is only subjected to the pressure that is specific to the height they are at in the liquid column and that is always changing. Therefore they can give off that built up CO2 as they near the top of the tank otherwise the yeast would become stressed and under perform.
These conditions are specific to the physics of tall columns and head/hydrostatic pressure and cannot be replicated by simply adding gauge pressure to your fermentation vessel. This idea homebrew scale presure fermentation has been roaming these forums for a while but is a complete misunderstanding of the actual process and detrimental to yeast health as well as your final product.
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I will put this to the test this weekend. Dont have a tall fermenting vessel but i do have a way to pressure ferment some lager yeast at ale temps to see if it really does have an impact on the beer.
I always advise not to cut dip tubes. They make floating dip tubes now that go on easily and are a great option. You can always swap out for floating dip tubes and keep your original dip tubes intact. If a year from now you change your mind and want to go back, you can always swap your original dip tubes back in. You can’t “un-cut” what you cut.
Corny kegs are a dying animal. The big companies aren’t using them anymore and have replaced them with all around cheaper “bag in a box” systems. Kegs and parts for them are also going to get harder to come by - and as many have learned, parts are not necessarily interchangeable one keg to the next.
Yes and no, while the soft drink industry has replaced corny kegs with plastic lined cardboard boxes, the homebrew community has evolved into a substantial cornnelius keg market. So much so that new and better versions are now being manufactured. Hence Torpedo kegs, a new and better made version to the corny keg. Torpedo kegs use the same type QC fittings and top lid as their predecessor the corny. Additionally corny kegs are still being manufactured and sold to satisfy the homebrew market. I have recently purchased brand new cornies and Torpedo kegs. I use them for aging meads, wines and beer. Parts, orings, lids and dip tubes will continue to be available for many years to come. If you haven't checked out the Torpedo kegs, they are definitely worth taking a look at. I especially like the 1.5 and 2.5 gal versions. But fear not, the corny will be around for a long time.
I've just recently started fermenting in kegs...and even more recently started doing it under pressure...What I've observed so far...
Hefes don't like pressure...well mine certainly did not. Prevents any "banana and clove"...so use a blow off tube the first few days/week...then spund to whatever target carb pressure you like (using the carb chart).
Ales in general like yeast "expression"...probably best to also use a blow off tube first...or spund to a very low psi ( 5? ) from the start. No real benefit from running ales at higher temps under higher pressure since most everyone's home is probably in an acceptable temp range for ales anyway.
Lagers...spund right away at ale temps ( 15psi? ) or perhaps even set at target carbonation pressure right away? Pressure seems to prevent negative lager yeast "expressions" that would normally result from the higher fermentation temps.
Hefes don't like pressure...well mine certainly did not. Prevents any "banana and clove"...so use a blow off tube the first few days/week...then spund to whatever target carb pressure you like (using the carb chart).
Ales in general like yeast "expression"...probably best to also use a blow off tube first...or spund to a very low psi ( 5? ) from the start. No real benefit from running ales at higher temps under higher pressure since most everyone's home is probably in an acceptable temp range for ales anyway.
Lagers...spund right away at ale temps ( 15psi? ) or perhaps even set at target carbonation pressure right away? Pressure seems to prevent negative lager yeast "expressions" that would normally result from the higher fermentation temps.
OP
OP
Hypothetically, what if I were to brew an ipa that was getting dry hopped and spund at 5psi, come time to dry hop, release the pressure, dry hops in, close back up for a couple days then close transfer. Will I get lots of foaming with the dry hop? Will this process help avoid oxygen? Or is this a bad idea an stick to using it with regular ales or lagers.
I would suggest just a blow off tube to start. At hop time, just open and drop. Without any carbonation yet I don't think you will get any foaming during the hop drop. Then spund at 5 to finish?
Since the beer is still fermenting...any oxygen exposure will get negated by the yeast still going and will be expelled anyway.....but that is just a guess
OP
OP
Got it. That makes sense. Thanks
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Spot on man. Hefes want that yeast esters in there, ales, depending on what you make, im doing a honey ale saturday and gonna pressure ferment it cuz i want nothing but honey and hops in flavor. Lagers are just pure malt and hops, so pressure is its best friend. Im gonna try a hefe at 5 psi to see if i can get a erdinger type of ferment from it.
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