signs of bad cylinder or just empty

[kelogs]

Hello,

I left it a couple months ago on around 2 bar; couple of days ago pressure was 1.2 bar inside the keg and 0 inside the cylinder. I have also noticed cylinder spigot mostly tripping; when pressed down a bit it would feel normal again in its rotation motions. This is a ~ 10 kg (22 lb) cylinder only used with 6-7 kegs of 50 l (13 gal). I think there is a slow-ish leak between regulator keg line output and final cider tap somewhere which has drained that huge cylinder over two months ? Is the cylinder's spigot behaviour normal when empty or is that a suspect as well ?

 

[homebeerbrewer]

First, where is your cylinder? If it's in a cold environment, don't pay attention to the gauge. If it's warm (room temp), it will read accurately.

The other possibility is that it is a leak, and is now empty.

 

[kelogs]

It's in a warm cellar, and the regulator has always indicated 25+ bar pressure inside the cylinder. Also, increasing keg pressure via regulator dial does nothing. I have not attempted to decrease it because it is already lowish.

 

[VikeMan]

I left it a couple months ago on around 2 bar; couple of days ago pressure was 1.2 bar inside the keg and 0 inside the cylinder.

First, where is your cylinder? If it's in a cold environment, don't pay attention to the gauge. If it's warm (room temp), it will read accurately.

If the high pressure gauge is functioning properly and reads 0, the cylinder is empty, regardless of temperature.

 

[IslandLizard]

Weighing the (bare) tank will tell you how much (liquid) CO2 is left in the tank, after subtracting the tare weight (TW is engraved in the neck).

 

[bracconiere]

(TW is engraved in the neck).

if you're lucky....

 

[day_trippr]

if you're lucky....

Hmm? Have you received a cylinder without a tare weight stamp? Seems rather mandatory.
Between all the welding, cutting and brewing tanks I've used I've never had one without a tare stamp...

Cheers!

 

[bracconiere]

Have you received a cylinder without a tare weight stamp?

most of the tanks i get don't have a TW stamp... my current one did, but it's alluminum, steel tanks usually don't have a TW stamp....

 

[day_trippr]

Yet, all my steel tanks have TW stamps...

Cheers!

 

[bracconiere]

Yet, all my steel tanks have TW stamps...

Cheers!

i usually have to ask for one with one, and most of the time they tell me they don't have any...


(of course where i get my swaps, they usually only fill them to 18lbs, so there's that too...)

 

[day_trippr]

Ok, I was partially in error. Along with three aluminum 5 pound CO2 tanks I have a 20 pound steel CO2 siphon tank, a 40 cubic foot steel mixed gas tank for beergas, a 20 cubic foot steel oxygen tank ( I think it's an E size) and an 80 cubic foot steel MIG gas mix tank. The oxygen cylinder is the only one of the bunch sans a tare stamp. I could see how the beergas, oxygen and MIG tanks could go without tare stamps as they are filled by pressure not weight, so I guess it's the luck of the draw, but anything that's going to be filled with CO2 should have a tare...

Cheers!

 

[bracconiere]

Ok, I was partially in error. Along with three aluminum 5 pound CO2 tanks I have a 20 pound steel CO2 siphon tank, a 40 cubic foot steel mixed gas tank for beergas, a 20 cubic foot steel oxygen tank ( I think it's an E size) and an 80 cubic foot steel MIG gas mix tank. The oxygen cylinder is the only one of the bunch sans a tare stamp. I could see how the beergas, oxygen and MIG tanks could go without tare stamps as they are filled by pressure not weight, so I guess it's the luck of the draw...

Cheers!

well my current tank has a TW stamp..

 

[homebeerbrewer]

If the high pressure gauge is functioning properly and reads 0, the cylinder is empty, regardless of temperature.

I guess I missed the 0 part, but you're right.

 

[kelogs]

my main concern here is that spigot on top of the cylinder... maybe the regulator went bad and the cylinder can not be closed any longer . i don't think it should have gone empty so fast...
Weighing it - yes, if I can find such markings and if I estimate the regulator's weight correctly- i am scared to take it off.

 

[IslandLizard]

Over the years I've found these to be the main causes of "empty_tank syndrome," and a (wild) estimate of the order of occurrence:

1. Leak somewhere behind the regulator: hose connections, keg leaks (posts, lids, QDs), shut-off valves, distributor assemblies: 99+%.
2. Leaky tank to regulator connection: <1% (because you can usually hear or see it).
3. Leaky/faulty tank valve: <1%
4. Other, such as broken regulator, or leaky regulator assembly: <1% (again, because you can usually hear or spot it).

I read somewhere to always operate a tank with the valve completely open (not one turn or somewhere halfway). Only in the fully open, top-most position the (inside) valve stem packing can compress properly and make a positive seal there.

 

[kelogs]

Weigheted it at 16.5 kg with regulator assembly attached, tare weight 15.1 or 15.4 kg, i can't make it for sure. So yes, the thing is empty.