New To Electric. Why wouldn't this work?

[brownbox]

I want to make a super simple electric system and then slowly upgrade. I'm not electrically inclined and was wondering why I couldn't buy the following two components to create a rudimentary electric system with some controllability (not just off or on).

I want to take two elements like this http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/heating-element-kits (one for my liquor tank and one for my brew kettle) and splice in a controller like this http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B018LUX1SS/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20 between the element and the plug. Would this not give me a controllability of the element e.g. run at 10% 50% or 100% just by turning the knob?

I'm sure this is super flawed and if it wasn't I would have seen a post about it by now but I just wanted to see whats wrong with this idea before I proceeded to more complex solutions.

Thanks

 

[acidrain]

For literally a couple bucks more, you could get a real PID and then never worry about stepping up. You would already be there..

 

[iijakii]

What are you looking for in an ebrewery? Don't have to build something like Kal's just because it's the bling standard.

 

[brownbox]

I have no background in wiring or electric so i just want something simple that won't burn my house down or electrocute me while i'm brewing. I don't think i have the experience to build a true pid.

 

[iijakii]

Doesnt answer the question. What are you wanting from it? What style of brewing etc. Also budget would help.

 

[brownbox]

Sorry i was mostly answering the response above yours. I am looking to brew american style ales. Sometimes high gravity beers. I am currently just looking to upgrade my 5 gallon propane all grain system. Also about $400 is my max right now.

 

[doug293cz]

The concerns with using just the SSR controller (actually an SSVR) "spliced" into the power line have to do with safety. The most common failure mode for triac based solid state devices (SSR's and SSVR's) is shorted, so they cannot be turned off. Typical control panels add contactors (high current relays) or high current switches to make sure you can always turn the power off. The triacs also have a leakage current that represents a shock hazard even when working properly. Plugging a high current draw directly into an outlet is a bad idea as dangerous arcing can occur. You want to have positive switching to make sure the load is disconnected when you plug things in.

Also, anytime you use electricity in a (potentially) wet environment, you need to have GFCI (ground fault circuit interruption) protection on the power feed to the controller. This is to prevent potentially fatal shocks in the case of several potential failure scenarios.

Brew on

 

[mcgimpkins]

What type of system are you looking to build? A 3 vessel system, a RIMS for mash control, or do you want to do EBIAB? What equipment do you already have?

 

[brownbox]

I currently have a basic 5 gallon all grain propane set up. 12 gallon pot as my hlt a round igloo cooler for my mash tun and a 9 gallon pot as my brew kettle. I would like to be able to heat my hlt and my brew kettle using electric elements rather than propane. I don't care about warning lights/alarms/automatic temperature control I just want a way that I can convert my existing system to electric. I don't mind turning an element off an on like i do with my current propane burner to regulate temperature but being able to adjust an electric element by using knob or something would be ideal. My hlt and my brew kettle already have the sight glass/thermometer combo from bargain fittings as well as 3 piece ball valves/camlocks. I don't mind using those tools to tell temp/volume. I just want a simple way that I can brew in my garage with the door closed rather than out in my driveway due to propane fumes and also i want to kick the cost of filling propane every weekend and getting a subpar boil in freezing temps. Just looking to do it as cheaply/easily/safely as possible. I don't need bells or whistles or an automatic system (i prefer to be little more hands on anyway). Thanks again for the replies.

 

[mcgimpkins]

You might be looking for something like this: High Gravity Brewing Electric Kettle Controller. It is basically an on, off switch running to a manual power level, so you can control in intensity of your boil.

In addition like doug293cz said, you are going to want a GFCI either in a spa panel or inline GFCI

 

[FuzzeWuzze]

There is a box that already does what your looking at, i cant remember who makes it maybe someone else will remember..like High Octane or High Voltage brewing or something like that? They make a single element controller box with a knob.

If you dont know what your doing with electricity you shouldnt be building any type of panel, learning like the rest of us is always an option.

^^Edit^^ Didnt refresh before posting and this guy already found what i was talking about.

 

[madscientist451]

Could a version of the High Gravity Controller be built for way less than $250 using the controller the OP linked to in the first post along a breaker all mounted in a box?

 

[TexasWine]

This one is a tad cheaper than High Gravity...

http://jaggerbushbrewing.com/BOIL-CONTROL-220-VOLT-6000-WATT-30-AMP_p_13.html

Or for the same price as high gravity, get one with a PID.

http://jaggerbushbrewing.com/PID-CONTROLLER-220-VOLT-6000-WATT-30-AMP_p_21.html

 

[dyqik]

Could a version of the High Gravity Controller be built for way less than $250 using the controller the OP linked to in the first post along a breaker all mounted in a box?

Yes, for way less. But I would not touch the Amazon linked controller unless some people can chime in saying that it has worked well in a similar application, as I'm dubious about some of the specifications on these kinds of controllers (c.f. the 25A "Fake" Fotek SSRs).

I'm sort of going through the same process as the OP - I've been 3 vessel brewing in the garage on a single propane burner, but I'm moving into the basement, as cheaply and incrementally as is reasonable* (although I already had an electric RIMS tube set up). I just built a simple boil controller for just my boil kettle with an SSVR and a contactor for positive power control (as mentioned upthread) - https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showpost.php?p=7402901&postcount=3. The Voltage/Current/Power Meter is strictly unnecessary, but it does give you great feedback for setting a consistent power level in the boil.

To adapt this as a single control box for two kettles, you need two 30A contactors ($10 each), a two position center off switch to drive the contactors (few bucks) and to ensure that only one comes on at a time (assuming a 30A supply), two 40A SSVRs with heatsinks (about $20 each), two pots to control the SSVRs (few bucks), an enclosure and a power supply cord and cord grips. The control box itself (minus the outlets) for both elements could come in under $100.

It'd cost about $25 more to add temperature control via a PID to the HLT (replace one SSVR with an SSR, add a MyPin TD4 or TA4 and PT-100 sensor, delete the pot and knob), which is a big improvement in functionality. No need for temperature control on the boil kettle though.

The bigger costs are the cables and outlet/plug pairs to connect the kettle elements (about $30 per pot?), the elements and fittings to attach them to the kettle (about $65 per pot for 5500W all stainless elements with simple weldless fittings - the kits the OP links to are more expensive than a semi-DIY assembly using BrewHardware components, for example), and most importantly, the GFCI breaker and cabling to connect the controller to the power source (about $80-$120 depending on your electrical panel, plus maybe $20 for a dryer cord if you are connecting that way).

*not as cheaply as possible - buying once and buying components that can later be reconfigured into a more comprehensive system.

 

[augiedoggy]

I want to make a super simple electric system and then slowly upgrade. I'm not electrically inclined and was wondering why I couldn't buy the following two components to create a rudimentary electric system with some controllability (not just off or on).

I want to take two elements like this http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/heating-element-kits (one for my liquor tank and one for my brew kettle) and splice in a controller like this http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B018LUX1SS/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20 between the element and the plug. Would this not give me a controllability of the element e.g. run at 10% 50% or 100% just by turning the knob?

I'm sure this is super flawed and if it wasn't I would have seen a post about it by now but I just wanted to see whats wrong with this idea before I proceeded to more complex solutions.

Thanks

you will want the 10000 w version of that scr not the 5000.. those are designed for 220v at 50hz and not 240v at 60hz so the control is not very linear but you can get around that by marking the different point in the know rotation... what will happen is you turn the knob a lot and nothing noticable happens and then all the sudden it will be hair like adjustments...
for this reason the SSVR and potentiometer combo like the stilldragon kit here http://stilldragon.com/index.php/diy-controller-kit.html is really a better option... a lot of peole have had even the 10000w versions of those cheap scr controller burn up from controlling one 5500w element... The traces and fuse area seem to burn up on the control board.

 

[augiedoggy]

Could a version of the High Gravity Controller be built for way less than $250 using the controller the OP linked to in the first post along a breaker all mounted in a box?

lol your kidding right? Dont get me on my soapbox but Ive stated about 50 times in other threads that the pid controlled high gravity controllers are made of about $150 in components and you could build them much cheaper using alternative parts.

The $250 "EKC" version control box is way cheaper yet to build having like $70 in hardware costs...

The internals consist of an ssvr and pot like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-KYOTTO-...hash=item20b9aba410:m:mpUOrgJrx9LTN0bj0CSjZIw or this with a heat sink ($16) http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-KYOTTO-...490710?hash=item1e988e70d6:g:ZjYAAOSwYGFUvouI (if you want overkill you have this 40A version with huge heatsink,) http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-KYOTTO-...591986?hash=item1e988ffc72:g:seQAAOSwxYxUvqzu

A 30a switch and case from the home depot ($12 each). http://www.homedepot.com/p/Carlon-6-in-x-4-in-Junction-Box-E987RR/100404096 http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...ble-Pole-Switch-White-R62-03032-2WS/100356941 and a power cord with plug ($22) http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-4-Prong-30-Amp-Dryer-Cord-WX9X20GDS/202214666

As well as an outlet... HG uses the cheap $6 dryer outlet included in their standard $250 option http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...t-Single-Outlet-Black-R50-05207-000/202077700

So there you have the $250 "EKC" broken down into about $70-80 depending on your source for the couple feet of internal wire....

 

[augiedoggy]

There is a box that already does what your looking at, i cant remember who makes it maybe someone else will remember..like High Octane or High Voltage brewing or something like that? They make a single element controller box with a knob.

If you dont know what your doing with electricity you shouldnt be building any type of panel, learning like the rest of us is always an option.

^^Edit^^ Didnt refresh before posting and this guy already found what i was talking about.

the still dragon kits would be a better option in my opinion since they come with assembly directions and cost $38 http://stilldragon.com/index.php/diy-controller-kit.html
vs what $250 for the High gravity equivalent for assembly costs..http://www.highgravitybrew.com/store/pc/Electric-Kettle-Controller-269p3084.htm A controller this simple takes about an hour to assemble if that.

 

[dyqik]

the still dragon kits would be a better option in my opinion since they come with assembly directions and cost $38 vs what $380 for the High gravity equivalent for assembly costs..

You do really want to add a switch and contactor ($15?) to the Still Dragon kit, plus some wire (43¢ a foot at the big orange box), but the $38 (plus shipping) version in the bigger box can probably hold those components. You should be done for $65 including shipping.

 

[AF1HomeBrew]

I have no background in wiring or electric so i just want something simple that won't burn my house down or electrocute me while i'm brewing. I don't think i have the experience to build a true pid.

If you are serious about going the Electric Brewing route, but are not a DIY kind of brewer, checkout sites like ebrewsupply.com . These kinds of systems and components will ensure that you don't burn down the house, and will give you flexibility as you invest more into it. Also you'll spend your time brewing and not troubleshooting.

8 years ago I started using a Johnson controller hooked up to a bucket heater to heat my HLT and Mashtun (that were 5 gal. Orange coolers) to control temps. I used that for about a year, and it worked. Then I decided to ditch the coolers and replace them all with SS kettles because I wanted to get rid of plastic in my brewing. After the BCS-460 by Embedded Control Concepts (now owned by Brewer's Hardware) came out a buddy helped build me build my system that allowed me to control my mashtun, HLT, a pump and still have an extra output for something else for less than $500.

With Electric Brewing, the thing that you may not realize when you start out is that when you do it "Fred Sanford" style you really aren't saving any money, because when something breaks or doesn't work your SOL.

 

[augiedoggy]

You do really want to add a switch and contactor ($15?) to the Still Dragon kit, plus some wire (43¢ a foot at the big orange box), but the $38 (plus shipping) version in the bigger box can probably hold those components. You should be done for $65 including shipping.

no... I would just build 2 stilldragon kits and have the etra redundancy of having an extra controller or better yet... unplug one kettle and plug the other one in.

 

[augiedoggy]

With Electric Brewing, the thing that you may not realize when you start out is that when you do it "Fred Sanford" style you really aren't saving any money, because when something breaks or doesn't work your SOL.

We arent talking hacked together stuff that doesnt meet code here... just simple uncomplicated heat with the same control capabilities as gas... I agree with what you say about the benefits of pid temp control and such (See my build thread below) but this guy (or gal) just wants simple and easy right now for less investment I believe.still if they want to purchase an already build pid controlled panel this is about the the best bang for your buck option Ive seen... http://jaggerbushbrewing.com/PID-CONTROLLER-220-VOLT-6000-WATT-30-AMP_p_21.html which can stll be built for half that if someone is really tight on cash. this one has the redudndant but easier manul knob control and pump control for about $40 more...
http://jaggerbushbrewing.com/BBR-10_p_63.html

 

[wilserbrewer]

What size is your kettle, and what size batch are you looking to brew? While extremely unpopular here, it is certainly possible to size your element to the kettle / batch size to produce a reasonable boil and just run 100% with on / off control switching. Sure it is very basic....but still beats the hell out of propane brewing any day of the week....JMO

All temps will be manual as done on a propane rig.

GFI - switch - element - done

A 15 gallon kettle, a Hot Rod Heatstick from brewhardware.com and a 4000w element and your on your way....

 

[augiedoggy]

What size is your kettle, and what size batch are you looking to brew? While extremely unpopular here, it is certainly possible to size your element to the kettle / batch size to produce a reasonable boil and just run 100% with on / off control switching.

All temps will be manual as done on a propane rig.

I will add I think this is only a good option with smaller 120v elements... Ive seen it attempted with 240v elements and the results were poor.

 

[wilserbrewer]

I will add I think this is only a good option with smaller 120v elements... Ive seen it attempted with 240v elements and the results were poor.

Please go on....I'm curious why? Watts are watts no? I have been e-brewing a long time, way before this forum sub section was created and have never used a controller.

I realize that one would not be able to vary batch size etc.

Typical controller.... lol
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...ble-Pole-Switch-White-R62-03032-2WS/100356941

 

[AF1HomeBrew]

still if they want to purchase an already build pid controlled panel this is about the the best bang for your buck option Ive seen... http://jaggerbushbrewing.com/PID-CONTROLLER-220-VOLT-6000-WATT-30-AMP_p_21.html which can stll be built for half that if someone is really tight on cash.

Definitely a great option if you are wanting to control 1 kettle, but I see he was looking to control more than one.

 

[augiedoggy]

Please go on....I'm curious why? Watts are watts no? I have been e-brewing a long time, way before this forum sub section was created and have never used a controller.

I realize that one would not be able to vary batch size etc.

Typical controller.... lol
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...ble-Pole-Switch-White-R62-03032-2WS/100356941

Ok well 120v elements usually top out at 2000w, one 2000w or even two 1500w elements at 100% duty cycle can create an even boil for someone brewing the typical 5-6 gallon batch (insulation needed with a single 2000w element). The typical recommended ULWD 240v elements used for boil kettles are 4500w and up... This at 100% duty cycle is way too much for boiling 5-6 gallons or wort. The owner on my local hbs store tried this with a friend when moving up from 120v to 240v and said the results were a disaster. The boil is way too vigorous and splattering everywhere. They tried babysitting the kettle and controlling it by turning it on and off with a switch every so many seconds but it got a bit ridiculous and that would burn up the mechanical contacts in the switch in a short time. They went back to 120v in the end I believe.

So my point is if you match the max wattage of your element power to the size batches your doing then yes you can get away with not regulating it but if not , its a bad idea. Unless you spent the extra money and time to search out say a 3000w 240v uwd element or use regular density elements and deal with the possible shortcomings... Its just not worth it IMHO when you can have actual heat control for $40.

 

[augiedoggy]

Definitely a great option if you are wanting to control 1 kettle, but I see he was looking to control more than one.

Yes but he doesnt need pid control on both right? if so thers options like http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brumatic-DB...809879?hash=item3398dad357:g:wwMAAOSwAYtWMUi8 which are gonna be more costly prebuilt. unless he wants to use the same temp probe and move it from kettle to kettle ?

This is a good single panel option if he wants manual control for the BK and pid control for the hlt or herms/rims $400 but beats $900+ for the same thing from aforementioned sources..

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brumatic-DB...538910?hash=item338dfd975e:g:UN4AAOxygPtS0OwO

It seems that every time someone comes into the electric section with this simple viable plan, we all try to convince them they need control from the star ship enterprise instead... I can finally respect both arguments I guess...

 

[-CHRIS-]

The typical recommended ULWD 240v elements used for boil kettles are 4500w and up... This at 100% duty cycle is way too much for boiling 5-6 gallons or wort. The owner on my local hbs store tried this with a friend when moving up from 120v to 240v and said the results were a disaster.

I'm glad I didn't know that, I have brewed dozens of 5 gallon batches in my keggle-based system and I always have my TD4 set to 100 percent. Maybe the thermal mass of the heavy keggle, or the cooler conditions of the northeast, keep the heat down?

I agree with you, for ~$150 worth of parts it just makes sense put a PID on the boil kettle. I don't see why you couldn't use 1 PID for both the boil and HLT with the only challenge being the calibration of the temp probe that I assume would be permanently installed in each kettle.

Chris

 

[augiedoggy]

I'm glad I didn't know that, I have brewed dozens of 5 gallon batches in my keggle-based system and I always have my TD4 set to 100 percent. Maybe the thermal mass of the heavy keggle, or the cooler conditions of the northeast, keep the heat down?

I agree with you, for ~$150 worth of parts it just makes sense put a PID on the boil kettle. I don't see why you couldn't use 1 PID for both the boil and HLT with the only challenge being the calibration of the temp probe that I assume would be permanently installed in each kettle.

Chris

Well I only measure 4026w max out of my 4500w element and TD4 controlled kettle and when boiling 6 gallons 75% duty cycle creates a vigorous boil with 1 gallon per hr boiloff and my kettle has the same dimensions as you kettle... at 100% it would have to be one crazy boil. If one is using a 4500w lwd or hwd element like this at 100% you are much more likely to see results like this,
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?p=7409921#post7409921

BTW there no point in even switching to manual mode with your method as you would acheive the eact same outcome if you just bumped your pid temp to say 215 degrees... it would stay on 100% all the time. and building a single TD4 pid control box can really be done safely for as little as $75...much less if you hard wire it. and make your element removable.

 

[wilserbrewer]

The typical recommended ULWD 240v elements used for boil kettles are 4500w and up...

I never knew of a "typical" recommended wattage for elements?

Unless you spent the extra money and time to search out say a 3000w 240v uwd element or use regular density elements and deal with the possible shortcomings... Its just not worth it IMHO when you can have actual heat control for $40.

Several 3500w elements available here...I don't see any time and "extra money" involved....

https://www.plumbingsupply.com/elements.html

3800w HD
http://www.homedepot.com/p/3800-Wat...-Density-Water-Heater-Element-15293/204219992

3800w foldback
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Water-Heate...489133?hash=item210918022d:g:7z8AAOSwuYVWpWue

4000w foldback
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Electrical-...hash=item3a84d2a449:m:mg_JeIp0A0hC0vXm3tsAWNw

I realize this is not the "best" way, but for someone lacking the ability to wire a more complex solution I feel it is a viable alternative. Please remember not everyone here has the same skillset, and while wiring and programming a PID or PWM for some is very simple, others have no desire to attempt doing it.

 

[AF1HomeBrew]

It seems that every time someone comes into the electric section with this simple viable plan, we all try to convince them they need control from the star ship enterprise instead... I can finally respect both arguments I guess...

Sorry didn't mean to get in your way. We should all chip in and get you a membership.

 

[augiedoggy]

Sorry didn't mean to get in your way. We should all chip in and get you a membership.

I wasnt referring specifically to you, Sorry if it came out that way , it just seems that a lot of threads start out with a simple plan and end up with so many complicated opinions and options that the OP gets confused and discouraged... I am just as guilty at contributing to this time and time again..

PS My online people skills suck. In case you havent figure that out already..

 

[augiedoggy]

I never knew of a "typical" recommended wattage for elements?



Several 3500w elements available here...I don't see any time and "extra money" involved....

https://www.plumbingsupply.com/elements.html

3800w HD
http://www.homedepot.com/p/3800-Wat...-Density-Water-Heater-Element-15293/204219992

3800w foldback
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Water-Heate...489133?hash=item210918022d:g:7z8AAOSwuYVWpWue

4000w foldback
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Electrical-...hash=item3a84d2a449:m:mg_JeIp0A0hC0vXm3tsAWNw

I realize this is not the "best" way, but for someone lacking the ability to wire a more complex solution I feel it is a viable alternative. Please remember not everyone here has the same skillset, and while wiring and programming a PID or PWM for some is very simple, others have no desire to attempt doing it.

Your right I guess about the element... I dont recall ever seeing someone take that path though..and your limiting yourself on batchsizes as you brought up.
As far as controlling the power with a mechanical switch though I still respectfully disagree that its a good option.

 

[BadWolfBrewing]

I'll chime in with my 2 cents (why not). I think the stildragon kit is the easiest route to go to meet what the OP wants. For safety, I'd also add a switch, just to be able to mechanically kill the power completely. Lowes Depot sells a switch that will work:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...ble-Pole-Switch-White-R62-03032-2WS/100356941

A single controller is sufficient, you can just unplug one element and plug the other in.

Its cheap, and does exactly what you want. You can use the excess money to:

1. Get GFCI protection. Spa panel is the cheapest route, AFAIK. There's a lot of threads that show how to wire it up. You can always ask if you have questions too. Do not run an electric brewery without GFCI protection.

2. Make sure the element is safely attached. See the BrewHardware site for a nice inexpensive option. I have the TC version and they are great, I'd guess you want the weldless nut/o-ring option. Its an easy way to ensure a good water tight, electrically bonded connection.

The only problem is with the stildragon option, it is sort of hard to upgrade from this route without starting over with the control panel. You haven't put much money into the control panel, though, so that's probably alright.

I'm happy to help if you have any questions about how to wire anything up.

edit: I'd stay away from random amazon/ebay stuff unless it has been vetted by users. There's too many stories of counterfit breakers, SSR's, etc out there. Some dude in texas got arrested a while back for counterfitting breakers that were shown to be dangerous. Get equipment from reputable dealers, or ask on here if you aren't sure.

 

[brownbox]

Thank you all for your input I really appreciate all the great info. Right now I am leaning towards buying 2 still Dragon controller boxes one for my hlt and one for my brew kettle. With the instructions that come with those do you guys think a novice could throw them together?

I currently have a 240 electrical line that used to go to my electric range that was cut and taped when I upgraded to a gas stove. I am hoping to have that line extended into my garage and have an outlet put in for the 240 source by an electrician. Would the electrician also be the one to put in the spa panel and is that still necessary if I were running off of the 2 still Dragon controllers?

Lastly would I be able to plug both controllers in at the same time with just one 240 outlet/run at the same time? What type of outlet would I need to do that or would I have to have two 240 supplies?

Thanks again have another

 

[ScrewyBrewer]

You might be looking for something like this: High Gravity Brewing Electric Kettle Controller. It is basically an on, off switch running to a manual power level, so you can control in intensity of your boil.

In addition like doug293cz said, you are going to want a GFCI either in a spa panel or inline GFCI

I've been loving my High Gravity system for nearly 2 years now, and couldn't be happier with it.

 

[augiedoggy]

Thank you all for your input I really appreciate all the great info. Right now I am leaning towards buying 2 still Dragon controller boxes one for my hlt and one for my brew kettle. With the instructions that come with those do you guys think a novice could throw them together?

I currently have a 240 electrical line that used to go to my electric range that was cut and taped when I upgraded to a gas stove. I am hoping to have that line extended into my garage and have an outlet put in for the 240 source by an electrician. Would the electrician also be the one to put in the spa panel and is that still necessary if I were running off of the 2 still Dragon controllers?

Lastly would I be able to plug both controllers in at the same time with just one 240 outlet/run at the same time? What type of outlet would I need to do that or would I have to have two 240 supplies?

Thanks again have another

Yes the stilldragon boxes are very simple to wire up. Lot of wiring options for power..
You can have an electrician either replace the 50a breaker for your stove line with a 30a one and run a new 10awg line from the box to your garage with a spa panel for gfci (50a is fine since your just using it for gfci protection and as an extra kill switch.) or run the more expensive 6awg line and keep it 50a... depends on itf you think you need to heat both kettles at the same time. Also you can just replace the breaker in your panel with a GFCI breaker and skip the spa panel but ironically this costs more to do.

 

[FuzzeWuzze]

Please go on....I'm curious why? Watts are watts no? I have been e-brewing a long time, way before this forum sub section was created and have never used a controller.

I realize that one would not be able to vary batch size etc.

Typical controller.... lol
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-...ble-Pole-Switch-White-R62-03032-2WS/100356941

I dont see how you could control 5500W 240V element with on off, to keep mine from boiling like a cauldron my PID has to turn it on and off way too often (every second or so) to be something you could realistically do for an entire hour.

 

[dyqik]

no... I would just build 2 stilldragon kits and have the etra redundancy of having an extra controller or better yet... unplug one kettle and plug the other one in.

The contactor isn't to switch elements. It's to switch off the current before you unplug the circuit (e.g. to switch kettles), and to provide an easily accessible power switch in case of SSVR failure or other emergency. The 30A 2-pole switch linked above is another option, for about the same price - there are advantages and disadvantages to both options.

Plugging and unplugging loads with high current flowing is an easy thing to avoid for $15, so I definitely prefer to include a switch of some kind, for the reasons doug outlined upthread.

 

[augiedoggy]

The contactor isn't to switch elements. It's to switch off the current before you unplug the circuit (e.g. to switch kettles), and to provide an easily accessible power switch in case of SSVR failure or other emergency.

Plugging and unplugging loads with high current flowing is an easy thing to avoid for $15, so I definitely prefer to include one, for the reasons doug outlined upthread.

ahh understood... I keep my spa panel mounted near my control panel for this main power kill switch so that would be a good option here too.
Iive actually been using my spa panel breaker as the main power switch by turning it on and off after each brew session and so far I've had no problems with this over the years... well over 60 brew sessions and likely 30 CIP sessions... and my GFCI still works fine as I've recently discovered with a recent element issue.

Some people say using breakers as switches will shorten their life but when I was a maintenance man we used the same 15a breakers as switches for the parking lot LPS lighting turned on and off every day for the 20 years I worked there with no issues....