Looking for Advice on 110V 2 Vessel RIMS Setup

[drgonzo2k2]

Hey Gang,

Looking to change my brew setup, and I think I've settled on a 2-vessel RIMS system. I believe I've finalized my requirements for what I want out of it, so now I'm looking for some feedback on how best to enable this. Here is what I desire out of the system:

1. I want to do 5 gallon batches of things up to a SG of 1.1 or slightly higher
2. I want to do no-sparge, so full volume mash in a single infusion
3. I want to use gas to heat the strike water and do the boil and 110V RIMS to control mash temp and recirculate for the entire mash
4. I would like the ability to raise the mash temp up to 168 or so to mash out
5. I don't want to have to move hoses around during the entire brewing process (I'm okay changing hoses to drain to the fermenter)
6. I would love to continue to use my immersion chiller with whirlpool arm, but could be convinced to go with a CFC but am concerned with clogging as I use hop pellets and don't bag them

So based on all of that I'm thinking I need to go with something like:

• 2 - 16 Gallon Vessels (1 that's a dual purpose HLT/BK and 1 that's dedicated to the MT)
• Each vessel with a 3-way ball valve attached to the primary port
• Secondary port added to MT for recirculation
• 2 Pumps (would love to do this with 1 - but not sure if it's possible)
• RIMS tube setup
• Simple RIMS controller with 1 PID and 2 pump switches

If anyone could offer any advice or feedback before I go running off to buy parts I would greatly appreciate it. If you have a setup like this and wouldn't mind showing off some pictures, I would appreciate that too!

 

[doug293cz]

Hey Gang,

Looking to change my brew setup, and I think I've settled on a 2-vessel RIMS system. I believe I've finalized my requirements for what I want out of it, so now I'm looking for some feedback on how best to enable this. Here is what I desire out of the system:

1. I want to do 5 gallon batches of things up to a SG of 1.1 or slightly higher
2. I want to do no-sparge, so full volume mash in a single infusion
3. I want to use gas to heat the strike water and do the boil and 110V RIMS to control mash temp and recirculate for the entire mash
4. I would like the ability to raise the mash temp up to 168 or so to mash out
5. I don't want to have to move hoses around during the entire brewing process (I'm okay changing hoses to drain to the fermenter)
6. I would love to continue to use my immersion chiller with whirlpool arm, but could be convinced to go with a CFC but am concerned with clogging as I use hop pellets and don't bag them

So based on all of that I'm thinking I need to go with something like:

• 2 - 16 Gallon Vessels (1 that's a dual purpose HLT/BK and 1 that's dedicated to the MT)
• Each vessel with a 3-way ball valve attached to the primary port
• Secondary port added to MT for recirculation
• 2 Pumps (would love to do this with 1 - but not sure if it's possible)
• RIMS tube setup
• Simple RIMS controller with 1 PID and 2 pump switches

If anyone could offer any advice or feedback before I go running off to buy parts I would greatly appreciate it. If you have a setup like this and wouldn't mind showing off some pictures, I would appreciate that too!

From the first list:

1 & 2: Your mash efficiency is gonna be somewhere around 60% for a 1.100 OG beer with a no sparge process, and that's only if your conversion efficiency is 100%. If you get lower conversion efficiency, your mash efficiency will be proportionately lower.

4: No need or benefit to mash out when doing no sparge. It's just gonna make your brew day longer trying to hit mash out temp with a 2000W heater.

5: I think if you throw in another 3-way valve you can make this happen. How to do this is left as an exercise for the reader (if you can't figure it out, maybe I'll draw you a picture. )

From the second list:

1: A no sparge 5 gal batch of 1.100 OG beer is gonna have a mash volume of around 12 gal, with about 25 lbs of grain. More of both if your conversion efficiency is less than 100%. So, 16 gal vessels seem reasonable.

Brew on

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Thanks, Doug. Glad to know that I'm not completely off my rocker here.

Let me see how I get on with drawing something up using only 1 pump.

 

[Riot]

Have you considered the small 24v pumps a lot of people on here are using? You can get 2 of them and a power supply for like half of what a march or chugger will cost and you won't have to move pumps around

 

[mredge73]

Sounds a lot like my old system, however I did have to move some hoses around but not often.

To eliminate hose movement in this setup, a 3-way valve at the mash output would be needed to drain to the boil kettle.
The pump input would need a small manifold as to accept input from both the boil and mash kettles.
And that is about it as the pump priming valve can be used to feed a plate chiller or CFC.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

5: I think if you throw in another 3-way valve you can make this happen. How to do this is left as an exercise for the reader (if you can't figure it out, maybe I'll draw you a picture. )

Just one more ball valve, eh? OK, what am I doing wrong here?

STRIKE
- All water starts in HLT
MASH
- Water flows from HLT (1) to pump in
- Water flows from pump out (2) to MT
MASH RECIRC
- Wort flows from MT (3) to pump in
- Wort flows from pump out (4) to RIMS in
- Wort flows from RIMS out (5) to MT recirc port
BOIL
- Wort flows from MT (6) to pump in
- Wort flows from pump out (7) to BK
CHILL/WHIRLPOOL
- Wort flows from BK (8) to pump in
- Wort flows from pump out (9) to BK recirc port

I mean I think that will work, but I'm fairly certain it would just be cheaper (and less confusing) to add a 2nd pump.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Have you considered the small 24v pumps a lot of people on here are using? You can get 2 of them and a power supply for like half of what a march or chugger will cost and you won't have to move pumps around

Do you have a link? The ones I've found seem to be plastic, which I'd prefer to avoid.

I already have a center inlet chugger pump, so I'd like to re-use that. Just trying to avoid adding a second pump unless I have to.

 

[mredge73]

Just one more ball valve, eh? OK, what am I doing wrong here?

STRIKE
- All water starts in HLT
MASH
- Water flows from HLT (1) to pump in
- Water flows from pump out (2) to MT
MASH RECIRC
- Wort flows from MT (3) to pump in
- Wort flows from pump out (4) to RIMS in
- Wort flows from RIMS out (5) to MT recirc port
BOIL
- Wort flows from MT (6) to pump in
- Wort flows from pump out (7) to BK
CHILL/WHIRLPOOL
- Wort flows from BK (8) to pump in
- Wort flows from pump out (9) to BK recirc port

I mean I think that will work, but I'm fairly certain it would just be cheaper (and less confusing) to add a 2nd pump.

You are overly complicating it for no reason.

Path #2 is not necessary as path #4 can substitute in all instances.
Path #7 is not necessary as path #9 can substitute in all instances.
There is no reason to fill the kettles from the bottom up.

Valves on the kettle outputs now become single valves.
Input does not need a valve; a "T" will work.
1x 3 way valve remains on pump output supplying path 4 and path 9.
You can sub this one for a "T" with 2 single valves to save some money if you like.
You will probably want a priming valve at the output as well; this will give you 3x single valves at the output using 2x "T" fittings or 1x 3-way + 1x single.

One quick warning about leaving hoses on your boil kettle. Gas burners have a lot of over burn; flames that wrap around the kettle.
These flames can melt silicone if you leave them attached during the boil; you may want to use some sort of shield. Keggles do pretty well at keeping these contained but flat bottom kettles do not.

 

[BrunDog]

I am a huge fan of the 2 vessel rig and find them woefully under-represented!!

That said, what you are doing is feasible. If you want to do big beers, I suggest you consider some type of sparge (agreeing with Doug here). You could heat sparge water and pump it out of the BK into a bucket or cooler. Even if you pour cold water over the grains while draining into the BK, you would get the benefit of sparging. I also don't think a 120V element will be practical for mash out. It will take upwards of 20-30 minutes to perform that operation, depending on ambient temp and fluid volume.

 

[mredge73]

I am a huge fan of the 2 vessel rig and find them woefully under-represented!!

That said, what you are doing is feasible. If you want to do big beers, I suggest you consider some type of sparge (agreeing with Doug here). You could heat sparge water and pump it out of the BK into a bucket or cooler. Even if you pour cold water over the grains while draining into the BK, you would get the benefit of sparging. I also don't think a 120V element will be practical for mash out. It will take upwards of 20-30 minutes to perform that operation, depending on ambient temp and fluid volume.

+1

I did a no-sparge on my 2 vessel setup only on summer beers due to the efficiency hit. Normally my first runnings goes into a bucket while batch sparge water was pumped from the BK. Your current design will allow you to cold sparge without making any hose changes. The rims holds temp pretty well but does take a while to raise temp substantially. Mash out benefits are debatable.

 

[DemonsRun]

I am a huge fan of the 2 vessel rig and find them woefully under-represented!!

... You could heat sparge water and pump it out of the BK into a bucket or cooler. ....

I have a 15 gal mash tun (RIMs Rocket) and a 20 gallon electric boil kettle, and currently use an igloo Cooler to hold my sparge water, and it works pretty good. I just heat the sparge water up a bit more to account for heat loss. although there have been times I end up sparging a bit cool but my efficiency hasn't suffered much. 89% yesterday forgot to close the lid tight and sparge water was only 145F. (pre-boil and brewhouse according to Brewers Friend)

 

[MusicalBrewer]

Hey Gang,

Looking to change my brew setup, and I think I've settled on a 2-vessel RIMS system. I believe I've finalized my requirements for what I want out of it, so now I'm looking for some feedback on how best to enable this. Here is what I desire out of the system:

1. I want to do 5 gallon batches of things up to a SG of 1.1 or slightly higher
2. I want to do no-sparge, so full volume mash in a single infusion
3. I want to use gas to heat the strike water and do the boil and 110V RIMS to control mash temp and recirculate for the entire mash
4. I would like the ability to raise the mash temp up to 168 or so to mash out
5. I don't want to have to move hoses around during the entire brewing process (I'm okay changing hoses to drain to the fermenter)
6. I would love to continue to use my immersion chiller with whirlpool arm, but could be convinced to go with a CFC but am concerned with clogging as I use hop pellets and don't bag them

So based on all of that I'm thinking I need to go with something like:

• 2 - 16 Gallon Vessels (1 that's a dual purpose HLT/BK and 1 that's dedicated to the MT)
• Each vessel with a 3-way ball valve attached to the primary port
• Secondary port added to MT for recirculation
• 2 Pumps (would love to do this with 1 - but not sure if it's possible)
• RIMS tube setup
• Simple RIMS controller with 1 PID and 2 pump switches

If anyone could offer any advice or feedback before I go running off to buy parts I would greatly appreciate it. If you have a setup like this and wouldn't mind showing off some pictures, I would appreciate that too!

Did you ever get your system built? This is a similar concept to what I'm looking to build...I'm curious how yours turned out.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Did you ever get your system built? This is a similar concept to what I'm looking to build...I'm curious how yours turned out.

Hey, sorry for the delayed response, but yes I did. You can check out my other thread here.

I don't know if you'll read through thread or not, but I did end up having more of an efficiency problem than I was happy with. It got as low as 60% on one batch and averaged about 65 over about 6 brews.

I found I could get about 70% which is solid enough for me with a super fine crush, but that led to stuck mashes, at which point I added a Brew Bag to try to help with that. After a couple of batches that way I realized I was just basically doing 2 vessel BIAB for no reason. So I just removed one of the kettles from the setup and went pure BIAB.

Since doing that I've been much happier. I'm consistently getting 70% efficiency with no stuck mashes. There is half as much equipment to clean up, the whole brew day just seems to go much smoother, and they are definitely faster. Start to finish on a 6 gallon batch at I'm about 4 - 4 1/2 hours depending on what I'm brewing.

 

[tofuguy]

Since doing that I've been much happier. I'm consistently getting 70% efficiency with no stuck mashes. There is half as much equipment to clean up, the whole brew day just seems to go much smoother, and they are definitely faster. Start to finish on a 6 gallon batch at I'm about 4 - 4 1/2 hours depending on what I'm brewing.

I just switched to BIAB also for the fun of building an electric system. I also saw a time savings, but now I started brewing recipes that require a whirlpool addition and my time is the same now. But less cleaning is awesome.