A "session maibock" ??!!

[blakelyc]

I have been reading a lot about Maibocks lately, and it has made me wonder if anyone has ever done a low-gravity version. A recipe on another thread had 40%/40%/20% pils/Vienna/Munich to a 1.065+ gravity. Can I turn that down to 1.045 territory and still get a similar malt profile? I know there will be less body.

Other than that, I'd like to get to the top of the ibu range and think about some American hops.

Has anyone tried such a thing and would be willing to share a recipe or some ideas?

-b

 

[CadillacAndy]

You're not too far off from an Oktoberfest or maybe a Vienna lager with what you're describing. One of my Oktoberfest recipes (6 gallon batch) is 5lbs pils (42%), 4lbs Munich I (33%) and 3lbs Vienna (25%). You could up your mash temp to like 156F to get less attenuation or you could use some dextrine/carapils malt.

All of these beers are typically showcases for their malt profiles with enough bitterness to balance out the sweetness and to allow that malt to really shine.

 

[blakelyc]

I was running some numbers and I am thinking 4lbs pils, 4lbs Vienna, 2 lbs Munich. That comes in just under 1.050. Color-wise, maybe a bit light for a Vienna lager, but I get your point that a lower-gravity maibock ends up looking like a Vienna lager.

I grew to love palisade hops late in the year... Maybe I'll do something crazy and roll with that

 

[dfhar]

Resurrecting old thread here, but I've been thinking about brewing something along the same lines. I think a lower gravity maibock would be a lot lighter in color than a vienna lager. Another thing that sets maibock apart in my mind from Marzen beers is that you often find a bit more floral hop aroma in maibocks, as well as a bit more sweetness.

Targeting an OG of 1.050, I think a good starting place would be 50% pils, 40% vienna or light munich (or a mix of the two), 5% to 7% light german crystal malt like carahell or caravienne, and 2-3% acid malt for pH adjustment. I'd probably mash around 153 or 154 for a single infusion, or use a Hochkurz mash. Target 20 to 25 IBUs, and a enough of a dose of something floral like Hersbrucker at 5 or 10 minutes to really give it a springtime aroma. WLP833, WLP835, or WY2206 would be my yeast choices for a beer like this.

 

[motobrewer]

you mean, like a Munich Helles?

 

[motobrewer]

Here's Kai's helles recipe which I brewed last fall:

81% Weyermann Floor Malted Bohemian Pilsner
13% Briess Vienna
3% Weyermann Carafoam
3% Weyermann Acidulated

1.048 OG. WY2206.

I did a short protein rest at 122F then infused to 153F. I found it lacking in body. It finished lower than expected (1.012 - the fast ferment test finished at 1.010!) so I'm changing the sacc rest to 156 when I brew this again next week.


http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Edel_Hell

 

[dfhar]

you mean, like a Munich Helles?

In my mind, a Maibock is a bit different than a higher gravity Helles. Maibocks are typically more bitter, can have more late hop aroma, more sweetness, and a bit more toastyness from a higher percentage of Munich malt. I agree that Marzen is probably the closest classic style to a scaled-down Maibock, but I generally think of Marzen as having less hop aroma and little if any caramel malt character. A little bit of both of those are not out of place in a Maibock.

 

[motobrewer]

meh, I would tend to disagree but I don't really care enough about style guidelines.

Maibocks are typically more bitter, can have more late hop aroma, more sweetness...

Maibocks are both more bitter and have more sweetness...?

Can be thought of as either a pale version of a traditional bock, or a Munich helles brewed to bock strength

http://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style05.php

 

[dfhar]

Yes, more bitterness as in higher IBUs and more sweetness as in higher FG.

From Kai's Maibock page (http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Maibock):

Contrary to popular belief, a Maibock is not a Helles brewed to Bock strength (by German law Bock means an original extract of more than 16 Plato) but more a modern Oktoberfest beer brewed to Bock strength, since it is not brewed from 100% Pilsner malt like a classic Helles is.

I have a beer I'd like to brew in mind which is in between a Helles and a Marzen, but with a touch of light caramel sweetness and more floral hop aroma than is found in either of those styles; see the recipe I've posted above. If calling it a session maibock for lack of a better term is upsetting, we can call it something else. I'm not interested in arguing about BJCP style guidelines either, but I am interested in talking about recipes.

 

[biertourist]

Sorry, I'm with everyone else on this one. A session maibock is a helles.

Boil the crap out of the first runnings from a Helles recipe and add 5 extra hop cones at flame out and call it a "Session Maibock" if you want, but it's still a Helles.

Even it's alternative name "Helles Bock" kind of implies this. I know the literal word-for-word translation is just "Light" "Bock beer" but "Bock" also has a history of being used as a modifier to denote strong; I can't remember the beer author who talked about "bockifying" this and that beer style. From this perspective, Maibock's other name, "Helles Bock" can reasonably mean just "stronger Helles" in which case a "Session Helles Bock" would most certainly just mean Helles.

[Edit] I stand corrected; GREAT reference, dfhar! -From the way the language and bock modifier is normally used, I can certainly see why everyone jumps to the conclusion. -Seems to be a very similar issue to Double IPA just being "an IPA where you double all the ingredients except for water" -a great story and at a distance very roughly accurate-ish, but not really how you formulate a Double IPA recipe (not a good one anyway).

It would seem that a session Maibock is just essentially an Oktoberfest.

Dfar, I'm within you on a more modern Oktoberfest, but a traditional Marzen recipe is already starting darker than most Maibocks and starting from a Marzen grist and ramping it up to bock strength would make it even darker and, IMO, wouldn't resemble most real Maibock examples. (Having said that I like your proposed grist as long as its Vienna malt's 3.5 SRM and not Light Munich's 9-11 SRM at those percentages.)

Sounds like it's occupying the small middle ground between Helles and Vienna with a focus on floral hop flavor

Adam

 

[motobrewer]

you're gonna take ramblings of ONE crazy-ass german as canon??

the funny thing about Kai's maibock recipe is that it's very close to his helles recipe.....except brewed to bock strength

your recipe looks good! let me know how it turns out

 

[dfhar]

you're gonna take ramblings of ONE crazy-ass german as canon??

the funny thing about Kai's maibock recipe is that it's very close to his helles recipe.....except brewed to bock strength

When it's Kai Troester, yes

His helles is 15% vienna, vs 20% dark or 40% light munich in his maibock. The maibock also has 5% crystal, whereas the helles has none. Finally, his Maibock calls for hop additions at 10 and 30 minutes vs. 15 and 40 for the helles, and the hopping rate for those additions is 3 times higher than for the helles! Even ignoring OG, I'd say they're very different beers. What's exciting, though, is that there isn't really a lower gravity version of something like his Maibock out there, so it's worth brewing one!

 

[motobrewer]

when are you brewing it?

 

[dfhar]

My fermenter is tied up with a Nelson Sauvin pilsner right now that I brewed this past friday. I'll probably give it a shot in about 2 weeks.

 

[motobrewer]

nice. i'm brewing kai's helles on the 3rd.