Kenmore 6 - keezer wiring help needed

[maierhof]

I need some electrical help here folks.
A while back I picked up this old Kenmore 6 chest freezer and have been slowly trying to work on this project until I hit a snag in the wiring.
Maybe I am thinking too much - I thought I could just bypass the thermostat and viola. No. Help!

Here are some the pics pertinent to my situation.

 

[maierhof]

More pics

I was hoping that the diagram pic would come out more clearly.. let me try again.

 

[maierhof]

Cricket...cricket...cricket

 

[raouliii]

I'll take a swing.

You haven't provided a viewable diagram yet, or at least a photo or explanation of the wiring prior to modifying it. A single, close-up, photo of each of the two left squares of the diagram would be nice.

It appears the thermostat was originally mounted in the lower left corner? Did you remove the thermostat already, or is it still hidden in there somewhere? What wires was it connected to?

What's the clear plastic module in your hand, an indicator light or do those wires feed the indicator light?

I can't tell for certain where the HOT wire of the power cord is going. The clear plastic module and then back out to the HOT (yellow) wire nut?

You need to provide a photo of the controller wiring. I see two neutrals leading up to the controller. That's one more than needed. Where are they connected?

I would recommend against the romex route for this wiring. The STC1000 terminals don't allow the amount of torque required to tighten against solid copper. And it's not exactly safe. Sacrifice a quality 14gauge extension cord for the project and install the controller in a plastic box or the keezer collar.

 

[maierhof]

I'll take a swing.

You haven't provided a viewable diagram yet, or at least a photo or explanation of the wiring prior to modifying it. A single, close-up, photo of each of the two left squares of the diagram would be nice.

Thank You!
Take a look at the final pic - it will explode pretty well.

It appears the thermostat was originally mounted in the lower left corner? Did you remove the thermostat already, or is it still hidden in there somewhere? What wires was it connected to?

it is still in/on the machine - and it hat a black (hot) wire going in and a red wire (hot?) coming out which then went into the compressor. It also has a link to a temp probe...

What's the clear plastic module in your hand, an indicator light or do those wires feed the indicator light?

the module is nothing more than an old large glue trap for connections. H and N connection busses basically

I can't tell for certain where the HOT wire of the power cord is going. The clear plastic module and then back out to the HOT (yellow) wire?

exactly

You need to provide a photo of the controller wiring. I see two neutrals leading up to the controller. That's one more than needed. Where are they're connected?

yeah I caught that a few mins after I took the photo and wrote it... Not my first stc experience though. Did a frigidaire sideXside just a few months ago and it works like a charm and even has defrost cycles and perfect recovery too.
I have a hot nut (yellow) where I connect power into the stc, then a neutral nut (red) where I connect the neutrals together. The second yellow nut connects the relay from the stc unit to the compressor.
What is crazy here is that I have taken the hot side and put it into the stc w no problems. It turns on, reads the temp, but it is just getting the compressor to kick on now... I have even switched the compressor lines (red vs white) around twice to no avail. I think the problem could be that I dont fully understand how the compressor should be wired - there is a pic then that says Run Start and Common - but there are only a red and a white wires on this compressor.

I would recommendations against the romex route for this wiring. The STC1000 terminals don't allow the amount of torque required to tighten against solid copper. And it's not exactly safe. Sacrifice a quality 14gauge extension cord for the project and install the controller in a plastic box or the keezer collar.

yeah - not ideal but it will just have to work since I had these two scraps left... yes I plan on using a plastic box and putting it in the box I plan to build on top. It is not safe use romex in this situation? Ummm... overkill yes but not safe?really?

 

[raouliii]

..... Take a look at the final pic - it will explode pretty well.....

It explodes about 5% for me.

.... it is still in/on the machine - and it hat a black (hot) wire going in and a red wire (hot?) coming out which then went into the compressor. It also has a link to a temp probe........

Is that "has" or "had"? I don't see it in the photos. Is it still wired in?

......I have a hot nut (yellow) where I connect power into the stc, then a neutral nut (red) where I connect the neutrals together. The second yellow nut connects the relay from the stc unit to the compressor.

What is crazy here is that I have taken the hot side and put it into the stc w no problems. It turns on, reads the temp, but it is just getting the compressor to kick on now... I have even switched the compressor lines (red vs white) around twice to no avail. I think the problem could be that I dont fully understand how the compressor should be wired - there is a pic then that says Run Start and Common - but there are only a red and a white wires on this compressor. ....

Still no photo of the controller wiring. Where is that second neutral connected to? Any wire nuts at the controller?

There might be more that you're not understanding.

Have you put a voltmeter on the red and white wires at the compressor?
Are you waiting for the delay time of the STC1000 to count down before expecting the compressor to kick on? The cool led on the controller will flash during this count down.

........ It is not safe use romex in this situation? Ummm... overkill yes but not safe?really?

No. It is not overkill, it's simply the wrong wire for the application, for a number of reasons. Romex is not intended or rated for exposed wiring. The solid copper may not create a solid, long term, connection and may become a problem later. SJO type cord, like that found in an extension cord or appliance power cord is a more appropriate wire.

 

[maierhof]

So I had some sucess this am...
I realized I was a dumb_ss and forgot to connect the cooling side to the hot block nut - embarassing but true.
It throws the switch and the compressor starts but doesnt run - it just keeps trying to start up. It did this three times before I disconnected it of course...
Almost there...

I am PMing you the diagram file the software is auto resizing it down

 

[maierhof]

It explodes about 5% for me.

Is that "has" or "had"? I don't see it in the photos. Is it still wired in?

Still no photo of the controller wiring. Where is that second neutral connected to? Any wire nuts at the controller?

There might be more that you're not understanding.

Have you put a voltmeter on the red and white wires at the compressor?
Are you waiting for the delay time of the STC1000 to count down before expecting the compressor to kick on? The cool led on the controller will flash during this count down.

No. It is not overkill, it's simply the wrong wire for the application, for a number of reasons. Romex is not intended or rated for exposed wiring. The solid copper may not create a solid, long term, connection and may become a problem later. SJO type cord, like that found in an extension cord or appliance power cord is a more appropriate wire.

See ur messages for the link to more photos
Yes I am missing something - insert real life electrical knowledge here - hopefully you can decode the wiring diagram for me

So I have the relay throwing now but it doesnt Run the compressor it tries to Start it but cant get over the start function and seems to be locked in a loop on Start

 

[raouliii]

Yes. It looks like you've rewired a little and it now appears to be wired correctly.

If the compressor is attempting to start then it's not likely to be a wiring issue anymore. Important question. Did the compressor function before you started this project?

The compressor may be bad or the start/run relay may be bad. I found two youtube videos that may help in troubleshooting.

As an explanation of how this relay works. If you look closely at the wiring diagram you will see a part labeled RELAY. The contact with the two arrows, associated with the terminal labeled S, should be closed when the compressor is off. When the compressor starts, that contact should open so the current only passes through the terminal labeled R.

The relay is physically underneath the box-like component that the red and white wires enter on the side of the compressor.

How to determine if the compressor is good or bad.

How to change the relay.

 

[maierhof]

Yes. It looks like you've rewired a little and it now appears to be wired correctly.

If the compressor is attempting to start then it's not likely to be a wiring issue anymore. Important question. Did the compressor function before you started this project?

The compressor may be bad or the start/run relay may be bad. I found two youtube videos that may help in troubleshooting.

As an explanation of how this relay works. If you look closely at the wiring diagram you will see a part labeled RELAY. The contact with the two arrows, associated with the terminal labeled S, should be closed when the compressor is off. When the compressor starts, that contact should open so the current only passes through the terminal labeled R.

The relay is physically underneath the box-like component that the red and white wires enter on the side of the compressor.

How to determine if the compressor is good or bad.
How to change the relay.

Excellent - thank you for finding those.
All day long I was hunting for that clear connector thingy thinking it was the relay/overload too... this clears that all up.

However - the bad news is that the compressor is fine - in fact the unit was ok before the upgrade.
The only thing was it would just run all day long with no rest - I figured it was the thermostat or temp sensor.

 

[raouliii]

.....However - the bad news is that the compressor is fine ......

Actually, that would be good news if it were true.

........ in fact the unit was ok before the upgrade.
The only thing was it would just run all day long with no rest - I figured it was the thermostat or temp sensor.

Not likely. If it was reaching temperature quickly and then undershooting by a wide margin, during these marathon run cycles, that might point to a possible thermostat issue. Running all day long just to reach and hold set temperature most likely means the compressor valves are leaking.

 

[maierhof]

Actually, that would be good news if it were true.

Not likely. If it was reaching temperature quickly and then undershooting by a wide margin, during these marathon run cycles, that might point to a possible thermostat issue. Running all day long just to reach and hold set temperature most likely means the compressor valves are leaking.

Doh!
Ok that is it...
No more am I going to sit idly by and listen to someone tell me that a machine is ok when I should just go freakin buy my own multimeter and figure out if it works correctly on my own. On my way to finally go buy one...

Thanks again for all your help on this - I owe you a beer ;>

 

[maierhof]

You are never going to believe this... I went out and retraced my wires and reconnected them.
Apparently the nut for the neutal block was a little loose... so I tightened it.
Now the machiine works fine. Really? Omg

 

[raouliii]

That IS good news. I was obviously wrong in stating that it was no longer a wiring issue. Wiring was correct but connections were the problem.

Good luck. BTW, I still recommend getting away from using that romex. It will only lead to trouble.

 

[maierhof]

That IS good news. I was obviously wrong in stating that it was no longer a wiring issue. Wiring was correct but connections were the problem.

Good luck. BTW, I still recommend getting away from using that romex. It will only lead to trouble.

Thank you and I will when I order all my control panel schtuff.
Problem is that it wont get colder then 39* so it wont be long anyway right?
Not bad for almost free... Lol

 

[maierhof]

Here are a few pics at the end of wiring
(Edit: sorry they were autosized so they dont explode real well. First one shows after of 4.0*C and then second shows before of 17.6*C)