Looking for a 20A 120V RIMS diagram -- it must already exist, right?

[Geordan]

Hey all,
Just looking to hunt down the "perfect" diagram for a max 20a 120V RIMS setup (likely a 1500w element) with PID. I've sifted through lots of PJ's diagrams, but none seem to be just right. I've found one that looks to be 90% there, but it includes a contacter between the SSR and the element and I'll confess I'm not sure why -- does the SSR control itself not switch the element properly? Have I massively misunderstood the purpose of the SSR?

Help appreciated -- thanks everyone!

 

[terodox]

I posted one earlier today. Rims in a box wiring diagram.

 

[shellej]

It is my understanding the SSR can cycle many times, on and off. The contactor switches large current. By using them together you insure that your PID is not stressed by large current draw.

 

[helibrewer]

An SSR is an optical relay. Instead of physical contacts, the "coil" is an LED and the "contacts" "close" when the LED is on. Since nothing physical is moving, the SSR can cycle very rapidly.

 

[Walker]

It's not related to stressing the PID. The contactor (or just a manual toggle switch) is desired for safety.

The PID will try to control the power to the element via enabling/disabling the SSR fairly rapidly. The mechanical contactor/switch is there to provide an override where the user can absolutely, positively, turn off the element regardless of what the PID & SSR are doing.

edit: SSRs are not optical devices. They are essentially huge transistors. You supply a low voltage and amp DC control signal and they can switch huge volage and amp DC or AC load on and off based on that control signal. The LED on there is just an indicator to let you know what is happening.

 

[Geordan]

I posted one earlier today. Rims in a box wiring diagram.

Just noticed it, looks very helpful. I notice there are no fuses indicated in the diagram, while PJ seems to nearly always include them -- were they omitted for clarity in the diagram, or are you not using them?

 

[P-J]

Hey all,
Just looking to hunt down the "perfect" diagram for a max 20a 120V RIMS setup (likely a 1500w element) with PID. I've sifted through lots of PJ's diagrams, but none seem to be just right. I've found one that looks to be 90% there, but it includes a contacter between the SSR and the element and I'll confess I'm not sure why -- does the SSR control itself not switch the element properly? Have I massively misunderstood the purpose of the SSR?

Help appreciated -- thanks everyone!

It would have helped if you posted a link to the diagram that you referenced.

Whatever. Good luck on sorting it out.

 

[terodox]

Sorry replying from my phone using the app.

 

[terodox]

I'm still refining my setup. I am planning to add fuses in the final setup.

 

[AllanMar]

edit: SSRs are not optical devices. They are essentially huge transistors. You supply a low voltage and amp DC control signal and they can switch huge volage and amp DC or AC load on and off based on that control signal. The LED on there is just an indicator to let you know what is happening.

The input to most SSR's is actually an LED (optocoupler). The input is optically coupled to provide isolation to a TRIAC to switch the current.

 

[Geordan]

It would have helped if you posted a link to the diagram that you referenced.

Whatever. Good luck on sorting it out.

PJ, my apologies -- it completely slipped my mind as I posted on my dinner break. The diagram I'm referring to is this one: http://www.pjmuth.org/beerstuff/images/Auberin-wiring1-SYL-2352-basic5-RIMS.jpg Apologies if I sounded ungrateful, definitely didn't mean to.

Walker, thank you for clarifying the inclusion of a contactor -- makes perfect sense.

 

[Walker]

The input to most SSR's is actually an LED (optocoupler). The input is optically coupled to provide isolation to a TRIAC to switch the current.

Well, I'll be damned. I never knew that.

My apologies to helibrewer.

 

[P-J]

PJ, my apologies -- it completely slipped my mind as I posted on my dinner break. The diagram I'm referring to is this one: http://www.pjmuth.org/beerstuff/images/Auberin-wiring1-SYL-2352-basic5-RIMS.jpg Apologies if I sounded ungrateful, definitely didn't mean to.

Walker, thank you for clarifying the inclusion of a contactor -- makes perfect sense.

Thanks for the link. Now for an explanation of the diagram. That particular diagram was drawn in response to a specific request. The decision (on my part) to include the contactor is due to the specific switches requested for the plan.

The Auber Instruments switch SW1 has a maximum load capability of 10A. The 120V 2000W RIMS element will draw 16.7A therefore the contactor is required to enable/disable the power feed to the RIMS tube.

Also (on another note) the pump switch is interlocked with the control to the SSR so that the pump must be on for the RIMS to be able to recieve power and heat the water. It is just a simple interlock to prevent dry firing and a possible disaster in the RIMS. (That info is in the foot notes at the bottom of the diagram.)

I sure hope this all makes sense. If you need more info, please ask.

P-J

 

[Geordan]

PJ, that's very helpful, thank you very much.
Is there a diagram that you would recommend I work from? I'm looking for something relatively simple, as the RIMS setup is meant to be a "stopgap" until my much larger brewery project gets under way this fall.
Thanks for your help!

 

[P-J]

PJ, that's very helpful, thank you very much.
Is there a diagram that you would recommend I work from? I'm looking for something relatively simple, as the RIMS setup is meant to be a "stopgap" until my much larger brewery project gets under way this fall.
Thanks for your help!

A diagram to work from???? The diagram that we just discussed that you linked. What is the problem with that one?

 

[Geordan]

A diagram to work from???? The diagram that we just discussed that you linked. What is the problem with that one?

Sorry, read too much in to when you said it was drafted for a specific request -- misinterpreted that as meaning it wasn't necessarily a "standard" implementation. Thanks for your help.

 

[P-J]

If you are looking for a more simple arrangement using common switches, this one might fit your needs.

http://www.pjmuth.org/beerstuff/images/Auberin-wiring1--SYL-2352-basic-RIMS.jpg

Edit - Note: BTW - Every diagram that I make is done for a specific request. Every one of 'em.

 

[Geordan]

That's fantastic, thanks PJ -- I'll report back on the build once parts start arriving! Thanks for all your help!