How do I get a strong "Citrus" present in my beer?

[CaptainCookie]

Hi everybody, I was planning to brew an inexpensive and simple blonde ale, but as simple it is, it should have a special characteristic to shine, so I thought why not just a strong citrus present in both flavor and aroma

I tried with a flame-off addition of hops with a hop stand of 10 min, but with very poor results, so what's the key to getting a strong citrus characteristic in beer?

I tried for a 1.85 gallon batch:
- 4.4lbs Maris otter
- 1.10lbs carapils
Hops
-columbus 0.14oz, 60'
-cascade 0.18oz, 15'
-cascade 0.5oz, flame-off, 10' hopstand at 192°F
again, poor results, citrus aroma or flavor barely perceivable

maybe dry-hopping could make a difference, but what would be the ideal hop, amount and time for it? also, I work with a standard 2.64gal carboy as fermenter, and in my LHBS only sell pellet hops, so I'm concerned if I use a dry hop bag, is gonna be floating just in the top of the carboy instead of being in the bottom, any advice?

 

[mongoose33]

Why not try dry-hopping with Citra?

 

[Electrake]

A longer flamout/whirlpool will help, i typically try for ~20min depending on my patience, as well as a larger addition since not many IBU's are added from this. Also hops that are more citrusy like Citra, or get some lemon from sorachi ace. Might even try getting a little crazy with it and dry hopping pellets on top of the krausen!

 

[AZBeer]

I do a super citrusy APA that I hop with Simcoe and Citra, and bitter with Columbus.

You may want to decrease the temp and increase the time on your whirlpool hops.
I would dry hop with an 1oz or 1.5oz of Citra. Pellet hops tend to absorb and drop when you dry hop in a bag, but I will usually sanitize a couple of marbles, and add them to the dry hop bag.

 

[carloslavin]

Am I the only one that gets more "tropical" than "citrus" from Citra?

 

[FunkedOut]

Not sure if you saw this:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=633719

Summary is, long duration flameout hop and dry hop.
Don't know if it works as I'm not a hoppy guy.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

The newish Lemondrop hop might be an obvious one to try, supposedly it's on the very lemony side of citrus. Citra's an obvious one, Cascade+Amarillo is a pretty classic combination.

If you want a strong hoppiness, then I'd be aiming for at least an ounce per gallon and I'd forget the 15 min addition, throw an ounce in at 5 min and an ounce in once you're below 160F, or maybe half then and half as a dry-hop.

BUT - that's assuming fresh hops. Obviously northern hemisphere hops will be a year old now, and Cascade is a notoriously poor keeper - if it''s been kept at room temperature it will have about a third of the alpha written on the packet, even if in a fridge it will be down to 2/3. One can assume that the tasty bits have suffered similarly - so you need to compensate depending on how you or your supplier have kept them.

One option might be to look at some southern hemisphere hops like Motueka (more limey) or Pacifica (more orangey), at least they'll be 6 months fresher.

 

[cactusgarrett]

One thing you didn't mention is whether or not you're open to the citrus flavor/aroma coming from sources other than hops. One option is to use lemon/orange zest or a tincture/tea made from them. This would allow you to make something like your original simple blonde ale while not ratcheting up the bitterness or dumping in tons of late addition hops.

 

[CaptainCookie]

A longer flamout/whirlpool will help, i typically try for ~20min depending on my patience, as well as a larger addition since not many IBU's are added from this. Also hops that are more citrusy like Citra, or get some lemon from sorachi ace. Might even try getting a little crazy with it and dry hopping pellets on top of the krausen!

I'm pretty worried about the IBU contribution of the hop stan, I tried the brewfriend calculator for some insight and got these results (Pic related)

there's an important contribution of IBUS during this step, it's all related to the Utilization percent, and the temperature of the hop stand, I've read an article that stated that the isomerization stops after the 79°C (174°F) so technically for a minimum IBU contribution should a do the hop stand around that temperature for a longer time for sterilization, flavor and aroma purposes´, right?

about using other sources different from hops to get the citrus character, I've heard about using lemon or orange zests, I'm guessing that is used during the boil? or like a dry hopping as well?

 

[JordanKnudson]

Am I the only one that gets more "tropical" than "citrus" from Citra?

I'm with you on this. I think it's just tempting to exaggerate the idea of citrus in these hops because of the suggestive name (which might even cause us to taste more citrus than we otherwise would...ah the power of suggestion). But I agree with you, while there is a bit of citrus in there (which is true of like 9 out of 10 hops varieties, it seems), citra hits me as bright tropical fruit. My mother-in-law took one whiff of an all-citra IPA I had on tap once and said, "Did you make pineapple juice beer?"

 

[Northern_Brewer]

there's an important contribution of IBUS during this step, it's all related to the Utilization percent, and the temperature of the hop stand, I've read an article that stated that the isomerization stops after the 79°C (174°F) so technically for a minimum IBU contribution should a do the hop stand around that temperature for a longer time for sterilization, flavor and aroma purposes´, right?

about using other sources different from hops to get the citrus character, I've heard about using lemon or orange zests, I'm guessing that is used during the boil? or like a dry hopping as well?

That first paragraph is all true - but cold-side hops also contribute non-alpha bitterness which doesn't rely on isomerisation in the same way as alpha acids. Having said that - I wouldn't sweat it, just follow this recipe and see how you like the result. Then adjust. Three points :

1) Cascade is a notoriously poor keeper, at this time of year northern hemisphere Cascade will have lost 1/3 to 2/3 of its bitterness (and its flavour for that matter) depending on how well it's been kept.

2) Calculating IBUs is just that - a calculation. The apparent bitterness will vary tremendously depending on what else is going on, a lot of it will get "buried" in a very juicy style.

3) Actually some bitterness is important to balance the beer, no matter what some people seem to think.

 

[brew703]

I'm thinking of brewing a blonde using either orange or texas red grapefruit peel. maybe use Simcoe and / or citra.

 

[carloslavin]

I'm with you on this. I think it's just tempting to exaggerate the idea of citrus in these hops because of the suggestive name (which might even cause us to taste more citrus than we otherwise would...ah the power of suggestion). But I agree with you, while there is a bit of citrus in there (which is true of like 9 out of 10 hops varieties, it seems), citra hits me as bright tropical fruit. My mother-in-law took one whiff of an all-citra IPA I had on tap once and said, "Did you make pineapple juice beer?"

Funny how we rely on other non-homebrewer people for these opinions. I served several friends pints of the Citra Summer Cerveza recipe that is floating around in the forum (great summer beer, really) and while they couldn't put their finger on the exact type of fruit, they did mostly describe it as a "bright yellow fruit" kinda flavor. That seems more tropical than citrus to me.

On the other hand, the Lagunitas IPA recipe floating around here uses only Cascade and Centennial. That one is pure citrus (although more kinda grapefruit).

 

[Konadog]

I just made a "Citra Pale Ale" that used Citra and Cascade hops. The sample I tasted going into the fermenter tasted like pure orange or tangerine juice. I'll keg this this weekend hoping that it still tastes the same or close. I think you need to pare something with Citra to bring out the citrus flavor.

 

[marjen]

First of all use hops like Citra, galaxy, mosaic, ekuanot, simcoe etc both in a whirlpool and in a dry hop. I make 5 gallon batches and use about 4-6 oz of these hops after the boil cools to about 170. I then stop cooling and let it sit for about 30 mins. Then start up again. For dry hop I use 6-8 oz of hops and add on day 2-3. Don't worry about what brewers friend says. That does not seem to accurately calculate bitterness from whirlpool hops. None of my beers are ever bitter. Also I use a small amount of columbus in the boil, (.25 oz @60 and .75 oz @10) for bitterness. Made some very citrusy smelling and tasting beers with this method.

 

[jessup]

With grapefruit candi syrup! How else?!?

 

[Northern_Brewer]

Worth noting that Citra is full of geraniol, which is one of the best-studied substrates for biotransformation, it turns into more citrusy/limey compounds. So if you split a batch and dryhop one half after fermentation has finished, you should find it tastes very different to if you dry hop early in fermentation.

 

[tennesseean_87]

I like to add citrus zest at flameout of my priming sugar. That way it doesn't get scrubbed out during fermentation.

 

[Grod1]

It might be hard for you to find but worth looking for. (maybe even at a garden center still) but lemon grass/balm or even better lemon verbena gives way more lemon flavor then lemon or lemon peel.