Isolated Yeast (Tree House): How to Identify and Characterize?

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Yeast benefits from small amounts of Zinc. Supposedly malt doesn’t bring enough to the table. It’s usually available from tap water but not from RO. Yeast nutrient provides the zinc among other minerals and nutrients.
 
Yeast benefits from small amounts of Zinc. Supposedly malt doesn’t bring enough to the table. It’s usually available from tap water but not from RO. Yeast nutrient provides the zinc among other minerals and nutrients.
ah gotcha. i'll have to look into it.
 
I was at EQ Saturday and they had container of yeasttex 82 sitting out. Someone in this thread mentioned they use RO water so it makes sense.
 
Thanks to everyone whose contributed to this thread and your willingness to share information.

I've read a few comments about Tree House's brew timing (grains to glass). A recent twitter reply quoted 20 days.

Re TH temps: Attached control panel image was taken Dec '15, back when the can line snaked into the brewery. Most are set for 66/67.

View attachment 409533
I’m surprised no one has put more focus on this picture. Might be the answers to the test. Of course, things may have changed since then. Can you guess the beers being fermented here? Now that we have some experience with these yeasts, this might be helpful. @melville you’ve been running those low temps with some luck. Might have something here..
I have a 100% wb batch fermenting at 78+ which is smelling fantastic off the blow off. I’ll post results once complete. Don’t how how that and it’s temp would fit in with that picture though. Maybe they used a seperate temp controller for that if they were blending in a warm fermented wb batch. ‍♂️
 
I’m surprised no one has put more focus on this picture. Might be the answers to the test. Of course, things may have changed since then. Can you guess the beers being fermented here? Now that we have some experience with these yeasts, this might be helpful. @melville you’ve been running those low temps with some luck. Might have something here..
I have a 100% wb batch fermenting at 78+ which is smelling fantastic off the blow off. I’ll post results once complete. Don’t how how that and it’s temp would fit in with that picture though. Maybe they used a seperate temp controller for that if they were blending in a warm fermented wb batch. ‍♂️
I think the photo is pretty strong evidence that TH is not blending. I’m going to try a 62F blend for my next attempt.
 
I’m surprised no one has put more focus on this picture. Might be the answers to the test. Of course, things may have changed since then. Can you guess the beers being fermented here? Now that we have some experience with these yeasts, this might be helpful. @melville you’ve been running those low temps with some luck. Might have something here..
I have a 100% wb batch fermenting at 78+ which is smelling fantastic off the blow off. I’ll post results once complete. Don’t how how that and it’s temp would fit in with that picture though. Maybe they used a seperate temp controller for that if they were blending in a warm fermented wb batch. ‍♂️

I’ve looked at that photo a lot. If they were blending fermentation’s I would assume the POF+ yeasts would be in a much smaller fermenter. 5,6,7 are the small original fermenters (either 7 or 10bbl can’t remeber) so those would most likely be the ones to look at for higher ferment temps. Based on those ferment temps not sure you can really tell anything other than one or two are probably lagers, “magic” for Trail Magic?

Doubt there’s much we can glean from that photo unfortunately.
 
Also worth remembering that yeast behave differently in large fermenters, and it's quite common for temperatures to be changed as part of the scale-up process from pilot brews.
there may be a relation here to the chatter from the BA boards that the charlton beers are not at the level of monson and there has been a larger discrepancy in consistency between batches.
 
I think that was one of the biggest issues.. seems like the beers scales to the 60bbls just fine but the 120s weren’t that friendly. Trillium went through three different yeasts since moving to the bigger fermenters in Canton. Obviously that’s not as easy an option for Treehouse.
 
got this nugget from nates twitter
 

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damn, the last week has just been dragging by since I brewed the batch that was hit with Juice (1318) and T58. Going to pull gravity today and begin cold crashing and will keg it up Wednesday. Haven't been this excited for a beer in quite a bit, hopefully it doesn't suck.
 
damn, the last week has just been dragging by since I brewed the batch that was hit with Juice (1318) and T58. Going to pull gravity today and begin cold crashing and will keg it up Wednesday. Haven't been this excited for a beer in quite a bit, hopefully it doesn't suck.
I got something similar going with so4 and T-58 fermented cool. And on the same schedule! I might keg tomorrow or Wednesday. How much T-58 you use?
 
I got something similar going with so4 and T-58 fermented cool. And on the same schedule! I might keg tomorrow or Wednesday. How much T-58 you use?
1 full package of Juice and 2 grams of t58 into like 5.25gallons or so. I fermented a little warm to avoid that clove. 66, bumped to 68 on day 5 along with attaching co2 and second dry hop. 69 on day 6 and 70 on day 7
 
I'd just like to say thanks to everyone in this thread for all your hard work. I haven't come close to reading all the posts and likely never will. But I brew a lot of NEIPAs and I'm always tweaking my process and trying different yeasts. I just brewed one with the S04/T58/WB06 blend and I'm very happy with it. Granted, I also deviated from my typical New England base grist. But really happy with the yeast blend and definitely will be using it again.
JCYDBMu.jpg
 
1 full package of Juice and 2 grams of t58 into like 5.25gallons or so. I fermented a little warm to avoid that clove. 66, bumped to 68 on day 5 along with attaching co2 and second dry hop. 69 on day 6 and 70 on day 7
My batch came out great. Not a Belgian pale ale at all! ;) kegged last night. FG 1.012 but tastes slightly sweet and dry like I could drink it all night. Btw I used about half the amount of t-58 you used. Now 2-3 weeks in the keg force carbing.
 
My batch came out great. Not a Belgian pale ale at all! ;) kegged last night. FG 1.012 but tastes slightly sweet and dry like I could drink it all night. Btw I used about half the amount of t-58 you used. Now 2-3 weeks in the keg force carbing.
yup just kegged mine yesterday, which was also at 1.012. Kegging was a super pain in the ass, I seemed to have screwed up my closed transfer and after 3ish hours and only moving ~3 gallons, I decided to do an open transfer while blanketing the keg and fermenters with co2. I go the burst carbing route because I am super impatient. It's sitting at 40psi now, tonight i'll drop it do like 25-30, and hopefully be able to pull a well carbed pint saturday.
 
God. Ive been following this thread with such interest I only just realised the absurdity of my quest to perfect a clone of a beer I've never tasted due to living in Scotland. anyone fancy a swap of a case of cloudwater for treehouse exchange? or a single malt? could send someone a LTD edition malt for some good American beer. all the stuff we get off yours is crap by the time it's shipped here by normal channels..
 
Yeah, 5 gallon batch. I did 92%/5%/3% (SO4/T58/WB06) for a total of 23 grams (about two packs) since it was a 1.064 OG batch and I didn't want to underpitch.
I have been brewing this also with those same percentages but for a 5 gal batch my 92% is one pack of SO4. I am having a little problem as my beer FG is .09 and I want it to be higher, I have mashed at 154 but still comes out lower than I am shooting for. Basically I want the mouthfeel to be fuller the beer tastes great but am looking for suggestions to get a thicker feel. Maybe some lactose?
 
Mash for a shorter period of time And/or mash higher. Mash time has a bigger impact on fermentability than temperature. Conversion probably happens in 15 minutes. I’ve mashed for as little as 15 minutes at 158 to get a stout to finish high.

And double check to make sure your thermometer is correct
 
I have been brewing this also with those same percentages but for a 5 gal batch my 92% is one pack of SO4. I am having a little problem as my beer FG is .09 and I want it to be higher, I have mashed at 154 but still comes out lower than I am shooting for. Basically I want the mouthfeel to be fuller the beer tastes great but am looking for suggestions to get a thicker feel. Maybe some lactose?
I mashed this one at 156. I've been going back and forth between 154 and 156, mainly because I keep switching yeasts and trying different ones. But this one mashed at 156 with that yeast blend ended at 1.014, which is right where I prefer these to finish.
 
Mash for a shorter period of time And/or mash higher. Mash time has a bigger impact on fermentability than temperature. Conversion probably happens in 15 minutes. I’ve mashed for as little as 15 minutes at 158 to get a stout to finish high.

And double check to make sure your thermometer is correct
FWIW, the last time I tried a shortened (30m) mash on a NEIPA, I missed gravity horrendously. I think it's tougher to get full conversion in a shortened mash when you have so many flaked/unmalted(?) adjuncts. Granted, that was totally dependent on my grain bill, and that one was 35% flaked oats + wheat.
 
Mash for a shorter period of time And/or mash higher. Mash time has a bigger impact on fermentability than temperature. Conversion probably happens in 15 minutes. I’ve mashed for as little as 15 minutes at 158 to get a stout to finish high.

And double check to make sure your thermometer is correct
Never heard the advice to mash for shorter period to increase body which I would think is somewhat equivalent to fuller mouthfeel. I would expect that less fermentables would be present with a shorter mash time as conversion may not be complete but then you would need 3 x the grist to get the OG where you want it. I have not been fully converted several times as indicated by the iodine test at 30 minutes. My thermometer is a fairly good digital version which I have calibrated . Just my 2 cents.
 
May be a silly question, but what’s the best/correct way to prepare the blended dry yeast? Just measure out each percentage and mix? Any special care of the container? Do I have to rehydrate? Thanks for the advice.
 
May be a silly question, but what’s the best/correct way to prepare the blended dry yeast? Just measure out each percentage and mix? Any special care of the container? Do I have to rehydrate? Thanks for the advice.
I don't rehydrate, just before pitching I measure out the T58 and Wb06 onto a small piece of new aluminum foil, I cut it to weigh 1 gm, then open the SO4 and dump the other two into the pack. I then dump the entire contents into the carboy/fermentor.
 
Never heard the advice to mash for shorter period to increase body which I would think is somewhat equivalent to fuller mouthfeel. I would expect that less fermentables would be present with a shorter mash time as conversion may not be complete but then you would need 3 x the grist to get the OG where you want it. I have not been fully converted several times as indicated by the iodine test at 30 minutes. My thermometer is a fairly good digital version which I have calibrated . Just my 2 cents.

I will find the studies for you.. mash length has a much bigger affect on FG than temp, especially if you’re using 2row. You will get full conversion in a very short period of time. A lot of pro breweries mash for an incredibly short period of time.

I first read about it in a BYO clone recipe for Everett from Hill Farmstead. A 7.5% Robust Porter that has a FG of 1.030. The recipe specifically states to mash for a short period of time to ensure an unfermentable wort and a high FG.
 
Y’all see this from Hill Farmstead the other day? Ideas on carbonation to help mouthfeel?
IMG_7898.jpg
 
Krausen your next hoppy beer... I bet you’ll notice a bit of a difference in texture and mouthfeel.
 
Do you use wort saved from the original batch pre fermentation? How much do you need, do you add additional sugar?

I take wort from a presently fermenting batch that is at high krausen, just like the traditional way. It requires a little more timing but honestly it can be any somewhat similar beer, doesn’t need to be the exact same grain bill or hops. For instance I just krausened a Belgian Pale with an APA that had a bunch of Galaxy in it... can’t detect the Galaxy at all. Depending on the gravity of the high krausen beer it doesn’t take much. I put a keg on a scale and do it by weight.

As far as mouthfeel goes, I like this quote from Noonan...

“Introducing 10-15% new beer at bottling produces a smoother beer with finer bubbles than other means of carbonation. It completely bonds carbonic gas to the beer so that carbonation is less apparent. This is the only means by which a truely smooth beer can be brewed”

There’s a krausen priming calculator on brewersfriend.
 
I take wort from a presently fermenting batch that is at high krausen, just like the traditional way. It requires a little more timing but honestly it can be any somewhat similar beer, doesn’t need to be the exact same grain bill or hops. For instance I just krausened a Belgian Pale with an APA that had a bunch of Galaxy in it... can’t detect the Galaxy at all. Depending on the gravity of the high krausen beer it doesn’t take much. I put a keg on a scale and do it by weight.

As far as mouthfeel goes, I like this quote from Noonan...

“Introducing 10-15% new beer at bottling produces a smoother beer with finer bubbles than other means of carbonation. It completely bonds carbonic gas to the beer so that carbonation is less apparent. This is the only means by which a truely smooth beer can be brewed”

There’s a krausen priming calculator on brewersfriend.
Well that pretty much spoils if for me as I can't handle more that one batch at a time. I do like the info regarding the path to the Truely Smooth beer!
 
I take wort from a presently fermenting batch that is at high krausen, just like the traditional way. It requires a little more timing but honestly it can be any somewhat similar beer, doesn’t need to be the exact same grain bill or hops. For instance I just krausened a Belgian Pale with an APA that had a bunch of Galaxy in it... can’t detect the Galaxy at all. Depending on the gravity of the high krausen beer it doesn’t take much. I put a keg on a scale and do it by weight.

As far as mouthfeel goes, I like this quote from Noonan...

“Introducing 10-15% new beer at bottling produces a smoother beer with finer bubbles than other means of carbonation. It completely bonds carbonic gas to the beer so that carbonation is less apparent. This is the only means by which a truely smooth beer can be brewed”

There’s a krausen priming calculator on brewersfriend.

That sounds awesome and exactly what I want to try and do.


Well that pretty much spoils if for me as I can't handle more that one batch at a time. I do like the info regarding the path to the Truely Smooth beer!

Save some of the original beer or maybe create another beer with some DME?
 
not liking the blend of 1pkg juice (1318) and 2g T-58, it's tart af. did 66for 5 days, and slowly ramped it 1 degree/day until 70 and cold crashed. Mash pH was 5.24 or so.
 
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