Russian Imperial Stout color issue in Beersmith

[wepeeler]

So I figured I'd jump ahead of the game for this coming Winter and brew my Russian Imperial stout. Made it last year and decided to tweak it a bit. Problem is the color was predicted to be 35ish in Beersmith, and it came out more like 20. Looks like a dark amber. Wondering if anyone has had an issue like this? Kind of disheartening to be honest. I'm sure it'll taste fine, but the color is going to bug the heck out of me. I made sure to measure everything accordingly. I even went back and double checked with the ingredients I had left to make sure I used the right amounts.

Is there anything I can do to darken this beer? Cold steep some black patent or roasted barley or chocolate? Boil it and then dump it in? 5.5 gallon batch, by the way. I wouldn't even begin to know how much to add after the fact.

8.13 gal Distilled
9.19 g Baking Soda (Mash)
3.24 g Epsom Salt (MgSO4) (Mash)
3.18 g Calcium Chloride (Mash)
1.64 g Chalk (Mash)
1.15 g Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate) (Mash)
20 lbs Pale Malt, Maris Otter (3.0 SRM)
1 lbs Barley, Flaked (1.7 SRM)
1 lbs White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM)
8.0 oz Chocolate Malt (350.0 SRM)
8.0 oz Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Caramel Malt - 60L (Briess) (60.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM)
28.00 g Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 15 28.8 IBUs
14.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 16 8.5 IBUs
7.00 g Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 30.0 min Hop 17 5.5 IBUs
14.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 18 5.5 IBUs
29.00 g Centennial [10.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 19 4.7 IBUs
5.90 g Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 5.0 min Hop 20 1.2 IBUs
2.0 pkg Scottish Ale (Wyeast Labs #1728) [124.21 ml] 3L starter


Est Original Gravity: 1.112 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.036 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 10.4 %
Bitterness: 54.4 IBUs
Est Color: 35.5 SRM
Measured Original Gravity: 1.110 SG
Measured Final Gravity: 1.030 SG
Actual Alcohol by Vol: 10.9 %
60 min mash @156

 

[day_trippr]

Was that pour nitro'd? What would it look like absolutely flat?

I tweaked my 10g imperial chocolate stout recipe to a half batch with your grain bill and got roughly the same predicted SRM. No consolation there.

Honestly, I would not try to change the color of this beer but instead would add appropriate notes to the recipe and jump up the black malts next time. fwiw, this is the grist for my stout which BS3 predicts to come in at 49 SRM and it looks pretty darned black in the glass once the cascade has settled...

Cheers!

 

[thehaze]

That does not look right. Is the pour from the fermenter or ...?

The glass is filled with yeast and / or hop debris. Looks like something you take from the bottom of an already fermented beer. Didn't you use any kettle finnings? Put the glass in the fridge for a few hours. The beer in the glass will somewhat become clearer and you can see the colour. Did you by any chance used too much water/sparge? Maybe diluated it wihtout even knowing.

 

[FatDragon]

There's a ton of trub in your color sample, but if your color came out that much lighter than estimated, I suspect some of your roasted malts disappeared somewhere between recipe design and mash-in. Did you put the grain together, or have it done by a shop?

I know people do the steep and add thing you're suggesting. Why not go ahead and give it a try? If the flavor seems right as-is, then cold steep it. If it seems to lack roast, then steep it at mash temps to extract the flavor as well. I'd probably start with 8 oz of roasted grain and a liter or so of water, and however you steep it, make sure to boil it before adding it to the fermenter so it doesn't introduce bacteria. If you're worried about increasing the volume/diluting the beer, take some of the beer out of the fermenter and use it for your steeping water.

 

[Vale71]

That looks like what I get from dumping trub from my conical!
You're basically seeing light reflected from all the trub particles and not light going through the beer which is what color predictions are based on. Just let the trub settle and only then will you be able to assess the actual color.

 

[ccous]

Wait for it to clear before judging the color. Tons of yeast and junk in there

 

[kh54s10]

That was my thought also. Was the glass drawn from a spigot at the bottom of a fermenter. It looks to be full of trub. If so I suspect the beer above the trub will be dark.

 

[wepeeler]

This was poured directly from the fermenter. The portion I put into the tube for the hydrometer sample was dark brown, not black. I realize there's a lot of hob debris, but there is no yeast. The last RIS I made was motor oil right after the mash. I tripled checked all my grain, but obviously something is amiss. I mashed in with 0.25 gallons less water than Beersmith told me to. The only difference from last batch to this was I only did a 60 minute mash this time. I did 90 last time. Could that be the issue?

I might end up just adding in some steeped roasted grain and see what happens...

 

[kh54s10]

If there is a ton of hop debris in there it will lighten the color. And, if you have pitched the yeast, there is a lot of yeast in the beer. Even when finished there is a lot of yeast in suspension.

Motor oil color?? New or very old oil??

Let the trub in the glass settle out then see what the color is.

Have you got a picture of the wort in the fermenter?

 

[wepeeler]

If there is a ton of hop debris in there it will lighten the color. And, if you have pitched the yeast, there is a lot of yeast in the beer. Even when finished there is a lot of yeast in suspension.

Motor oil color?? New or very old oil??

Let the trub in the glass settle out then see what the color is.

Have you got a picture of the wort in the fermenter?

Well, there is definitely a lot of hop debris. This was taken from the fermenter as we were cooling, before pitching.

And I guess I mean old black motor oil for my last batch. This one is dark amber brown. Not black, like I was aiming for.

I use a stainless steel fermenter so no pic.