No carbonation in my keg

[HumboldtBrewer]

So my keg has been carbing under 13 psi for over 2 weeks and my beer is still FLAT! What is the issue? I bought this keg from Keggle Brewing.com and it came slightly pressurized, so it can't be the keg. I've checked the regulator and co2 tank for leaks and there are none. I have no idea what the issue is. Should I transfer my beer to another keg and see what happens?




know what todo

 

[Yooper]

So my keg has been carbing under 13 psi for over 2 weeks and my beer is still FLAT! What is the issue? I bought this keg from Keggle Brewing.com and it came slightly pressurized, so it can't be the keg. I've checked the regulator and co2 tank for leaks and there are none. I have no idea what the issue is. Should I transfer my beer to another keg and see what happens?




know what todo

What's the temperature of the beer, and are you dispensing it through a tap and beer line to check the carbonation?

 

[HumboldtBrewer]

The temp is at 42 degrees and I'm dispensing it through a picnic tap.

 

[cluckk]

Is it possible your regulator is reading wrong?

 

[HumboldtBrewer]

It's a brand new regulator and connections

 

[Yooper]

Is it blasting out of the picnic tap? Are you fully opening the tap the whole way, so that it's completely open and not just cracked?

And last, when you pull the pressure relief valve on the keg does gas come out, and then can you hear the c02 refilling it?

 

[HumboldtBrewer]

Its not blasting out ofthe picnic tap when I set it to 8 psi, and I do open it all the way when I pour a sample. Also, I do hear the co2 refilling when I pull the relief valve. Maybe I will try opening the lid, add some more keg lube, seal it and blast it with 30 psi.

 

[raouliii]

If you had a leak and carbonated for two weeks, your CO2 bottle would likely be empty already.

Is this your first time kegging or is this an abnormal condition over many normal kegs?

Have you left the CO2 valve on the tank open and attached to the keg the entire time?

Is this a high original gravity beer?

Why are you setting it to 8 psi for sampling?

 

[cluckk]

I know you are being showered with questions, but when you say it is "flat," I assume you mean it has zero carbonation. Is this what you mean, or do you mean it has very low carbonation? This is important because what would keep it from going into suspension "at all" can be very different from what might keep it from going into suspension "enough."

 

[HumboldtBrewer]

This is my first time kegging.
Yes, I've left the keg on co2 the whole time.
It is a 1.070 IPA.
I set it to 8 psi because otherwise it just comes blasting out of there.
Lastly, the beer is completely flat, no bubbles whatsoever.

 

[cluckk]

I can't think of any reason why at 8psi for two weeks at the temp you mention it would have no co2 in suspension. My chart shows it should be at least 2.0 atmospheres. I've read that nitrogen doesn't go into suspension and that is why it is used to push wines, but can't imagine any reason why CO2 wouldn't. Sorry.

I guess you could try the old "crank and shake," just to diagnose. Raise it to around 30 psi and shake the keg a bit. Let it sit 24 hours at that pressure and then check the carbonation--it should be very carbed if not overcarbed--and you will have to bleed some off and let it equalize. I've never done the crank and shake so may be telling you a bit wrong. I think Yooper does it, so perhaps she can touch on the fine points. I keep my kegerater at 50 degrees or so and set the pressure to 12 psi. I hook up and walk away for a week and the carbonation is always where I like it.

 

[Bobby_M]

Let's make sure it's really absolutely flat. Dispense some into an empty soda or water bottle filled only like 1/3rd of the way. Seal the cap and shake the crap out of it. Now open the lid and note if a lot of CO2 comes out of solution.

Another way to test your keg for how much CO2 you have dissolved is to attach a gas quick disconnect directly to a pressure gauge. Vent the keg and attach this pressure gauge and wait an hour. If it reads anything higher than zero, it's not flat.

Describe the hose from the keg to your picnic faucet. Inside diameter, length. This is important because when you say it comes blasting out of there at 14 psi, it means you have a really short line, possibly with too large of a bore.

 

[Yooper]

Describe the hose from the keg to your picnic faucet. Inside diameter, length. This is important because when you say it comes blasting out of there at 14 psi, it means you have a really short line, possibly with too large of a bore.

That's what occurred to me to. If it's "blasting" out, the co2 is in there but being forced out of suspension. I then assume that the beer line is too short (maybe even less than 5 feet) and that the beer is carbed up but the foaming makes it appear flat.

To fix, don't turn the pressure up and down, just keep it at 13 psi. Replace the beerlines with 12 foot long 3/16" beverage tubing. I bet it would fix it.

To be "flat" while it's blasting out would defy the laws of physics (as that shows that co2 is indeed going in there).

 

[HumboldtBrewer]

Thanks guys, my beer line is 5' and 5/16.

 

[day_trippr]

5/16" inside diameter? That's gas line. You need 3/16" inside diameter for beer line, unless you want to wind around 30 feet of that larger line around your keg...

Cheers!

 

[hendenburg2]

I've read that nitrogen doesn't go into suspension and that is why it is used to push wines, but can't imagine any reason why CO2 wouldn't. Sorry.

quick aside from the main topic: nitrogen is used in wine because when CO2 dissolves in water, it becomes H2CO3 (carbonic acid). nitrogen, however, is inert at room temperature

 

[spaceyaquarius]

I had the exact same problem last month. The local brew store sold me a picnic tap beer line that was 4.75 feet long, inner diameter 1/4 inch. Ridiculous. That's not the only thing they screwed me over on, but it was enough to ruin my 1st 3 kegging trials.

The beer looked flat in the glass, and then would suddenly become overcarbed and taste like acid and then would have to be poured out towards the end. Now I have 10 foot long 3/16" inner diameter lines.

 

[HumboldtBrewer]

Ok so my beer line is fine. I resealed the lid with keg lube, set to 30 psi, and now the beer is carbing.

 

[raouliii]

Don't leave it at 30psi for more than a day or you risk overcarbing.

 

[sablesurfer]

Jumping on this thread. Got a beer on tap, big foamy head about 3 fingers. Completely flat in the glass. This is my first beer through an actual beer tap. Same CO2 system on other kegs with picnic tap carb up fine.

Been on CO2 for over a week at 15psi. Just bumped it up to 20 last night, this afternoon it is much more foamy out of tap, but still nothing in the glass. This is an etched and older pint glass, so should have lots of places for CO2 to precipitate. (not precipitate, the other word)

Was there a solution to this?

 

[JuanMoore]

Jumping on this thread. Got a beer on tap, big foamy head about 3 fingers. Completely flat in the glass. This is my first beer through an actual beer tap. Same CO2 system on other kegs with picnic tap carb up fine.

Been on CO2 for over a week at 15psi. Just bumped it up to 20 last night, this afternoon it is much more foamy out of tap, but still nothing in the glass. This is an etched and older pint glass, so should have lots of places for CO2 to precipitate. (not precipitate, the other word)

Was there a solution to this?

Foam is carbonation coming out of the beer. If you have lots of foaming, that means you've lost lots of carbonation, which is why it tastes flat after the foam settles. Turning the pressure up is just going to make the pour worse, and the beer in the glass will have even less carbonation.

What's the length and ID of your beer line? Where is the faucet mounted? Do you have some way to keep the faucet shank cold? Is the first pour of a drinking session worse than subsequent pours?

 

[sablesurfer]

I wouldn't say three fingers of foam is "carbonation coming out of the beer", that is a pretty normal tap pour. Try pouring a Boulevard.

The length is about 5ft max and no idea the ID because this was salvaged off a jockybox I managed to inherit. The faucet is stainless with shank mounted about three feet from keg. There is no refrigeration on my beer at all, I serve at basement temp. So from keg to tap is no change in temp. Haven't drunk enough in a row to see if a third glass is any better.

 

[Yooper]

I wouldn't say three fingers of foam is "carbonation coming out of the beer", that is a pretty normal tap pour. Try pouring a Boulevard.

The length is about 5ft max and no idea the ID because this was salvaged off a jockybox I managed to inherit. The faucet is stainless with shank mounted about three feet from keg. There is no refrigeration on my beer at all, I serve at basement temp. So from keg to tap is no change in temp. Haven't drunk enough in a row to see if a third glass is any better.

Well, it's not a "normal tap pour". A big foamy head but with no carbonation in the beer means that the co2 is being knocked out of suspension. Also, depending on the kegerator temp, it is probably overcarbed. My system is at 12 psi at 40 degrees. If I went to 15 psi, it'd be overcarbed by quite a bit.

The lines are too short, but it's important to get 3/16" line. If it's 3/16" line, you're about 1/2 way to what you need for a decent pour. If it's 1/4" line, you need about 20-30 feet of line- that's why it's important to know what you've got!

 

[JuanMoore]

I wouldn't say three fingers of foam is "carbonation coming out of the beer", that is a pretty normal tap pour. Try pouring a Boulevard.

Any foam is carbonation leaving the beer. That's not to say that a little head is a bad thing, but the more foam or the thicker the head, the more carbonation is being lost during the pour.

The length is about 5ft max and no idea the ID because this was salvaged off a jockybox I managed to inherit. The faucet is stainless with shank mounted about three feet from keg. There is no refrigeration on my beer at all, I serve at basement temp. So from keg to tap is no change in temp. Haven't drunk enough in a row to see if a third glass is any better.

What's the basement temp? If it's ~68°, 15 psi would only be 1.7 vol of carbonation, which is pretty flat even before losing some to foam. Once it equalizes at 20 psi, that's still only 2.0 vol. The warmer or more highly carbed the beer is, the slower/gentler the pour needs to be to prevent the CO2 from coming out of solution. At basement temps, even with relatively low carbonation levels you'd need to slow the flow to a trickle to be able to get a decent pour, which would require extremely long lines. Even at 40°, most people find they need about 10' of 3/16" line for common carb levels (2.4-2.7 vol). If you want your beer carbed to the same level as most commercial beers, you're going to need to find a way to store it colder.

Also, depending on the kegerator temp, it is probably overcarbed.

He's serving at "basement temp", so it's likely undercarbed by most peoples standards.

 

[Yooper]

He's serving at "basement temp", so it's likely undercarbed by most peoples standards.

Oh, I missed that! Then you are correct- it's undercarbed but foaming due to temperature (warm beer foams like a son of a gun), and short lines.

Sorry about that!

Serving beer at basement temps is difficult, due to the foaming at warm temperatures as c02 comes more readily out of suspension at warmer temperatures.

A force carb chart would be helpful here, so you could target the correct psi for your temperature. http://www.kegerators.com/carbonation-table.php

Then, the lines need to be much longer to avoid so much foaming. I served soda in my basement (55 degrees) at 30 psi, and needed 30' of 3/16" for a nice pour.

 

[sablesurfer]

WOW....ok new stuff about the length of the lines. Guess I need to study up. I am used to my picnic line on the first keg and I have learned that I need to go wide open and with the curve of the glass to get a decent pour. That line is only about 3ft? So interesting stuff here and it still seems confusing....hmm.