Citra IPA recipe needs some tweaking

[Anthonie]

I brewed a Citra IPA as follows:

OG- well I forgot to test for it.
FG- 1.010

3 gallon

3.6 lbs Extra light DME

.6 oz Citra 60 min
.6 oz Citra 30 min
.6 oz Citra 15 min
.6 oz Citra 10 min
.6 oz Citra 0 min
1 oz citra dry hop 7 days

safale US-05 1 packet
corn sugar to carbonate
Fermented 14 days

The beer came out alright, except the bitterness does not compliment how dry the beer is. Any suggestions on how to make the body of the beer more full? My thoughts were to either switch to a light pale extract or increase the amount of the extra light extract to closer to 4-4.5 lbs...

Thanks ahead of time for any suggestions.

 

[BeardedBrews]

Steep some munich or caramel malt while you're heating up the water. Probably 0.25-0.50# of C40 in a grain sock would give it some nice sweetness to offset the IBUs. If you're keeping that level of hopping, I would also increase that extract. 4.5# gets you into that 1.050 sweet spot on a 3 gallon batch.


You could also move all the hops to late additions:

1oz at 15 minutes - 2oz at 0 minutes (steep for 20) - 1oz Dry


Have you taken a look through the Zombie Dust thread, it's one with tons of information and plenty of emotion (plus it's basically the beer you're trying to make)

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=303478

 

[Anthonie]

Thank you for the quick response and helpful information. I'll check out the zombie dust thread.

 

[Shade]

If you are after mouthfeel without affecting the colour then wheat extract or Carapils I'd say. Light/medium crystal would also do it but will darken it slightly, if that matters to you. Carapils will make it sweeter, wheat I think won't.

 

[KVANTAN]

Add 10 more ounces of hops.

 

[Anthonie]

Add 10 more ounces of hops.

What would 10 more ounces of hops do. It's plenty bitter and great aroma.

 

[joshesmusica]

Typing those numbers into beersmith, I've got:

OG - 1.052 (likely what you got, as it's hard to not hit the numbers with extract)
FG - 1.010
ABV - 5.6%
IBU - 98!!!
EBC - 5.8

Here's what I would do to fix it in order to get it more into the American IPA style:

Go up to 4 lbs, change to Pale or "Golden" light DME
Steep .5lb crystal 20L

.6 oz Citra - 60 min
.6 oz Citra - 10 min
.6 oz Citra - 5 min
1.2 oz Citra - hopstand 170F (same idea as the 0 min addition, except you're going to actually chill the wort to 170F, then add the hops, then let it sit for at least 30 mins)
1 oz Citra - dry hop 5-7 days.

This will give you:

OG: 1.056
Exp FG: 1.013
ABV: 5.7%
IBU: 50
EBC: 12

 

[Hello]

I agree, a splash of crystal will help with mouthfeel. I don't think 1.010 is all that dry though. Could be, but in my opinion that is right where I like my IPAs to finish.

 

[joshesmusica]

I agree, a splash of crystal will help with mouthfeel. I don't think 1.010 is all that dry though. Could be, but in my opinion that is right where I like my IPAs to finish.

Yeah, I actually thought that too. I would assume it's more a function of the 98 IBUs OP got in the first batch as compared to that 1.010 and fairly low (for an IPA) OG. I almost said to add some table sugar to my above suggestion.

 

[Anthonie]

I am playing on changing some hops around completely when I redo it tomorrow by adding some Amarillo at the start, maybe for 60min. Then 15 10 and 5min with citra. I also plan to steep some Crystal and Munich for 10 min. Hopefully that will balance the bitterness. I also agree with adding another .4 lbs of the extra light DME.

 

[Anthonie]

Typing those numbers into beersmith, I've got:

OG - 1.052 (likely what you got, as it's hard to not hit the numbers with extract)
FG - 1.010
ABV - 5.6%
IBU - 98!!!
EBC - 5.8

Here's what I would do to fix it in order to get it more into the American IPA style:

Go up to 4 lbs, change to Pale or "Golden" light DME
Steep .5lb crystal 20L

.6 oz Citra - 60 min
.6 oz Citra - 10 min
.6 oz Citra - 5 min
1.2 oz Citra - hopstand 170F (same idea as the 0 min addition, except you're going to actually chill the wort to 170F, then add the hops, then let it sit for at least 30 mins)
1 oz Citra - dry hop 5-7 days.

This will give you:

OG: 1.056
Exp FG: 1.013
ABV: 5.7%
IBU: 50
EBC: 12

What is the purpose of the hop stand. It's and interesting idea and I've never had it suggested before. Does the lower tempurature of the wort lessen the bitterness produced by the hops?

 

[BeardedBrews]

Lower temperature will reduce the IBU contribution in the finished beer. The same principal for the dry-hopping, just a really cold whirlpool

 

[joshesmusica]

What is the purpose of the hop stand. It's and interesting idea and I've never had it suggested before. Does the lower tempurature of the wort lessen the bitterness produced by the hops?

A lot of people have been experimenting with it lately and have found that it extracts high amounts of the significant oils for flavors and aroma but it's still under the temperature threshold for isomerization of the alpha acids, which is where the bitterness comes from.

Traditionally speaking, it's really what the 0 min addition is. Because in larger breweries (read, bigger than homebrew scale), they would throw those hops in, and start the cooling/whirlpooling. That's why the addition is also sometimes referred to as a whirlpool addition. But because they're dealing with significantly larger portions of wort, it takes much longer for it to cool, so those hops have a significant amount of time still at those prime temps for flavor and aroma.

So on the homebrew scale, because we can chill the wort a lot faster, then we chill down to that prime temperature range, and hold it there for some time, in order to try to replicate what it would be like at a larger scale.

As far as your recipe goes and the tweaks you're wanting to make, I would highly suggest using a recipe software. There's plenty online for free, although I personally believe beersmith to be the best. If you're serious about the hobby and know you're going to stick with it, spending the $30 for it is chump change in my opinion.

I would also suggest to keep reading up a lot about how each ingredient works. For example, if you're going to start adding more hops, there's no need to necessarily add them all at the 60 min addition as well. In fact, the best thing for that addition is just to find some high alpha acid, cheap hop with a clean bitterness profile, and just use that. Then save the hops with great flavor and aroma, like citra and amarillo, for the late additions.

Lastly, if you're really going for that IPA-level bitterness, with a hop flavor and aroma that smacks you in the face, think about trying some of the new methods of hops additions. Meaning, a 60-min addition to get you up to the IBU range you're looking for, then additions no earlier than 10 mins after that. I usually just do a very large 5 min addition, a very large hopstand addition, and a very large dry hop addition. Some people ( I'm looking at you @m00ps ) are even doing multiple hopstand additions and different temperatures with good results.

 

[m00ps]

you leave me out of this, its not my fault all the damn amarillo is gone this season. I only used a pound or so last year

^but yeah, great explanation of how to effectively utilize that flameout addition to your advantage as a homebrewer

 

[GrogNerd]

I HIGHLY recommend this clone recipe for Deschutes' Fresh Squeezed IPA* (usually my favorite 3 IPAs are the last 3 I've had, but this one stays in my top 3)

looks a lot like what you're going for. I'd even say subbing your Amarillo for the Nugget in the recipe would up the awesome

Citra is great, but a Mosaic/Citra combo is just delicious

even if you don't go with this recipe, I 2nd the other recommendations and add some Caramel/Crystal and some Munich

*this recipe was the last brew I did (extract version) and, due to my being a moron, didn't turn out to be an exact clone, it came close enough and a few friends preferred my version doing a side-by-side. but I think it had more to do with the freshness of mine vs how long the Deschutes' had been sitting around

 

[grassfeeder]

I've taken what is essentially the base of the zombie dust clone and made some alterations that have yielded fantastic results.

first - I replaced the FWH from Citra to Mosaic. Then, used Vermont Ale Yeast from The Yeast Bay in place of Cali Ale. Gives it a huge citrusy punch.

 

[cantrell00]

I recently did a step mash of 50/50 pale, raw wheat. .50 oz @ 60, 15, 5, & 0. 1.5 oz dry hop that was killer.

1.062/1.014 - mixture of US05/WLP007.