India Red Ale with Belgian Twist?

[jskinner10]

New to recipe formulation. Critiques welcome...

Type: Extract
Batch Size: 5.00 gal
Starting Boil Vol: 4.00 gal
Boil Time: 60 min
Est Original Gravity: 1.072
Est Final Gravity: 1.011
Est ABV: 8.0%
Bitterness: 53.4 IBU
Est Color: 21.6 SRM

1 lbs 8.0 oz Caramel Malt - 80L 6-Row (Briess) (80.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM)
3.0 oz Special B Malt (180.0 SRM)
5 lbs Amber Dry Extract (12.5 SRM) Dry Extract (Late addition @ 15 min)
2 lbs Light Dry Extract (8.0 SRM) Dry Extract (Boil 60 min)
1 lbs Light Brown Sugar (8.0 SRM)

0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min 14.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 20.0 min 17.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Boil 10.0 min 10.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min 6.8 IBUs
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min 4.4 IBUs
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min 0.0 IBUs
1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min 0.0 IBUs
0.50 oz Chinook [13.00 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min 0.0 IBUs

1000 ml starter made from 1 pkg of White Labs WLP500 Trappist Ale

Thanks for any advice.

 

[rexbanner]

IMO, stick with the smaller number Caramels for an IPA. 80 and 120 is going to get you a flavor that I just don't think works well in an IPA, but like I said, that's just my opinion.

If you want to get more color, use a tiny amount of black patent or chocolate malt. If you want more color and maltiness, sub a little munich extract instead of normal extract. I'd recommend going with 50/50 gold and munich syrup from northernbrewer.com.

Finally, IMO WLP500 works best at low temperature and will not cut through the amount of hops you want to use to give a noticeable taste. Instead, use WLP550. 550 is your go-to yeast for Belgian-American hybrids. It's a pretty kick-ass yeast in general. 500 is great, too, but it has a flavor that I feel can be overshadowed easily.

 

[944play]

I'd eschew the crazy yeast entirely on a hop bill like that, personally. Belgo-Indian style brews seldom do much for me. The rest reads like a nice big red American strong ale though, and would probably be delish with a clean, attenuative strain like Chico or Notty. Save the 500 for a simpler recipe where the esters can take the spotlight without being upstaged, like a Tripel or Blond.

 

[jskinner10]

Hmm, yeah maybe I'll just do some chico yeast for this one and do a belgian quad sometime. Might be safe to just keep it at an American Strong. Thanks.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

I'll disagree with 944 on this one... I like the Belgian IPA combination. The interplay between the Belgian fruity esters and the American hops can be really nice an interesting.

For your recipe, though, I think you're *way* heavy on the crystal. I'd replace the Amber DME with extra-light DME (or even Pilsner DME). I'd drop your C80L to 1#, drop the 120L entirely, and make up the color with the Special B (to taste) and black patent or roasted barley in small quantity if you don't get there with just the Special B. Replace the brown sugar with cane sugar -- with everything else in this recipe you're not going to pick up anything from using brown. I'd also consider ensuring your cane sugar reaches ~10-15% of your recipe to ensure you get good attenuation.

21 SRM is a bit heavy for a red ale as well... The BJCP for Irish Red suggests 9-18 SRM. I did an American red ale earlier this year that was a nice copper/red color at 15.5 SRM.

The key for a style like this is keep the maltiness subdued, letting the yeast & hop both share center stage. A pound of Crystal is the max I'd add, and the addition of the sugar will be good to help lighten it up given that you're trying to get the yeast to chew through all that DME (i.e. if you were all-grain I'd suggest a low mash temp, but since you're not, the sugar helps quite a bit).

 

[jskinner10]

bwarbiany, I was thinking I went heavy on the crystal. I dropped the 80L down to 1# and the 120L entirely. Brought the color up to 21.9 SRM with 8.0oz Special B and 4oz Roasted Barley. I'm not too worried about BJCP style guidelines on this one. Im looking for a dark red color. Also, I swapped the brown sugar for 1# of corn sugar. Any reason in particular you suggested using cane? Do you agree with rexbanner in that WLP550 would be a good yeast for this if I wanted to stick with the belgian idea?

 

[neomantra]

I'm also a fan of the belgian IPA combo. Having tried several variations of these over the years I'd suggest cutting back on your hops. Using as much as you've got there you'll be overshadowing the yeast too much.

If you want to keep a hop bill similar to what you've described I'd focus on the chinook and cascade and ditch the amarillo. The chinook has a bit of spice aroma in it which is a belgian trait (like the saaz) and you'll get your citrus from the cascade.

Maybe not 100% relevant since you want a red beer here, but the best Belgian IPA I've ever made is the Austin Homebrew Tripel IPA recipe kit. Given your interest in this style I'd suggest giving it a try if you haven't yet. They go with a mix of some goldings, saaz and palisade hops I think. It uses the trappist high gravity yeast. I've tried 550 in belgian IPAs before and it was OK but I think I like the trappist high gravity one better personally.

 

[jskinner10]

I've actually been thinking about getting that AHS Tripel IPA or the NB one. Both sound like great beers. Might save doing that for next spring though.

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

bwarbiany, I was thinking I went heavy on the crystal. I dropped the 80L down to 1# and the 120L entirely. Brought the color up to 21.9 SRM with 8.0oz Special B and 4oz Roasted Barley. I'm not too worried about BJCP style guidelines on this one. Im looking for a dark red color. Also, I swapped the brown sugar for 1# of corn sugar. Any reason in particular you suggested using cane? Do you agree with rexbanner in that WLP550 would be a good yeast for this if I wanted to stick with the belgian idea?

I'm a bit worried that you're making a Belgian India Strong Dark Ale, not a Red... You're going to get plenty of flavor from the Special B & Roasted Barley, not just color. If that's what you're going for, it's all good...

Regarding the sugar, either is fine. I just know buying cane sugar at the store is cheap and easy, so that's usually what I use.

As for yeast, I don't brew enough Belgians to have an opinion, and for most of those I've done recently, I've been able to get the house yeast from a local brewery, so I haven't had to make the choice between 500 and 550.

 

[jskinner10]

Maybe I'll just make this an American Strong and save the Belgian stuff for a proper Belgian Quad. Maybe i'll just pitch some Chico yeast. Or do an english ale yeast like arrogant bastard?

 

[KyleWolf]

There is a brewery in Birmingham Alabama called Good People. They have done an India Belgian Red and it was very very tasty. They called it "red headed stepchild". The beer is quite possible if you do it right. So I say go for it.

http://www.goodpeoplebrewing.com/stepchild

Unfortunately the recipe is not attached.