How Common is an Infection ?

[Brewmegoodbeer]

I have never had and infection (I follow proper sanitation procedures), but I was wondering how common an infection really is? Are we scared of something that doesn't happen that often, or will you definitely get an infection if you don't use sanitizer?

 

[kh54s10]

If you don't use sanitizer, IMO, it is just a matter of time. If you are reasonably attentive to sanitization you might never get an infection. 5 years 5 months and no infections. :smack: Damn, I just jinxed myself!

 

[2trout]

I feel the part of the infection equation is the complexity of your brewing system/rig. I could be wrong on this, but the more parts/pots/valves/pumps, ect., the larger your risk of a batch with some funky yeast.

Cleanliness is king! Sanitation is second in my book.

 

[bobeer]

I feel the part of the infection equation is the complexity of your brewing system/rig. I could be wrong on this, but the more parts/pots/valves/pumps, ect., the larger your risk of a batch with some funky yeast.

Cleanliness is king! Sanitation is second in my book.

Totally agree with this! The more moving parts the more issues you can have is what I always say.
I've been brewing for about 5 years and I'm currently sitting at 0 infections. I use starsan in a spray bottle and just quickly spray everything down and then use hot, regular, pain ole water to clean everything. I don't really take a lot of time in the sanitation of stuff but I also do not skip it.

 

[brick_haus]

I have not had any infections either. 4 years and counting. I just keep the hot side clean, basic thorough sanitation on the cold side and try not to expose cooled wort to the elements any more than is necessary. And I don't use plastic.

 

[kh54s10]

I have not had any infections either. 4 years and counting. I just keep the hot side clean, basic thorough sanitation on the cold side and try not to expose cooled wort to the elements any more than is necessary. And I don't use plastic.

Plastic has little to nothing to do with it. I have you beat by a year and 5 months and the only glass I use is my starter flask and bottles.....

 

[Denny]

I've brewed over 500 batches in 20 years. I think I've had maybe 4-5 infected batches.

 

[TheMadKing]

No infections in 10 years of brewing, I don't consider myself particularly anal about sanitation. I only sanitize items that will touch cool wort, and I only dip/spray star san on them briefly before using them (a couple seconds).

If there's mold on any of my equipment, I replace it or bleach it though.

 

[HLSheppard]

Started brewing in the mid 90's. Took a break for about a decade, then got back into it hot and heavy 14 months ago. My very first batch was infected. That's been it. I'm just like TheMadKing. I am not crazy anal about it - just common sense and careful. I cook as well so maybe that helps. I ferment in plastic and can tell you that has nothing to do with cleanliness. Starsan is an equal opportunity sanitizer.

 

[bbohanon]

Brewing for close to 4 years now and only one infection about 2 years ago..occured in the keg when a fruit fly dive bombed into the keg and I did not see it.
I rack from fermentor directly to keg through the out posts now to keep any bugs from sneaking in. Keeps the beer from getting as oxidated as well.

I thought I had another infection once when I was using kraft caramels in a porter but it turned out to just be some sugars from the caramels re-crystallizing on the surface..was very odd to see, but the beer was great!

As others have said, brewing great beer is relying on proper cleaning techniques.

 

[brick_haus]

Plastic has little to nothing to do with it. I have you beat by a year and 5 months and the only glass I use is my starter flask and bottles.....

Not sure what your point is. Are you saying that you have successfully used plastic for fermentation without problems?
The only glass that I use is for starters and bottles also, Stainless for everything else.
Anyway, I'm not saying that plastic will cause infections, just noting that I don't use it. Guess I could have left that note out since it is irrelevant.

Peace

 

[TheMadKing]

Not sure what your point is. Are you saying that you have successfully used plastic for fermentation without problems?
The only glass that I use is for starters and bottles also, Stainless for everything else.
Anyway, I'm not saying that plastic will cause infections, just noting that I don't use it. Guess I could have left that note out since it is irrelevant.

Peace

The way you phrased it did seem to imply that you correlate avoiding infections to not using plastic.

I do successfully ferment in plastic and have for years without a problem, for the record.

 

[alane1]

I've had one in 15 years. I blame that one on a dud pack of yeast. It took about 3 days to show signs of fermentation, during which an infection took over. By the time I pitched healthy yeast it was too late. So while cleanliness and sanitation are important yeast health is up there too.

 

[beergolf]

Pay attention to sanitization and they are very rare. I have had one in over 300 brews and it was my fault. I pulled the blow off hose, got distracted and forgot to put on an airlock. It sat in the basement for about two weeks without the airlock. duh.

 

[filthyastronaut]

I've had a few, but not that many, and one pellicle that had no effect on the quality of my beer. I'd agree that simpler systems reduce the likelihood of infection if we're talking post boil. They're fairly common though judging from posts all over the internet and brewers I know personally. Microorganisms are everywhere, and some of them love beer.

 

[Brownalemikie]

36 batches and no infections (fingers crossed). Of course I only brew extract brews and only one kind of beer.....naturally Caribou Slobber. Did I mention I love this stuff?

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Its sort of like syphilis and hepatitis C, If you throw caution to the wind you'll eventually get it...From that point forward you'll do everything you can not to get it again

 

[griffi]

36 batches and no infections (fingers crossed). Of course I only brew extract brews and only one kind of beer.....naturally Caribou Slobber. Did I mention I love this stuff?

Seriously? I know Caribou Slobber (American Brown Ale) is good, but you've brewed 36 batches of it and nothing else??? Have you tasted Commons, Bitters, Nut Browns, Porters, Stouts, IPAs, Belgians (there's a universe all to itself; trappists, pales, darks, dubbels, tripels, quads, saisons, etc., etc.), Hefeweizens, Lambics, Sours, etc.? I say this all while I have a keg of Caribou Slobber in my kegerator, which, yes is good, but for the love of all that is beer, branch out my homeboy!

 

[Brewmegoodbeer]

If I brewed only one beer (and extract at that) I would get super bored. For me, most of the fun in this craft is experimenting by making different styles of beers and developing my own recipes. Go all grain, buy the beersmith software and start expanding the horizon! I do understand that some people only like 1 specific beer though. I have a friend that will drink absolutely nothing but yeungling (atleast its not budweiser).

 

[Brewmegoodbeer]

Very good point. The risk is out there so atleast have protection to reduce the risk!

 

[Brewmegoodbeer]

Its sort of like syphilis and hepatitis C, If you throw caution to the wind you'll eventually get it...From that point forward you'll do everything you can not to get it again

Very good point. The risk is out there so atleast have protection to reduce the risk!

 

[Brownalemikie]

Seriously? I know Caribou Slobber (American Brown Ale) is good, but you've brewed 36 batches of it and nothing else??? Have you tasted Commons, Bitters, Nut Browns, Porters, Stouts, IPAs, Belgians (there's a universe all to itself; trappists, pales, darks, dubbels, tripels, quads, saisons, etc., etc.), Hefeweizens, Lambics, Sours, etc.? I say this all while I have a keg of Caribou Slobber in my kegerator, which, yes is good, but for the love of all that is beer, branch out my homeboy!

Long story short....I moved from Minnesota to Florida about a year ago. While in MN I fell in love with a craft brown ale called Bitteschlappe and after moving to Florida I couldn't find anything even close to it. So, I thought I'll brew my own brown ale. Well, my home brewed Caribou Slobber is even better than Bittesclappe.

And yes, I've tried many varieties of beer and don't care for lagers, IPA's, or stouts. Why mess with perfection? JMO

 

[foam_top]

I had my first infection this last summer. I wasn't happy about it but the beer was drinkable. It was a stout and had all the characteristics of one but with an added, very mild, white wine or vinegar taste.

If you get an infection you might as well let it ferment out and see what you end up with. Unless you only have one fermentor and desperately want to move onto a batch with a better probable success

 

[kh54s10]

Not sure what your point is. Are you saying that you have successfully used plastic for fermentation without problems?
The only glass that I use is for starters and bottles also, Stainless for everything else.
Anyway, I'm not saying that plastic will cause infections, just noting that I don't use it. Guess I could have left that note out since it is irrelevant.

Peace

The way you phrased it did seem to imply that you correlate avoiding infections to not using plastic.

I do successfully ferment in plastic and have for years without a problem, for the record.

The way you worded it I also took it as "If you use plastic fermenters you will get infections".

 

[Terek]

in think some people get a bit carried away with sanitation. I basically just swirl some around in my fermenter before draining my boil pot into it. And i drop my transfer hose in some, as i swirl it around in the keg before kegging. I also scrub the crap out of my plastic bucket fermenters with a wet rag. I have never had an infection in 6 years, and over 400 brews. Cider is a bit different. It is easy to get an infection on cider. I always go overboard with sanitation, and only ferment in glass

 

[mongoose33]

I think the issue with plastic is if it gets scratched and nasties take up residence in those scratches. Harder to clean, sanitizer only sanitizes the surface, not what's underneath.

I have four little green spray bottles ($1 at chinamart) filled with Star-San. I spray posts, hoses, quick disconnects; tubing, the nozzle of the spigot on the fermenter, the stopper for the airlock when I remove it to draw a sample, the area around the bunghole so if I rub the thief against it I won't transfer nasties to the beer....

Overkill? Maybe. Problem is, I don't know where the line between just OK and overkill resides. So if I'm going to make an error, I'll make it on the overly sanitized side.

Some of this is just developing habits; once our actions become habits, we no longer have to think about them, we just do them.

I once forgot to spray the spigot nozzle on my fermenter before I transferred to a keg; worried about that one for a while but I dodged a bullet there.

 

[homemaltster]

Have I had an infection? Possibly. When I'm experimenting with new beers I've never brewed before/not following a recipe, I think it can be hard to pinpoint that an odd flavor is an infection or just something else.

That being said, I recently brewed a 100% malted oat beer that had a little funk to it. When I brewed it again, I made some adjustments to the brewing process, got proper conversion, and that funky flavor wasn't present. So was the difference from a lack of infection or from me working out the kinks in my brewing process?

My main point is that unless you're quite familiar with a recipe, I think there's a certain amount of speculation about unexpected flavors. The easiest thing to do is blame it on an infection. Do others feel like they can peg an infection with 100% certainty?

 

[Denny]

If I brewed only one beer (and extract at that) I would get super bored. For me, most of the fun in this craft is experimenting by making different styles of beers and developing my own recipes. Go all grain, buy the beersmith software and start expanding the horizon! I do understand that some people only like 1 specific beer though. I have a friend that will drink absolutely nothing but yeungling (atleast its not budweiser).

Ya know, not everyone has the same reasons and means to brew. I know some people who have always brewed extract and make fantastic beers. Let's acknowledge that it's homebrewing and everyone gets to decide what's right for them.

 

[ncbrewer]

In a 2007 Basic Brewing broadcast, Charlie Talley made the statement that Cleaning theoretically eliminates the need for sanitizing. Sanitizing is insurance. To me, the difference between "theoretically" and "insurance" is huge. I want that insurance.

 

[Denny]

I think the issue with plastic is if it gets scratched and nasties take up residence in those scratches. Harder to clean, sanitizer only sanitizes the surface, not what's underneath.

That's the conventional wisdom, but it is seldom borne out in reality. Where could bacteria hide where a good cleaner and sanitizer couldn't get to them?

 

[mongoose33]

That's the conventional wisdom, but it is seldom borne out in reality. Where could bacteria hide where a good cleaner and sanitizer couldn't get to them?

I'm certainly no expert on bacteria and what their preferences are regarding places to hide, but I do know that despite my using PBW in the recommended amounts in my boil kettle, I still must use a bit of elbow grease to really get things clean.

The same goes for when I clean my plastic fermenter. I run it through a Mark II carboy cleaner with PBW and while that does a nice job of getting things mostly clean, completely clean it does not do. A little bit of extra help washing it by hand (takes about 60 seconds) and I'm comfortable that it's clean.

Now, maybe PBW sterilizes the remaining soil, but I've never read that it does. And since the carboy cleaner does not remove 100 percent of krausen, old hops, whatever, it stands to reason for me that it's not necessarily going to remove bacterially-laden soil that is in a scratch.

So, A) I try very hard not to scratch my fermenters, using only a soft cloth or wet paper towel on them, and B) I take pains to clean using PBW but not relying on it solely to clean.

BTW, love the All-Stars book.

 

[Dog House Brew]

I've brewed over 500 batches in 20 years. I think I've had maybe 4-5 infected batches.

You really should start to enjoy and get into this hobby Denny. Now that is home brewing. I've had 1 in almost 100. When I didn't know about hard water and Starsan.
Not one since I started mixing with Distilled water.

 

[MidAtlanticBrew]

This resinates with me, Before I got married, I didn't throw out batches because I had an infection, I had an infection because I threw out batches.

Its sort of like syphilis and hepatitis C, If you throw caution to the wind you'll eventually get it...From that point forward you'll do everything you can not to get it again

 

[Denny]

I'm certainly no expert on bacteria and what their preferences are regarding places to hide, but I do know that despite my using PBW in the recommended amounts in my boil kettle, I still must use a bit of elbow grease to really get things clean.

The same goes for when I clean my plastic fermenter. I run it through a Mark II carboy cleaner with PBW and while that does a nice job of getting things mostly clean, completely clean it does not do. A little bit of extra help washing it by hand (takes about 60 seconds) and I'm comfortable that it's clean.

Now, maybe PBW sterilizes the remaining soil, but I've never read that it does. And since the carboy cleaner does not remove 100 percent of krausen, old hops, whatever, it stands to reason for me that it's not necessarily going to remove bacterially-laden soil that is in a scratch.

So, A) I try very hard not to scratch my fermenters, using only a soft cloth or wet paper towel on them, and B) I take pains to clean using PBW but not relying on it solely to clean.

BTW, love the All-Stars book.

One nice thing about the bucket form factor is that it's much easier to clean than a carboy shape. That's one reason I stick with buckets. FWIW, all of my infections have come when I was using glass or SS. I'm sure that's a coincidence, not an indictment, but it does show that using plastic buckets as fermenters will not in and of itself cause a problem.

Glad ya like the book!

 

[griffi]

Long story short....I moved from Minnesota to Florida about a year ago. While in MN I fell in love with a craft brown ale called Bitteschlappe and after moving to Florida I couldn't find anything even close to it. So, I thought I'll brew my own brown ale. Well, my home brewed Caribou Slobber is even better than Bittesclappe.

And yes, I've tried many varieties of beer and don't care for lagers, IPA's, or stouts. Why mess with perfection? JMO

If something works for you, I guess you keep on truckin'!