Campden tablets and Potassium sorbate

[Afonso Correia]

Hey there
Im Im new at this and planning to make a batch of mead
I read about it and some places said i i needed to add Potassium sorbate to halt the fermentation process and other places i read i also had to add crushed campden tablets before fermentation
Do i need to do both?
Crushed campden tablets before yeast and potassium sorbate before bottling
Also what tips can yall give me

 

[Blacksmith1]

Depends on what you are fermenting. Store bought juices don't have to have campden at the start. Honey is a natural antibiotic. The campden at start is to stop bacteria and wild yeast. At bottling you will want to use both.
As for tips read. A lot. There are many threads here with useful info. And don't be afraid to ask, all of us started the same as you, not knowing what to do.

 

[Afonso Correia]

Depends on what you are fermenting. Store bought juices don't have to have campden at the start. Honey is a natural antibiotic. The campden at start is to stop bacteria and wild yeast. At bottling you will want to use both.
As for tips read. A lot. There are many threads here with useful info. And don't be afraid to ask, all of us started the same as you, not knowing what to do.

Planning on using only water honey and yeast so would i need them tablets?

 

[RPh_Guy]

Honey has a low enough count of wild microbes that you don't need to add sulfite before fermentation, but it does reduce risk.

You only need sorbate if you want sweet mead.

Sulfite after fermentation is always recommended to avoid oxidation and wild microbe activity.

 

[Afonso Correia]

Honey has a low enough count of wild microbes that you don't need to add sulfite before fermentation, but it does reduce risk.

You only need sorbate if you want sweet mead.

Sulfite after fermentation is always recommended to avoid oxidation and wild microbe activity.

So campden before just for prevention
Sorbate to get sweeter mead
And campden after definitely to prevent oxidizing and prob make it last longer

 

[RPh_Guy]

Sorbate stops yeast reproduction. It doesn't make mead sweet on its own.

For example you could make a 10% ABV mead and allow it to ferment dry. Let it settle. Rack it off the yeast, and then you can add sorbate and additional honey for sweetness. The sorbate stops the yeast from reproducing so that there are not enough cells to ferment the additional honey.

Hope this makes sense.

I highly recommend reading some books to get started. It's harder to sift through all the info and different processes on random sites and forums.

 

[Afonso Correia]

Sorbate stops yeast reproduction. It doesn't make mead sweet on its own.

For example you could make a 10% ABV mead and allow it to ferment dry. Let it settle. Rack it off the yeast, and then you can add sorbate and additional honey for sweetness. The sorbate stops the yeast from reproducing so that there are not enough cells to ferment the additional honey.

Hope this makes sense.

I highly recommend reading some books to get started. It's harder to sift through all the info and different processes on random sites and forums.

Any recommendations?

 

[RPh_Guy]

The Compleat Meadmaker comes highly recommended though it's a little out of date.

For updated protocols:
BOMM is a great method that uses liquid yeast.
TOSNA is a solid protocol for dry yeast.
https://www.gotmead.com/ generally has useful info.

Hope this helps. I'm not exactly an expression meadmaker myself; there's a learning curve.

 

[Blacksmith1]

My favorite https://www.amazon.com/Make-Mead-Li...like+a+viking&qid=1564363287&s=gateway&sr=8-1

 

[applescrap]

Depends on what you are fermenting. Store bought juices don't have to have campden at the start. Honey is a natural antibiotic. The campden at start is to stop bacteria and wild yeast. At bottling you will want to use both.
As for tips read. A lot. There are many threads here with useful info. And don't be afraid to ask, all of us started the same as you, not knowing what to do.

+1 Los dos for the finish. Couldn't find the exact science behind both, but ps stops it from regeneration and PM/campden makes it inhospitable? Either way both are necessary for a good clean backsweeten imo. Just ps should theoretically work, if you go that route rack off yeast, ps, and then cold crash before sweetening, I think would be a good process.

 

[RPh_Guy]

+1 Los dos for the finish. Couldn't find the exact science behind both, but ps stops it from regeneration and PM/campden makes it inhospitable? Either way both are necessary for a good clean backsweeten imo. Just ps should theoretically work, if you go that route rack off yeast, ps, and then cold crash before sweetening, I think would be a good process.

You should always use sulfite with sorbate because otherwise there may be off flavors from bacteria (LAB with sorbate alone may produce a strong geranium flavor).

 

[SKBugs]

And while we are talking about campden tablets, what's the best protocol for adding them to the mead? I crush them with a mortar and pestle and sprinkle them in and the little bits just sit on the top of the mead like for ever. Are we supposed to mix them with hot water or something first?

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

Mix it in a sample of mead, or filtered tap, (I know the Campden is used to neutralize chlorine and chloramphenicol, it is just what I would do) them add it to the bulk.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Just wanted to add: After crushing, gently mix the sulfite in mead or room temp water (not hot).

Oxygen inactivates sulfite, so too much stirring is detrimental.

 

[madscientist451]

So campden before just for prevention
Sorbate to get sweeter mead
And campden after definitely to prevent oxidizing and prob make it last longer

You don't need to add any chemicals to your mead, although adding nutrients helps with fermentation, avoids off flavors and will help produce a drinkable mead without waiting a year or more for aging.
Commercial mead makers use chemicals in their mead as precautions because they don't want to risk having a problem with a 500 or 1,000 gallon batch.
I never add Campden before or after fermentation. Any wild yeast present in the honey hasn't caused any problems. If you make a regular strength mead, above 12% ABV, the alcohol acts as a preservative, so I don't add it after fermentation.
If I make a low ABV mead I usually bottle and prime it for carbonation, so I don't want to add Campden/sorbate.
If you want a sweeter high ABV mead, add enough honey to get above the alcohol tolerance of the yeast you are using.
Check out the Mead Made Right website for a nutrient calculator:
https://www.meadmaderight.com/tosna.html
Your results may vary and probably will, so do what works for you.

 

[RPh_Guy]

Any wild yeast present in the honey hasn't caused any problems.

It's all peachy until something bad does happen.
The very first show mead I attempted with raw honey, the gravity dropped a lot lower than expected and it had off-flavors, definitely signs of wild yeast. Dumped about $40 worth (one gallon).

My experience may be atypical, but there is a good rationale for being cautious.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

Ouch, honey isn’t cheap! The presumption is OP plans to back sweeten their mead, I think so anyway.... plus campdon during racking reduces oxidation. I do not generally pretreat the must, but I do want to protect the mead from oxidation.

 

[Seamonkey84]

It's all peachy until something bad does happen.
The very first show mead I attempted with raw honey, the gravity dropped a lot lower than expected and it had off-flavors, definitely signs of wild yeast. Dumped about $40 worth (one gallon).

My experience may be atypical, but there is a good rationale for being cautious.

There may have been wild yeasts in the honey or from the air when making your must, but don’t even domestic yeasts have a hard time with show meads? Since there’s no nutrients added, they typically need a long time to ferment and even longer to age.

 

[RPh_Guy]

There may have been wild yeasts in the honey or from the air when making your must, but don’t even domestic yeasts have a hard time with show meads? Since there’s no nutrients added, they typically need a long time to ferment and even longer to age.

I used TOSNA. I think "show mead" means no other flavors besides honey?

 

[Seamonkey84]

I guess I saw show meads in the literal sense of only honey, water, and yeast. Though nutrients are just dead yeasts in most mixed.

 

[RPh_Guy]

I guess I should just call it "mead", but regardless I'm pretty sure the over-attenuation and off-flavors were from wild microbes in the honey.

 

[madscientist451]

I'm pretty sure the over-attenuation and off-flavors were from wild microbes in the honey.

Its possible, but the wild yeasts I've used (in cider, I do at lest one wild cider every season) have a pretty low alcohol tolerance and off-flavors in mead can come from a wide range of sources.
Sulfites have been used for a long time and great results have been achieved using them. I usually just choose not to use Sulfites and perhaps up 'till now I've just been lucky.