saving slurry from an IPA

[Barley_Bob]

So, I'm planning to brew a Belgian IPA tomorrow, and when it's done, I want to save the slurry for future brews. I used to make over-sized starters and save yeast that way, but saving slurry is so easy and cheap! that I'll never go back. However, I'm planning for a 9oz dry hop, and I know that's going to make saving quality slurry a challenge.

I basically see two options:
1. After bottling, pour off the hops and then save whatever's underneath. Hopefully, it'll just be mostly yeast, but who knows?

2. Siphon slurry out from under the beer before dryhopping, which has some risk of contamination and oxygenation.

Does anyone have some thoughts or suggestions? Has anyone has success with one or both of these when dryhopping? I appreciate the help as always!

 

[Gnomebrewer]

I've tried both of these without success (a conical would make things easier). YMMV. You can 'wash' the yeast, to get rid of hop residue, but IMO over building a starter is easier. The only other option that I can see is to use a secondary before adding the dry hop (and risk oxidation).

 

[eyebrau]

What about putting the dry hops in a hop bag or the like so that it's not floating free and winding up in the slurry?

 

[Barley_Bob]

I've tried both of these without success (a conical would make things easier). YMMV. You can 'wash' the yeast, to get rid of hop residue, but IMO over building a starter is easier. The only other option that I can see is to use a secondary before adding the dry hop (and risk oxidation).

Thanks for the input. What was the challenge you had with siphoning the yeast cake out from under the beer? I admit it would be a little tricky, but I think it's doable...

When you tried saving yeast via these two methods, were you able to successfully reuse it after? Or did you not try?

 

[Barley_Bob]

What about putting the dry hops in a hop bag or the like so that it's not floating free and winding up in the slurry?

Admittedly, this is an option. I don't have a bag, though, and that would be introducing a new process (with all of the risks that entails). For that reason, this is probably my least favorite option.

The other option I see is top cropping. I'm tempted to try it, but I really just don't want to deal with starters at all. But if harvesting successfully from a big IPA really is all but impossible, this may be the only option.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Thanks for the input. What was the challenge you had with siphoning the yeast cake out from under the beer? I admit it would be a little tricky, but I think it's doable...

When you tried saving yeast via these two methods, were you able to successfully reuse it after? Or did you not try?

It was messy and splashed a lot, and I didn't end up with enough usable yeast. I think I get less oxygenation racking to secondary than I did trying to siphon yeast.

 

[Barley_Bob]

It was messy and splashed a lot, and I didn't end up with enough usable yeast. I think I get less oxygenation racking to secondary than I did trying to siphon yeast.

Hmm, okay. I think I can do a little better than that. My autosiphon broke, so I've been suck starting a piece of tubing. Maybe a slightly greater risk of contamination, but it works extremely well. It's faster, it offers better control, and it never pumps air into the beer. I think I can get a pretty slow and steady flow into another container to pull some of the yeast cake. Thoughts?

 

[z-bob]

Hmm, okay. I think I can do a little better than that. My autosiphon broke, so I've been suck starting a piece of tubing. Maybe a slightly greater risk of contamination, but it works extremely well. It's faster, it offers better control, and it never pumps air into the beer. I think I can get a pretty slow and steady flow into another container to pull some of the yeast cake. Thoughts?

Rinse your mouth out with whisky/vodka/gin/etc before suck-starting the siphon.

Pour the whole yeast cake (and a little distilled water) into a sanitized mason jar and store it in the fridge until you're ready to brew. Wash it right before you use it, mainly to remove the hops; you don't have to be all that thorough.

 

[Calder]

I do this all the time. Use a secondary and keep the clean yeast from the primary.

I know secondary is a bad word around here, but if you strain the wort going into the primary to keep hop particles out, the yeast wil be pretty clean.

 

[z-bob]

I do this all the time. Use a secondary and keep the clean yeast from the primary.

I know secondary is a bad word around here, but if you strain the wort going into the primary to keep hop particles out, the yeast wil be pretty clean.

I've just started doing that for my ales (I don't do lagers yet) and it's working pretty well.

I also have a quart jar of yeast slurry in the fridge from 6 months ago when I was just using a carboy for a primary and no secondary. I'm planning to use it this weekend; haven't decided if I'm going to pitch the whole thing or just half of it. It's from a lightly-hopped light colored beer, so no real need to wash it.

 

[Barley_Bob]

I do this all the time. Use a secondary and keep the clean yeast from the primary.

I know secondary is a bad word around here, but if you strain the wort going into the primary to keep hop particles out, the yeast wil be pretty clean.

I've just started doing that for my ales (I don't do lagers yet) and it's working pretty well.

I also have a quart jar of yeast slurry in the fridge from 6 months ago when I was just using a carboy for a primary and no secondary. I'm planning to use it this weekend; haven't decided if I'm going to pitch the whole thing or just half of it. It's from a lightly-hopped light colored beer, so no real need to wash it.

Thanks for the tips guys! This is probably what I should have done. I usually do no-chill for an extended whirlpool (and because it's convenient), but I could have pretty easily done it this way if I had been thinking about it and had planned for it.

Unfortunately, the batch already has 9oz of hops in the fermenter. But I could pretty easily just move the batch to my other brew bucket and work with the original yeast cake. That would at least eliminate the dry hop as a problem. I have a bunch of RO on hand, and I could come up with a couple of one gallon jugs to do a huge wash. That seems like the best plan.

 

[Rob2010SS]

So, I'm going to hijack this thread with some noob questions...

1. What is yeast slurry? The sludge on the bottom of the primary after fermentation?
2. What is the proper way to save that? Just pour into a sanitized mason jar and refrigerate?
3. How long with the yeast keep for in the jar?
4. How do you "wash" the yeast as I've heard numerous times here?
5. Does this require the use of a starter when you go to reuse the yeast on another batch?

Thanks.

 

[Rob2010SS]

Oh, and one more...

6. How many times can you do this with the same yeast?

Thanks.

 

[z-bob]

So, I'm going to hijack this thread with some noob questions...

1. What is yeast slurry? The sludge on the bottom of the primary after fermentation?
2. What is the proper way to save that? Just pour into a sanitized mason jar and refrigerate?
3. How long with the yeast keep for in the jar?
4. How do you "wash" the yeast as I've heard numerous times here?
5. Does this require the use of a starter when you go to reuse the yeast on another batch?

Thanks.

Yes, it's the sludge at the bottom of the primary. Also the sludge at the bottom of the secondary, if you use a secondary. I think the slurry from the secondary will be cleaner but less healthy.

After transferring the beer out of the fermenter, add a little water to loosed it up, (boiled and cooled tapwater is probably best, but I use bottled water), slosh it around, and pour into a sanitized mason jar with a lid. Don't screw the lid down too tight. Put it in the fridge.

I will let someone else give the details about washing it, because I've never done it, but basically it's add water, shake it up, and let it separate into layers. The good yeast settles out last, so you pour the cloudy yeast-water off the solids into another sanitized jar and refrigerate it. Eventually it will settle out as a cream-colored layer of clean yeast with clear liquid on top.

 

[Barley_Bob]

So, I'm going to hijack this thread with some noob questions...

1. What is yeast slurry? The sludge on the bottom of the primary after fermentation?
2. What is the proper way to save that? Just pour into a sanitized mason jar and refrigerate?
3. How long with the yeast keep for in the jar?
4. How do you "wash" the yeast as I've heard numerous times here?
5. Does this require the use of a starter when you go to reuse the yeast on another batch?
6. How many times can you do this with the same yeast?

Thanks.

No worries on the hijack.

Z-bob got most of it. I'll just fill in the details a little.

I store yeast slurry in empty 1.5L juice containers. Like what Welch's grape juice comes in. I don't like mason jars, because they don't fit properly in the door of the refrigerator and because of the seal. So, my experience is that they tend to rattle around and spill. Juice containers fit snugly into the door and it's easy to see when pressure is building and burp them. That way they stay closed.

I don't usually add water to the yeast cake before storing it. It's thick and chunky, but it pours. And enough beer always comes out of the yeast cake to keep the yeast covered in storage.

I have no idea how long stored yeast slurry will keep, but it's a long time. Easily for 6 months, but it's still viable after a year or more usually. The beauty of slurry is that it doesn't require a starter. I just measure out a full cup of slurry and add it to the wort. I use more if the slurry is old.

I have never washed yeast before, so this will be my first time. But z-bob's summary is good, and there's a great step by step guide here on hbt if you look for it.

And finally, you can reuse yeast many times. Eventually, it should be thrown out and the yeast should be repurchased. I've heard folks say that they do this after 6 generations. To date, I haven't thrown out any yeast just because it's old. I've thrown it out for other reasons, though. One of my favorite yeasts is WLP006. I use it for almost all of my English and American ales, and it's a seasonal release, so it's hard to get a replacement. I'm still using yeast grown from the original vial I bought several years ago. As you can imagine, this is a huge cost saver.

 

[Rob2010SS]

Awesome. Thanks for the info.

Barley_Bob, you said you've never washed yeast? What determines if it should be washed or not? If you're changing beer types?

Also, it's too late now because I didn't save it, but is it only certain types of yeast that you can save or can you save all of them? I just used US-05, could I have saved that? (Too late now, but I have another packet of US-05 that I'm going to use for my Amber next, so it'll be good to know if I can re-use that or not).

 

[Barley_Bob]

Awesome. Thanks for the info.

Barley_Bob, you said you've never washed yeast? What determines if it should be washed or not? If you're changing beer types?

Also, it's too late now because I didn't save it, but is it only certain types of yeast that you can save or can you save all of them? I just used US-05, could I have saved that? (Too late now, but I have another packet of US-05 that I'm going to use for my Amber next, so it'll be good to know if I can re-use that or not).

The short answer is, unless you're in a really vexing situation like I am with this batch, you don't need to wash yeast. Just save slurry.

There's basically only two requirements for saving slurry:

1. It has to come from a good, clean batch. You don't want to save an infection!
2. It can't come from a high gravity beer. I've heard 1.070 thrown out as a good upper limit. The idea is that a high abv will stress your yeast and lead to an unhealthy, stressed, or damaged slurry. I think some discretion is required, but that is an arbitrary number. I'm using WLP530, which is a high gravity yeast, and my OG is 1.076. I'm not nervous.

Beyond that, you can save any yeast you like, ale or lager and from any batch you make. If you save slurry from your amber, you can use it in a stout, an ipa, and anything in between. I have a half dozen containers of slurry in my fridge, and every time I look at them I see stacks of money.

 

[65C]

if you didn't get a lot you can rebuild a starter using some DME - even a spoon of yeast is a massive number

 

[Barley_Bob]

if you didn't get a lot you can rebuild a starter using some DME - even a spoon of yeast is a massive number

You're right. I should have just top cropped. I forgot how aggressive and prolific this yeast is. It was blowing off for two days (not wildly, but steadily). But by the time that started, it was the middle of the work week, and I didn't have time to pull everything together.

 

[Barley_Bob]

So, I washed yeast this weekend. It was even easier than I thought it would be. I just bought a couple of one gallon jugs of spring water for a buck each. This removed the need to boil and cool anything, and then I had sanitary containers for the yeast to go into!

After siphoning my IPA into a secondary and onto the dry hop, my procedure was as follows:

1. I dumped the water straight into the primary, swirled, and let it sit for 20 minutes.
2. Poured off the liquid in primary into the now empty jugs (leaving behind the hops and trub) and let sit for 20 minutes.
3. Cleaned my primary.
4. Poured off the liquid in the jugs back into primary (leaving behind more hops and trub).
5. Cleaned and sanitized the jugs.
6. Poured the clean yeast now in my primary back into the jugs.
7. Refrigerated.

The two jugs in the fridge each have between 1/8" and 1/4" of yeast on the bottom. My memory says closer to a 1/4", but it's a ton of yeast. Once I get the gumption, I'm going to consolidate the yeast into a single, smaller container for convenience. I'll try to get a picture posted.

Thanks for the help and ideas, guys!