Pittsburgh/Western PA Group Buy #5

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Well shoot...I closed out several open splits and a couple full bags on my first bulk buy and it looks like this won't happen. What do we do know?
 
Kyle are our buys set up as a business? If so it looks like our prices won't change but if not the prices are going up.
 
Yeah, CidahMastah is talking about a 20% increase. I looked at the price sheet he attached to his thread and it was WAY more than a 20% increase in price over what we paid on the last buy. For instance, Briess 5298 2 Row was $31 per bag on the last buy and the "NEW" price on the updated sheet from CidahMastah is $75.22. I'm hoping that this increase will not apply to us.

How about it Kyle, have you received anything from CMG indicating that they are changing the pricing on us?
 
It looks like what we need to do is talk to a local homebrew supply shop and pay them like 200 dollars to order it for us.
 
Before we get too concerned about the folks jumping in about pricing, let me do a little more follow up. I'd already gotten the heads up from the TRUB folks an a few others via PM, and i'm aware of the issues. If the prices aren't as advertised, I'm not committing us to an order.

I'll send out an email update to those of you who are registered for the buy, rather than bringing it up on the forums for public consumption.

Also along those lines, we filled the first pallet and I temporarily put the sheet into read-only mode. I'll roll out a part B with the open splits once I sort out this issue.
 
Thanks Kyle and wow, that pallet filled quickly.
 
PJM said:
Yeah, CidahMastah is talking about a 20% increase. I looked at the price sheet he attached to his thread and it was WAY more than a 20% increase in price over what we paid on the last buy. For instance, Briess 5298 2 Row was $31 per bag on the last buy and the "NEW" price on the updated sheet from CidahMastah is $75.22. I'm hoping that this increase will not apply to us.

How about it Kyle, have you received anything from CMG indicating that they are changing the pricing on us?
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Unfortunately this will affect you all if you use NCM and you aren't receiving shipment via a federally licensed brewery establishment with a TIN #.

We were about to place an order and I personally called up NCM. The idea that your buy is different from any other home brew account buy is just silly (but I did the same thing you did, once I heard I needed to call and check for myself so I encourage you to do the same). I understand that perhaps now you want to keep it discrete but the damage has been done.

A couple ways around it are to get your order delivered to a brewery, get a new supplier, etc.

Yes 20% is on the low end of the increases. Many are much higher.
 
CidahMastah said:
Unfortunately this will affect you all if you use NCM and you aren't receiving shipment via a federally licensed brewery establishment with a TIN #.
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By that logic how can they distinguish between a homebrew shop and anybody else who has a business account with them? LHBSs don't have a federal brewery license so would the markup apply to them? If it did, I would expect to see a lot of stores stop selling Briess.

I think there are still open questions that can only be answered by NCM.
 
I am not sure how the tax id's identify businesses. Again I spoke with the low level representative, not a manager, at NCM. What I do know is that you can't get a delivery at the old pricing unless the business is brewing affiliated.

I didn't say home brewing stores can't buy from them. A home brew store would have a commercial account, not a home brewer grandfathered in account like many of us have been using to buy.

Feel free to call them and clear up the details. I would appreciate knowing any additional details you may come across.
 
Technically Country Malts sells *exclusively* to breweries - they have a non-brewery wing that caters exclusively to LHBS. They recently went through an internal systems overhaul that allows the LHBS and Brewery sides of the business a better way to track their customers - it looks like this is the next step.

The TIN# is a federal tax id. I believe there is a separate ID you get from the ATF that approves the manufacture and sale of alcoholic beverages.

Cidah - I understand where you're coming from, but I also understand that most manufacturers and wholesalers will not sell direct to consumer under any circumstances. Its just not how the supply chain works. Cutting out the middle man also hurts other businesses in the supply chain if it is done too aggressively. So while I agree this sucks, i'm not nearly as surprised as other folks are.

Worst case, I've had discussions with an LHBS about bulk buying in the past. We can always pursue that if needed.
 
brewguyver - I am not surprised either. I sort of saw this coming (I talk about that a bit in the other thread I started). As I said in that thread, it has been a heck of a ride and I am glad I have been part of it for several years. Without that I would have never built such an awesome brew system.

They also require a TTB # (I think this is the ATF number you are referencing). You can see the application on post one of the thread I started in all of this.
 
Damn, I just switched over to AG at the beginning of the year and was interested in getting involved in a group buy this time around.

Country Wines in the North Hills sells a 50 lb sack for $50. Thats the only local place I know unless Triangle down in the Strip is still in business.
 
A little off topic but I am very new to PGH and wondered what everyone did for their brewing water? In Tennessee I just used RO and added minerals back to it but didn't know how good the water is here and what treatments are necessary.
 
joyceman said:
Damn, I just switched over to AG at the beginning of the year and was interested in getting involved in a group buy this time around.

Country Wines in the North Hills sells a 50 lb sack for $50. Thats the only local place I know unless Triangle down in the Strip is still in business.
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I'm pretty sure triangle is closed. Make sure to give plenty of business to South Hills Brewing and Country Wines - they're good guys.



TNTgill said:
A little off topic but I am very new to PGH and wondered what everyone did for their brewing water? In Tennessee I just used RO and added minerals back to it but didn't know how good the water is here and what treatments are necessary.
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I use tap water for beer, but the 5 gal jugs of spring water for wine. The beer seems to come out pretty well. Then again I still have bad temp control, so you might not want to trust me :drunk:
 
I think the region has pretty good LHBSs. There is a pretty good one out my way, he just started last fall and is always increasing his inventory.

Just one question. Does anyone know what happend to Ben's Homebrew in Tarentum or Ben for that matter? I used to drive over an hour to get my supplies there. His Youtube videos were always good and informative and the Homebrew Junkie Blog was pretty cool. He seemed to have a pretty professional and organized website.

Since his store closed and moved then closed again, I haven't heard anything from him. No updates to homebrew junkie or youtube videos.

I just always wondered..... Hmmm.
 
TNTgill said:
A little off topic but I am very new to PGH and wondered what everyone did for their brewing water? In Tennessee I just used RO and added minerals back to it but didn't know how good the water is here and what treatments are necessary.
Click to expand...

My provider is West View water and havent had any issues other than a need to add some gypsum to stouts once or twice. I think that generally the local water is considered relatively hard (no surprise there).

If youre in the city proper, heres a link to the latest water report...http://www.pgh2o.com/docs/2011_Water_Quality_Report.pdf

And to brewguyver, the guys at Country Wines have been great. The counterguy, Dave, is the best.
 
I don't think the local breweries can help. They'd have to buy the grain and resell to us. I'm taking a guess that their brewpub license won't let them do that.
 
Weezy said:
I don't think the local breweries can help. They'd have to buy the grain and resell to us. I'm taking a guess that their brewpub license won't let them do that.
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If they can sell t-shirts and hats, they can sell buckets, grain, etc. Bells actually runs a homebrew store now (not that they're local).
 
Yeah, you may be right. Although, Bells isn't permitted through the good old boys at the PLCB. The guys at Full Pint sure paint them as PITA for every little thing.
 
argyle said:
Does anyone know what happend to Ben's Homebrew in Tarentum or Ben for that matter? I used to drive over an hour to get my supplies there. His Youtube videos were always good and informative and the Homebrew Junkie Blog was pretty cool. He seemed to have a pretty professional and organized website.

Since his store closed and moved then closed again, I haven't heard anything from him. No updates to homebrew junkie or youtube videos.

I just always wondered..... Hmmm.
Click to expand...

I also bought all my supplies from Ben. For personal reasons, he closed his store front several years ago and was doing business out of his house. I still bought from him until he closed completely. Haven't heard anything since.
 
There were a handful of sacks that were put into the "locked full sacks" tab of the google spreadsheet. Not sure whether they were my errors or a few folks put their orders in the wrong place.

If you recently put in your full sack order and it wasn't on the tab that says "enter order here," you may have to re-enter it.
 
brewguyver said:
There were a handful of sacks that were put into the "locked full sacks" tab of the google spreadsheet. Not sure whether they were my errors or a few folks put their orders in the wrong place.

If you recently put in your full sack order and it wasn't on the tab that says "enter order here," you may have to re-enter it.
Click to expand...

So this is still going on? I thought it was locked.
 
I closed out the roasted barley on pallet 2; I could use some. Can't do anymore though, or SWMBO will kill me.
 
Thanks for closing the Roasted Barley, now I can get my Nut Brown into serious production. That's got to be my favorite style. :)
 
Wha'ts our guesstimate for ordering and pickup? Mid April or something? Are we talking a Saturday pickup? (This is my first time and I'm just trying to keep it in the back of my mind for personal scheduling.)
 
For those of you who have open splits, they'll roll to the next group buy unless you tell me otherwise.

I also have the option to get some of the splits drop shipped as 10# bags (price is less competitive), as well as some of the other items folks have asked me about (hardwood additives, candy sugar, etc.). I'll send out the price list for that stuff to gauge interest and then get a shipping quote. We'll do that separately from the pallets so the main group buy is not delayed.

Weezy said:
Wha'ts our guesstimate for ordering and pickup? Mid April or something? Are we talking a Saturday pickup? (This is my first time and I'm just trying to keep it in the back of my mind for personal scheduling.)
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Depending on payment and shipping time, we're looking at either 4/6 (aggressive) or 4/27. I'm negotiating with the SWMBO about 4/13, but we're supposed to be in DC that weekend. I know a few folks need the grains for the TRASH competition brewing, so I'm pushing for earlier.

PJM said:
Just Closed it out
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Group buy 5 is now closed at two pallets.
 
I'm about 50% through the invoices - got caught up working a few late nights this week. I hope to have them out for review tomorrow night.

Also, we're about half way to the min order on the small buys list (10# sacks of grain, additives, smaller amts of cleansers, and 20-30 types of hops)
 
So on the small buy, do they have all the listed hops in stock? Look like some good ones if they do.
 
PJM said:
So on the small buy, do they have all the listed hops in stock? Look like some good ones if they do.
Click to expand...

They did when I got the pricelist (2 weeks ago), but i'll have to verify again when I order. You probably had the same thought I did when I saw them.
 
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