Brewery doesn't allow mixing beers

[Rhumbline]

Remember the hipster video?

"Hey there! umm bartender. Mix me up two of your beers that will really taste YUMMY!" "The last bar I was at, the mixes tasted like crap to Me. I'm going to tell everyone not to go there! Their craft beers are crap beers."

Spot on!

I respect the hell out of a restaurant that tells people "No, you can't have A-1 sauce, piss off and go to Longhorn's if that's the experience you're after!"

The customer is always right? The customer is almost always an idiot! If they knew everything, they'd be sitting at home drinking their own homebrews.

I ran a restaurant for a short time, it was a distinct pleasure to have my chef throw out the pretentious a-holes from time to time.

Yes Princess, order the shrimp alfredo "gluten free" and tell me you're lactose intolerant. I dare you, I double dare you!

 

[donk5]

I enjoy mixing beers and do it fairly often at multiple breweries. I typically mix browns with porters or stouts but have done all kinds. Sometimes it ends up being great and other times not so much. I have had bartenders act surprised at my request but have yet to be denied. I am honestly surprised that the majority of people responding have not done it themselves.

 

[rodwha]

Has anyone mixed a beer to improve the quality of a failed batch?

Though I've enjoyed a black and tan, mixing beer in general doesn't get me going. But I did buy two 32 oz mugs as I had a honey blonde that I used far too much honey malt in that had a very grainy taste that just wasn't palatable, and so I mixed it with wheat beers (a hit or miss style for me) that I wasn't fond of both because it had no character I appreciated, but also because it was weak.

I'm considering buying some stout if my stout doesn't improve much more than it has. Time has very slowly been making it better, but I fear that it's likely at it's greater point now as it's been nearly 3 months now in the bottle.

It's not horrible anymore, but it's not right either. It seems rather strange and is nearly uncarbed.

 

[daksin]

Let me get this straight: you tried to give this business money, for their beer, and they refused? I'd find somewhere else to drink, personally. Failing that, talk to a manager?

 

[aiptasia]

I layer mix Marshall Zhukov and Good Gourd every fall during the holidays. It's the world's best black and tan. That woman's nuts. Who cares if you mix your beers?!?!

 

[Gameface]

I mix my own beers sometimes. Seldom does it result in something greater than the sum of its parts, but frequently it'll help me down a brew I'm a little disappointing in, although at the cost of a little of a brew I'm very happy with. Although there have been a few times I had two brews that I wasn't happy with, like harsh bitterness in one and a little overly sweet on another, and the mix is better than either flawed beer on their own.

I see mixing as a way to take the sharp edges off a not so stellar beer. Usually if you nail a beer style you want to appreciate the finer points of that style. Mixing dulls those finer points in most cases.

 

[rodwha]

That sums it up to me!

 

[Dutchbier]

Just because you are spending your "hard earned" money for somebody's product you do not automatically earn a right to tell the person how to run his/her business. there are many facts and nuances we do not know here. As a small business owner you need to have your radar operating because there times when the customer is far from right. And you gotta stop a situation before it becomes a situation.

FWIW I like mixed beers!

 

[CA_Mouse]

This sounds like sour grapes to me... I'm guessing the OP is the same type that would go into a casino and demand to play 7 card stud at a black jack table and get pissy because they told him no. House rules trump everything else. Belittling the server because she was most likely following her rules for employment, makes the customer the least liked person in the place.

Someone mentioned that she was looking for a bad tip, I'd rather have a bad tip than a bad customer.

 

[danimalt]

This sounds like sour grapes to me... I'm guessing the OP is the same type that would go into a casino and demand to play 7 card stud at a black jack table and get pissy because they told him no. House rules trump everything else. Belittling the server because she was most likely following her rules for employment, makes the customer the least liked person in the place.

Someone mentioned that she was looking for a bad tip, I'd rather have a bad tip than a bad customer.

And I'm guessing you're the type of person who judges people without ever meeting them, but that's just what I gathered from your post and not knowing you I couldn't really be sure. Really? A parallel between asking for a black and tan and 7 card stud at a blackjack table that's a bit of a reach.

 

[pablosbrewing]

The entire episode is worth watching - but check this video from 18:30ish for a classic reason for mixing from Fred Eckhardt



I don't follow Brewing TV anymore, they lost the groove.

 

[dumbbrian]

I have mixed beers to "improve" the quality of a failed batch. I had brewed a batch of cherry chocolate stout, using cherries from the local farmers market, but it turned out wicked sour and never really carbed in the bottle.

I ended up brewing an identical batch minus the cherries, opened all of the bottles and blended the old with the new in the secondary for a month or so. The sour was cut down a good deal and I was able to get good carbonation the second time around, but I still ended up drinking it by myself in the dark to hide my shame...

 

[Crito]

I work at a brewpub and our brewmaster/owner is very picky about how his beers are served - proper glass, no fruit, no mixing. we don't have a nitro faucet, so usually telling people that the beer won't separate is enough. I have poured a customer two half pints and given them a third glass to mix in if they so choose, but most people are ok with drinking the beer as-is. I sometimes mix a little beer out of the taps as a personal experiment, but it never produces anything better than the base beer (and often ends up worse).

running a business is a tough mix of sticking to your vision and giving the customers what they want. I think we can all agree that we want brewmasters who are passionate about their beer and want to present it in the best way possible. on the other hand, if a customer is that adamant about mixing beer, I would probably make an exception to keep them happy.

Awesome answer. I would love a brew pub with that attitude where I live.

 

[rodwha]

As much as I'd like to think or even say there's no problem with mixing beers, there certainly could be.

And it'd whoever's brewery. He said not here.

The attitude might mean a lot. But I'd respect it if that was the answer, and even more so with an answer of it may be bad for my business or my output is off kilter or something.

To me mixing my beer is because there was a problem, and it looks as though I have another one and it was a good investment buying 32 oz mugs. It happens it seems...

 

[CA_Mouse]

And I'm guessing you're the type of person who judges people without ever meeting them, but that's just what I gathered from your post and not knowing you I couldn't really be sure. Really? A parallel between asking for a black and tan and 7 card stud at a blackjack table that's a bit of a reach.

No it isn't a stretch. I've seen people get asked to leave a brewing house because they wouldn't accept the house rules. I've also seen people asked to leave poker tables for the same reasons. Their house, their rules. If you don't like it that is your issue and they don't have to serve you.

 

[Epimetheus]

2. is it wrong to mix beers at a brewery when I am the one paying for my beer?.

It makes sense from a business point of view if you are trying to strictly track the consumption of one versus the other. "We sold 3x12 oz Lite and 2x22 oz stout". So get a third empty glass and mix. Otherwise, no reason.

OT - at one place I ordered a Belgian sour, just the bottle without a glass. Too many BMC drinkers at that chi-chi tapas bar.

 

[dfc]

I work at a brewpub and our brewmaster/owner is very picky about how his beers are served - proper glass, no fruit, no mixing. we don't have a nitro faucet, so usually telling people that the beer won't separate is enough. I have poured a customer two half pints and given them a third glass to mix in if they so choose, but most people are ok with drinking the beer as-is. I sometimes mix a little beer out of the taps as a personal experiment, but it never produces anything better than the base beer (and often ends up worse).

running a business is a tough mix of sticking to your vision and giving the customers what they want. I think we can all agree that we want brewmasters who are passionate about their beer and want to present it in the best way possible. on the other hand, if a customer is that adamant about mixing beer, I would probably make an exception to keep them happy.

I couldn't have put it better myself. I'd be a little upset if someone wanted to put fruit in my beer, but if I were brewing in order to make money I'd put my feelings aside and give the customer what they wanted.

 

[dfc]

It's the only solution.

Awesome.

 

[dfc]

Has anyone mixed a beer to improve the quality of a failed batch?

Though I've enjoyed a black and tan, mixing beer in general doesn't get me going. But I did buy two 32 oz mugs as I had a honey blonde that I used far too much honey malt in that had a very grainy taste that just wasn't palatable, and so I mixed it with wheat beers (a hit or miss style for me) that I wasn't fond of both because it had no character I appreciated, but also because it was weak.

I'm considering buying some stout if my stout doesn't improve much more than it has. Time has very slowly been making it better, but I fear that it's likely at it's greater point now as it's been nearly 3 months now in the bottle.

It's not horrible anymore, but it's not right either. It seems rather strange and is nearly uncarbed.

I've never mixed in order to improve a batch. I have had 2 bad batches (in almost 4 years) that I waited until I just wanted "1 more beer" to drink though. I've never really had the desire to mix though, whether to improve a bad batch or to create a new flavor which the brewer did not intend.

That being said I'm not opposed to mixing a bad beer w/ a good beer in order to make it better. I'd be weary of making the good beer worse, however.

 

[masonsjax]

It's like a chef telling wait staff not to let people use salt or not to mix meat and potatoes on their plate. I dont necessarily want a black and tan but it's pretentious to forbid it. People for the most part have very unrefined palates, get over it.

 

[MrHadack]

I'm on the fence about this one. I don't mix beers typically, but I know some people like to. So if I operated my own brew pub and a customer asked to mix two together, I probably wouldn't care all that much. But my personal preference is to enjoy each beer, individually, as created by the brewer. But I think that's my stance as a customer, not a brewer. As a brewer, I guess I wouldn't care about how the customer enjoyed my work as long as they did.

 

[MrHadack]

I ran a restaurant for a short time, it was a distinct pleasure to have my chef throw out the pretentious a-holes from time to time.

Yes Princess, order the shrimp alfredo "gluten free" and tell me you're lactose intolerant. I dare you, I double dare you!

I agree to a point. I mean, if the customer starts recreating the dish with all their requests, I'd be fairly irked as well. "I'll have the steak, but instead of the balsamic mushroom reduction, please use tomato sauce. And instead of the rice I'll have squash..."

But, from the opposite perspective:

My wife and I were on vacation and we went to dinner at a really high-end gourmet restaurant. We scanned the menu and saw something called "Chef's Challenge." The description said all you had to do was tell your waiter that you wanted either fish, chicken, or beef, any food allergies, and then the chef would design something completely spontaneous off the top of his head. He would never do the same dish twice, so if you had a party of 4 at your table who all ordered the Chef's Challenge with fish, you'd all get something completely different. Seemed fun. I got the fish and my wife asked for chicken, noting that she does not like seafood in any form and to please make sure her dish didn't contain any.

About 15 minutes later the waiter comes back and says that the chef would like to add SOME seafood to the chicken dish because he thinks it would really highlight some of the ingredients he is using. I'll note this was in Hawaii, so I can see how most dishes would skew toward the seafood end of things. But my wife says "no, thank you, I really don't like the taste of seafood at all." The waiter leaves and then returns almost immediately. He asks if she is allergic and she says no, she just doesn't care for it. He goes back to the kitchen. About 30 minutes later the food arrives, and the waiter says, "The chef asked me to tell you that he made the executive decision to add fish to your entree because he really thought it would be incomplete without it." Naturally, my wife was upset. The waiter told her if she didn't like it, the meal would be free. She tried it, and of course, she wasn't really all that keen on it. (Mine was spectacular, just as a side note.)

 

[GrogNerd]

it might not be the brewpub's choice in the matter, might be the law says they can't

if the place doesn't have a license to serve "mixed drinks" they wouldn't be allowed to mix drinks

 

[Black Island Brewer]

it might not be the brewpub's choice in the matter, might be the law says they can't

if the place doesn't have a license to serve "mixed drinks" they wouldn't be allowed to mix drinks

And THIS should be the only reason to not satisfy such a simple request. If it is just ego, then yes, it is the businesses right to deny the request, and hopefully go out of business for being asshats.

 

[Homercidal]

It just sounds *****ey for a brewery to tell someone they can't experience unique beer flavors by mixing them. I mean, isn't craft beer a celebration of the diversity of beer?

It just strikes me as pretentious.

 

[broadbill]

But, from the opposite perspective:

My wife and I were on vacation and we went to dinner at a really high-end gourmet restaurant. We scanned the menu and saw something called "Chef's Challenge." The description said all you had to do was tell your waiter that you wanted either fish, chicken, or beef, any food allergies, and then the chef would design something completely spontaneous off the top of his head. He would never do the same dish twice, so if you had a party of 4 at your table who all ordered the Chef's Challenge with fish, you'd all get something completely different. Seemed fun. I got the fish and my wife asked for chicken, noting that she does not like seafood in any form and to please make sure her dish didn't contain any.

About 15 minutes later the waiter comes back and says that the chef would like to add SOME seafood to the chicken dish because he thinks it would really highlight some of the ingredients he is using. I'll note this was in Hawaii, so I can see how most dishes would skew toward the seafood end of things. But my wife says "no, thank you, I really don't like the taste of seafood at all." The waiter leaves and then returns almost immediately. He asks if she is allergic and she says no, she just doesn't care for it. He goes back to the kitchen. About 30 minutes later the food arrives, and the waiter says, "The chef asked me to tell you that he made the executive decision to add fish to your entree because he really thought it would be incomplete without it." Naturally, my wife was upset. The waiter told her if she didn't like it, the meal would be free. She tried it, and of course, she wasn't really all that keen on it. (Mine was spectacular, just as a side note.)

...and I would say from the opposite, opposite perspective that if had a strong aversion to certain foods, the Chef's challenge isn't for you. The implied agreement there is that the Chef knows what he is doing and you benefit by getting a unique dish. As such, the Chef is granted the latitude to do what he wants. In a way, your wife welshed on the deal by putting extra constraints on what he could do, even though he asked.

My guess is the only reason he asked in the first place is because some people are allergic to fish, and he didn't want to hurt someone. It if were mushrooms, or garlic, or prunes you would have gotten it and that would have been that, whether you liked it or not.

 

[BigAndo]

For the small number of customers who ask for a mixed beer, I can't see a problem with giving them what they want!


Sent from my iPod touch using Home Brew

 

[MrHadack]

The implied agreement there is that the Chef knows what he is doing and you benefit by getting a unique dish. As such, the Chef is granted the latitude to do what he wants. In a way, your wife welshed on the deal by putting extra constraints on what he could do, even though he asked.

Incorrect. I would agree with you if my wife's complaint was that the chef used parsnips and she doesn't like parsnips. But the menu clearly said "Choose Chicken, Fish, or Beef." She chose chicken. He substituted with fish. That's like hiring a contractor to build a house and saying, "I'd like a colonial style or a cape. Anything except a ranch because I don't care for ranches. Other than that, do what you think is best." And then the contractor builds a ranch anyway. That's not a small detail-- it's the main point.

Secondly, they asked if she minded. She said she did, and wanted no seafood. That's why she ordered chicken. And then they did fish anyway. Why give the customer that choice? Seems like he was the one who "welched" on the deal. He also said no two dishes would be the same. So what you're telling me is the chef couldn't come up with another CHICKEN dish that didn't include seafood? Pretty lame, and not much of a chef if he couldn't.

Regardless, the point of the story is that there are certain artisans (brewers and chefs for example) who will be proud of their work to the point of being stubborn about it. No mixing beers... You'll eat what I serve you.... etc. I think that degree of stubbornness is self-destructive and will cause you to lose customers rather than earn them. Case in point: that restaurant is now closed, and Trip Advisor has plenty of reviews where customers complained about the chef only doing what he wanted instead of what was ordered.

 

[BigAndo]

I would have sent it back uneaten and requested a replacement.


Sent from my iPod touch using Home Brew

 

[NickTheGreat]

I can't stand mixing beers, but if you had wanted to order a Stout with a shot of ketchup in it, I'd sell it to you.

 

[paperairplane]

If my name is above the door and I make the beer, I'm gonna serve it my way.

I'm sure many have ideas about what temp it should be served, how carbed, what kind of glass, etc etc etc.

I used to be a chef and always wanted my own place - I would set the menu for the night and that's it. No substitutions, no requests. You want to eat my food, you get what I'm making, the way I want it made. Part of it being that you need to trust me to do my job - I want you to have the experience I want you to have, not necessarily what you want.

Or could be the guy's a jerk - I'm kind of like that sometimes.

 

[highgravitybacon]

My Lotus doesn't have heated seats, and they won't even offer it at the dealership!

First world problems. The horror.

 

[mattd2]

Spot on!

I respect the hell out of a restaurant that tells people "No, you can't have A-1 sauce, piss off and go to Longhorn's if that's the experience you're after!"

Sorry to pick your repsonse apart but I wanted to address everything individually (and I don't care if you care )
I think it is perfectly fair that if a resturant doesn't think steak sauce or whatever belongs on their food not to stock it, but a polite response of we do not have/use/keep "whatever" would be a better approach to staying in busisness

The customer is always right? The customer is almost always an idiot! If they knew everything, they'd be sitting at home drinking their own homebrews.

Only if they are a hermit

I ran a restaurant for a short time, it was a distinct pleasure to have my chef throw out the pretentious a-holes from time to time.

Yes Princess, order the shrimp alfredo "gluten free" and tell me you're lactose intolerant. I dare you, I double dare you!

No this is back to the some people are an idiot theme, and some people are - but an explaination that alfrado is a cream/cheese sauce and therefore is dairy and has lactose in it and the pasta is made from wheat and can not be made glutan free so you will have to order something else... But I can see the frustration because that probably came after she asked for the carbonara to be vegetarian and lactose/gluten free

 

[Rhumbline]

Sorry to pick your repsonse apart but I wanted to address everything individually (and I don't care if you care )
I think it is perfectly fair that if a resturant doesn't think steak sauce or whatever belongs on their food not to stock it, but a polite response of we do not have/use/keep "whatever" would be a better approach to staying in busisness

Only if they are a hermit

No this is back to the some people are an idiot theme, and some people are - but an explaination that alfrado is a cream/cheese sauce and therefore is dairy and has lactose in it and the pasta is made from wheat and can not be made glutan free so you will have to order something else... But I can see the frustration because that probably came after she asked for the carbonara to be vegetarian and lactose/gluten free

I can respect your points. It just gets frustrating after the thousandth time. My responses were reflecting the 1,000th person, not the first.

You'll never know what an @ss the average person can be until you work in some kind of service sector job.

 

[Weezy]

don't like it, take your money elsewhere. If that business closes down, you were right. If it thrives, you were wrong. The free market system at work.

 

[strangegreenman]

Spot on!

I respect the hell out of a restaurant that tells people "No, you can't have A-1 sauce, piss off and go to Longhorn's if that's the experience you're after!"

The customer is always right? The customer is almost always an idiot! If they knew everything, they'd be sitting at home drinking their own homebrews.

I ran a restaurant for a short time, it was a distinct pleasure to have my chef throw out the pretentious a-holes from time to time.

Yes Princess, order the shrimp alfredo "gluten free" and tell me you're lactose intolerant. I dare you, I double dare you!

I don't totally agree, but boy was this a good laugh. It is unreasonable to make a cook walk on his hands to accommodate a medical dietary restriction (or worse, a diet fad) where it is simply impossible to do so. I suppose she also was allergic to shellfish? :cross:

That said, I don't think that ordering a black and tan is unreasonable, especially with an argument like: "Humor me, please. I want my black and tan and I am not going to badmouth your business if it isn't perfect." A little bit of patience in the world goes a long way toward building a reputation as a good business and making good will.

 

[mattd2]

I can respect your points. It just gets frustrating after the thousandth time. My responses were reflecting the 1,000th person, not the first.

You'll never know what an @ss the average person can be until you work in some kind of service sector job.

Yeah my first repsonse was "that's being a bit of a dick" but then I thought about it a bit more when replying and realised it's probably not the first time having to say the exact response (and possibly not the first time to the same person)!
Personally I think both the place and the OP got it wrong:
The pub) Should have just allowed him to do whatever he wants with the beer while suggesting that they don't generally mix beers - if the beers didn't blend well he had been warned
OP) Should have just accepted the servers comments and mixed his own in a spare glass - if they kicked him out for it that would of been reason to complain.

I would probably taken a seat at the bar and asked for a pint of each, drunk half of each and then mixed it right in front of their faces, taken a sip and (hopefully) exclaimed how good it tasted as a black and tan

One question - does a B&T have to be seperated because I have seen somewhere on the internet breweries producing bottled/canned B&Ts?

 

[mattd2]

...That said, I don't think that ordering a black and tan is unreasonable, especially with an argument like: "Humor me, please. I want my black and tan and I am not going to badmouth your business if it isn't perfect." A little bit of patience in the world goes a long way toward building a reputation as a good business and making good will.

really the server could have replied that they have never mixed their beers and don't think they would taste good like that - leaving the OP forewarned that he is trying it at his own perail

 

[Rhumbline]

A proper Black and Tan is layered. Personally, I think it's more for show than anything else, on an equal footing with flamed drinks.

Also, I've been led to understand that it's not advisable to order one in Ireland.

 

[brewerelated]

As mentioned in an early post, beer is often mixed to make Gueuze. It is also often mixed in the making of barrel aged beers, especially when it is beer aged in bourbon barrels or wine barrels.

Older beers are often mixed with younger beers in order to create a flavor profile that might not be possible without mixing it. Some brewers would say blending is the most important part of making barrel aged beers.

I don't mix beers, but when I start making barrel age beers blending is one of the things that I plan on practicing extensively.