Porter help: Founder's

[bransona]

Hey, guys. I'm finally out of dark homebrew and it is NOT ok. Guess it's time to brew up another porter.

I'm hoping to start developing a porter as our first "house recipe." Porters are the bomb, so why not? And founder's makes the best porter that has ever portered. So, I checked their recipe and made one based off of it and the ingredients I have on hand.

Robust porter (a la founder's)

3# 2-row pale
.5# pale chocolate
.25# Munich 60
.125# C120
.125# C20
.0625# black malt

Mash high, around 155
Bitter with nugget to 45 ibu
Hopstand with goldings and saaz
Ferment 64* with a batch of s-33 I have that fermented very clean with huge attenuation

Pic for reference to the original founder's recipe

 

[specharka]

I would use Munich I or II over Caramunich (although I do enjoy CM quite a bit). Also, why would you perform a hop stand for a porter? I think the round hop flavor is going to get lost in the roasty character. But other than that, looks like a good one! Brew on!

 

[bransona]

I would use Munich I or II over Caramunich (although I do enjoy CM quite a bit). Also, why would you perform a hop stand for a porter? I think the round hop flavor is going to get lost in the roasty character. But other than that, looks like a good one! Brew on!

Unfortunately, the caramunich is all I have that's even close :/ well, honestly man, I was just looking for more hop character than the nugget for bittering. I thought those two hops would be soft enough to provide hop character without any big citrus or pine notes (the rest of my hops are for my ipas). Then I figured a hopstand would get the most character out of them. But, I'm still fairly inexperienced and am looking for any advice I can get! What would you do to get a hoppy character on the palate with those? I do still want the malt to be forward like founder's.

 

[bransona]

I also have nugget in abundance, but I worry that using it anytime other than early bittering would give too much citrus.

 

[Terek]

I would use Munich I or II over Caramunich (although I do enjoy CM quite a bit). Also, why would you perform a hop stand for a porter? I think the round hop flavor is going to get lost in the roasty character. But other than that, looks like a good one! Brew on!

i love a hop stand for porters, i even do dry hopping quite often. Most porters really should not have a "roasty" flavor. Save that for a stout. Notice the recipe has no roasted malt. This is how i define porters from stouts (i love both and have both on deck usually) I believe stouts should be roasty, dry, and no real hop flavor. Usually higher in gravity. Where porters should be lighter, semi sweet, with more malty, chocolaty flavor with good hop aroma. Tend to be lower in gravity

 

[Terek]

Unfortunately, the caramunich is all I have that's even close :/ well, honestly man, I was just looking for more hop character than the nugget for bittering. I thought those two hops would be soft enough to provide hop character without any big citrus or pine notes (the rest of my hops are for my ipas). Then I figured a hopstand would get the most character out of them. But, I'm still fairly inexperienced and am looking for any advice I can get! What would you do to get a hoppy character on the palate with those? I do still want the malt to be forward like founder's.

goldings and saaz are great for a porter, as it is supposed to be more an english beer, and those hops would be to profile

 

[bransona]

goldings and saaz are great for a porter, as it is supposed to be more an english beer, and those hops would be to profile

Awesome! I like them both and he combination sounds great. I was, however, aiming for a slightly roasty back end with the black malt. It's more like coffee than roasted. I think that'll do well in this robust, higher gravity porter. That being said, how hard would you go on these hops? For example, in my 1.5 gallon batches (apartment sized brewing, lol) I use 1+ oz for an ipa, 2+ oz for a dipa. So maybe I could use 1/4oz each at hopstand? Then if it needs it, another 1/8oz each dry.

 

[specharka]

i love a hop stand for porters, i even do dry hopping quite often. Most porters really should not have a "roasty" flavor. Save that for a stout. Notice the recipe has no roasted malt. This is how i define porters from stouts (i love both and have both on deck usually) I believe stouts should be roasty, dry, and no real hop flavor. Usually higher in gravity. Where porters should be lighter, semi sweet, with more malty, chocolaty flavor with good hop aroma. Tend to be lower in gravity

I don't necessarily think that there's a stylistic definition that precludes use of roasty character in a porter (not roasted barley)...it is called a "stout porter" after all. I've had a fair few with some smokiness to them that were just insatiable.

Great avatar, btw!

 

[bransona]

+9000 for your avatar

 

[Terek]

I don't necessarily think that there's a stylistic definition that precludes use of roasty character in a porter (not roasted barley)...it is called a "stout porter" after all. I've had a fair few with some smokiness to them that were just insatiable.

Great avatar, btw!

there is a huge debate over the diff. between a stout and a porter. In all reality, there is no "real" difference. These are the things i use to distinguish the two when im making one or the other. Personal preference. I got most of the diff. from beersmiths style guide though. (a great guide to style deffenitions. what i use when building new recipes)

 

[Terek]

So maybe I could use 1/4oz each at hopstand? Then if it needs it, another 1/8oz each dry.

im not used to such small batch size, so my opinion may not be the best. What you describe here is what i would do until you figure out what you "like"
I have been wanting to get into 1 gal batches, just so i can exp. with diff malt flavors

 

[bransona]

im not used to such small batch size, so my opinion may not be the best. What you describe here is what i would do until you figure out what you "like"
I have been wanting to get into 1 gal batches, just so i can exp. with diff malt flavors

1.5 gallons into the fermenter always gives me nearly 1.25 in bottles, so 14 bottles or so. It's a good balance of having enough of good ones and not too much of less than perfect brews. And I get great results with biab in a 9qt kettle that is also my Mash tun. Up to 90% efficiency to boot.

 

[bransona]

I brewed it today. Exact recipe as above, and ended up with 1/4oz nugget to bitter and 1/4oz of each of the others at hopstand. Mashed a little higher than intended and came out over volume (silly mistakes happen). Ended up with 1.062 instead of 1.07, but that's still enough to give me a plenty robust porter, and this way I get more beer!

 

[ddrrseio]

hope this works out!

pale chocolate hasn't been something i've loved, particularly in a recipe where the chocolate malt is the main player, but perhaps you've hit on a great formulation.

 

[bransona]

hope this works out!

pale chocolate hasn't been something i've loved, particularly in a recipe where the chocolate malt is the main player, but perhaps you've hit on a great formulation.

Thanks! I actually rather like the pale chocolate, at least in comparison to dark chocolate malt. I'm hoping the combination of pale chocolate and black malts will give me that roasted coffee/chocolate flavor that the original founder's one has. I'm also curious if it will come out as smooth as theirs. Honestly I assumed it was brewed with oats or wheat before I saw this email.

 

[ChunnyNinja]

Thanks! I actually rather like the pale chocolate, at least in comparison to dark chocolate malt. I'm hoping the combination of pale chocolate and black malts will give me that roasted coffee/chocolate flavor that the original founder's one has. I'm also curious if it will come out as smooth as theirs. Honestly I assumed it was brewed with oats or wheat before I saw this email.

Not a big porter fan, but i looove Founders porter
How did your beer compare to the original?