Ballast Point - Victory at Sea. This is pure beer nirvana.

[pfgonzo]

Seriously. Do yourself a favor and go try one (if you can). Ballast Point is a brewery in San Diego, CA that started as, and still operates as a HB shop. Not sure if their people ever post here or what their distribution is like, but I'm in the SF Bay area, and it's all over up here, so hopefully you can find some too. I realize they've been brewing this for a couple of years, so if you've had it and this is yesterday's news, you can move on. I've just discovered it, and I WILL let the world know!

Back story: I randomly had a pint of their IPA (called Sculpin) at a local brew pub that was out of my favorite "usual" order. Gave it a try, and wow, it was one of the better IPAs I'd tasted. That was a few months ago.

This weekend, I was considering making a porter, and have always been curious about vanilla porters. I've never tried one, and went to my local Whole Foods looking for one to sample before I started contemplating recipes. The only one I could find at my store was Victory at Sea, a coffee vanilla (imperial) porter by Ballast Point. Knowing how much I liked their IPA, I was excited to try this. Brought it home and poured it. Very dark. Very thick, with a dark brown head. I gave it to my wife to sample first (I like watching her face pucker at roasty beers).

To my astonishment, her eyes widened and she said "Wow, that's really good. I mean REALLY good."

I tried it myself and saw GOD. Yes. When that liquid touched my tongue, the clouds parted, and my kitchen was bathed in holy light. The meld of flavors between the roasted grains, coffee, vanilla, bitterness, etc... is all done to PERFECTION. It is frighteningly drinkable for clocking in at around 10%, and is definitely a winter warmer type beer, but if I can find this year round, I will drink it year round and to be damned with my waistline!

I went back to Whole Foods the next day and bought every bottle they had. There were only 4 left, but at $9 for a 22oz bottle, they are definitely not cheap, but also quite definitely worth every penny. I've already given away two of those bottles, and shared one with a friend at a dinner party last night. I can't help it. I must share this with the world. Forget Coke; if I could give the world a Victory at Sea, there would be no further conflict. There would only be contented nap time.

This is my holy grail. My efforts from now on are going to be to try to replicate/clone this bad boy.

 

[meltroha]

We get all their beers in Ohio, I think they have a fairly wide distribution. Sculpin is fantastic, I have been meaning to try Victory At Sea, I will do so on your recommendation.

 

[MaltnHops]

I was at the brewery a few weeks ago and had it (along with about 6 different beers) on tap. Simply amazing!!!

 

[Juno_Malone]

I don't know if it's a pricing mistake, but my LHBS is selling these for $2.50 per 12oz...I tried one for the first time tonight. I'll probably be going back this week to buy the rest of their stock.

 

[Invertalon]

Love VaS! I snag 12oz bottles here and there. Have a 1.5yr old one I'm curious how it is vs. fresh. Great beer.

 

[FatDragon]

Funny how tastes differ. I had a pour of Victory at Sea at a beer bar last summer and found it to be a syrupy mess of malt and charred black coffee. I like my coffee strong, dark, and black, and I enjoy a big gnarly imperial stout or porter, but to me Victory at Sea was a gross, imbalanced coffee-and-roast bomb that I only finished out of politeness to my new brother-in-law who treated me to the $8 pour. It gets plenty of rave reviews so clearly it has its market, but apparently I'm not part of it.

 

[ChelisHubby]

I agree with Dragon it was not what I want, there was too much roast to suit me. I like porters but I will pass on that one.

 

[mattcuso]

BP was bought out by constellation. I no longer support them. It's too bad cuz they have a great lineup

 

[oldstyle69]

its weird how this old threads pop back up. were people looking for this beer and wanted to post about it? this started 3 years ago.

at any rate, yes BP sold its soul and lot of people are pissed or hate them for it. is the beer good, yes, its pretty on point. even now.

 

[FatDragon]

its weird how this old threads pop back up. were people looking for this beer and wanted to post about it? this started 3 years ago.

at any rate, yes BP sold its soul and lot of people are pissed or hate them for it. is the beer good, yes, its pretty on point. even now.

Funny, I didn't notice that the thread was so old until you pointed it out. Sometimes it's obvious but this one didn't stand out as much.

As for Ballast Point selling, yes sir, that's a one followed by NINE zeros. Hard to really fault them for taking that payday.

 

[mattcuso]

I would have done the same.

 

[Scturo]

I don't consider a brewery "selling out" as a bad thing, as long as the taste and quality stays the same. It may also result in lower prices, and farther distribution. It does get a little crazy with some beers like sculpin. Can you imagine Pineapple Headdy Topper, or Habanero Pliny.

 

[FatDragon]

I don't consider a brewery "selling out" as a bad thing, as long as the taste and quality stays the same. It may also result in lower prices, and farther distribution. It does get a little crazy with some beers like sculpin. Can you imagine Pineapple Headdy Topper, or Habanero Pliny.

Grapefruit Sculpin far predates the sellout, though.

 

[arnobg]

Add me to the list for not liking Victory at Sea. Call me crazy but I'm not really impressed with BP beers that I've tried besides Grapefruit Sculpin. Everything tastes "artificial" to me. Watermelon Dorado was possibly one of the worst craft beers I've ever tried. Grapefruit Sculpin is solid though...

 

[greyghost]

I agree with Dragon it was not what I want, there was too much roast to suit me. I like porters but I will pass on that one.

i agree.

 

[oldstyle69]

Add me to the list for not liking Victory at Sea. Call me crazy but I'm not really impressed with BP beers that I've tried besides Grapefruit Sculpin. Everything tastes "artificial" to me. Watermelon Dorado was possibly one of the worst craft beers I've ever tried. Grapefruit Sculpin is solid though...

that would be, because its not craft beer. BP does use a lot of artifical flavors in its spirits and lots of unnecessary preservatives in its cocktail mixes.

 

[nDub]

Jolly Rodger by Drakes is the best vanilla coffee imperial stout. The end.

 

[thedon986]

that would be, because its not craft beer. BP does use a lot of artifical flavors in its spirits and lots of unnecessary preservatives in its cocktail mixes.

Why aren't they craft beer? Do you know their production has exceeded the definition of a craft brewery? Or is that your opinion?

 

[NothingRhymesWithCurtiss]

EDIT: I haven't tried Victory at Sea, I tried Calm Before the Storm. My bad.

 

[Pantherjon]

Funny...Just grabbed a sixer of this at our local Kroger grocery store..And I LIKE it!

 

[55x11]

Funny...Just grabbed a sixer of this at our local Kroger grocery store..And I LIKE it!

Victory at Sea is AMAZING. My favorite imperial vanilla stout. I brewed a pretty decent clone of it, and it's one of the best beers I brewed. Highly recommended.

 

[oldstyle69]

Why aren't they craft beer? Do you know their production has exceeded the definition of a craft brewery? Or is that your opinion?

because they were bought by budweiser. they are now lumped under that big beer name and can no longer say that they are a craft brewery.

 

[Juno_Malone]

Victory at Sea is AMAZING. My favorite imperial vanilla stout. I brewed a pretty decent clone of it, and it's one of the best beers I brewed. Highly recommended.

Care to share your recipe?

 

[55x11]

Care to share your recipe?

There are a couple of different variations of these recipe floating in beersmith and homebrewtalk.com

I had to rescale my 10G recipe back down to 5G, it would then look like this:

Recipe: Victory at Sea Clone (AG) 5G
Style: Robust Porter
TYPE: All Grain

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 5.71 gal
Post Boil Volume: 5.21 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal
Bottling Volume: 5.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.098 SG
Estimated Color: 42.1 SRM
Estimated IBU: 36.1 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 72.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 72.0 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
12.5 oz Oat Flakes (1.0 SRM) Adjunct 1 4.3 %
14 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 2 76.5 %
1 lbs 9.1 oz American Chocolate (127.0 SRM) Grain 3 8.6 %
1 lbs 9.1 oz American Crystal 90L (90.0 SRM) Grain 4 8.6 %
6.3 oz Black (Patent) Malt (500.0 SRM) Grain 5 2.1 %
0.85 oz Columbus (US) [15.40 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 6 37.5 IBUs
1.00 oz Cascade [5.50 %] - Boil 10.0 min Hop 7 5.7 IBUs
1.0 pkg San Diego Super Yeast (White Labs #WLP09 Yeast 8 -
1.15 oz Coffee (Brewed) (Primary 14.0 days) Spice 9 -
0.38 tbsp Vanilla Extract (Primary 14.0 days) Spice 10 -


Mash Schedule: Single Infusion, Full Body, Batch Sparge
Total Grain Weight: 18 lbs 4.9 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperat Step Time
Mash In Add 22.88 qt of water at 168.2 F 156.0 F 45 min

I mashed at 156F.

Instead of using Vanilla extract, I chopped up 3 vanilla beans and soaked in vodka for a week or so.

You may adjust coffee/vanilla to taste. It takes a long time to finish the keg so you may want to re-add some coffee/vanilla after a month or so (flavor diminishes quickly). I especially like it on Nitro.

 

[55x11]

that would be, because its not craft beer. BP does use a lot of artifical flavors in its spirits and lots of unnecessary preservatives in its cocktail mixes.

not sure what you mean in terms of "cocktail mixes" and "spirits" (which would not be a beer to begin with.
But anyone who doesn't like specific beers (say fruit beers) from PB - that's not because of Constellation purchase that happened very recently. The recipes and the beer lineups have not changed much since the acquisition of BP - and Constellation claims they want creative control to remain unchanged.

To me - BP, Archers, Laguinitas and others that were bought recently are still part of the "craft" beer, as far as style of brewing, ingredients, quality control etc. goes.

What I don't like is the market share consolidation by big beer, their distribution practices, etc.

But I also don't blame BP for selling out - they sold a company that gave them $50M in annual revenue for 20 times that.

 

[oldstyle69]

not sure what you mean in terms of "cocktail mixes" and "spirits" (which would not be a beer to begin with.
But anyone who doesn't like specific beers (say fruit beers) from PB - that's not because of Constellation purchase that happened very recently. The recipes and the beer lineups have not changed much since the acquisition of BP - and Constellation claims they want creative control to remain unchanged.

To me - BP, Archers, Laguinitas and others that were bought recently are still part of the "craft" beer, as far as style of brewing, ingredients, quality control etc. goes.

What I don't like is the market share consolidation by big beer, their distribution practices, etc.

But I also don't blame BP for selling out - they sold a company that gave them $50M in annual revenue for 20 times that.

yeah, you have a point on the spirits part, i was pointing out how AB has cut costs. they do get to remain creative and have some control, but they did have to reduce the cost of a lot of the things they do. the quality has change, while not drastically, it has.

i wasn't around for st archer when they were still a craft brewery, but one of the reps was telling me that they were the fastest growing craft brewery in SoCal. after looking it up i can see why they were growing so fast. because they are not a craft brewery.

in some cases its splitting hairs. it's not about the money, even some craft brewers are so huge, its hard to think of them in that sense.
The term "craft" in relation to brewing is a legal term. they can still make good beer and have creative control, but they can not call the beer they make a craft beer.

a lot of people have argued about this, but its very clear. in the end, its still beer, and a lot of it is good.

 

[55x11]

yeah, you have a point on the spirits part, i was pointing out how AB has cut costs. they do get to remain creative and have some control, but they did have to reduce the cost of a lot of the things they do. the quality has change, while not drastically, it has.

i wasn't around for st archer when they were still a craft brewery, but one of the reps was telling me that they were the fastest growing craft brewery in SoCal. after looking it up i can see why they were growing so fast. because they are not a craft brewery.

in some cases its splitting hairs. it's not about the money, even some craft brewers are so huge, its hard to think of them in that sense.
The term "craft" in relation to brewing is a legal term. they can still make good beer and have creative control, but they can not call the beer they make a craft beer.

a lot of people have argued about this, but its very clear. in the end, its still beer, and a lot of it is good.

well, the legal definition has to do with independent ownership, but that's a separate issue from the quality of beer, ingredients, etc.

I wish Laguinitas and St. Archer and Ballast Point and Goose Island were still allowed to submit their technically "non-craft" beers for various international competitions. Or even the Big Beer brands. If Corona or Budweiser win some medals because they are considered to be superior to other beers in that class, I have no problems with this.

I have not noticed much change in BP beers quality personally since Constellation purchase. Their local tasting rooms still have plenty of R&D beers and beers brewed by brewers trying out their own recipes. So the innovation component is still very much present. During the original announcement the BP stressed that recipes and their approach to brewing in general will remain the same and independent from Constellation, which will focus on distribution.

You say that they have to reduce the costs - what are you basing this on?

If Constellation was smart, I would leave the brewery operation independent and focus on expanding the distribution. The BP was growing already at a very rapid rate (something like 124 kbbl in 2014 to 290 kbbl in 2015), so whatever they were doing was working for them - I would get out of the way and let them do whatever, and focus on making sure the sales don't saturate because of distribution bottleneck.

Regardless of this off-tangent riff, my only point was - someone who doesn't like the taste of Sculpin or Victory at Sea - this has probably nothing to do with Constellation buy-out.

 

[oldstyle69]

the reducing cost comes from answering to stock holders, and its not a bad thing for those of us that buy the beer. soon after the buy out, BP started offering beer to whole foods market at a steep discount. its currently the least expensive place to get BP beer in SD. but like i said, its not a bad thing. i dont think the beer has taken much of a hit and i do love the RnD beers. kinda wish i could get a job there. haha.

 

[55x11]

the reducing cost comes from answering to stock holders, and its not a bad thing for those of us that buy the beer. soon after the buy out, BP started offering beer to whole foods market at a steep discount. its currently the least expensive place to get BP beer in SD. but like i said, its not a bad thing. i dont think the beer has taken much of a hit and i do love the RnD beers. kinda wish i could get a job there. haha.

I agree, 100%.

I actually wish they didn't get sold, but I want to see where it goes, and unlike others - I won't boycott them personally, just because they sold out.

 

[planker101]

Don't know/care about the politics, but I do think that in it's price range VAS is pretty good. Not excellent, however I do feel like it has the potential to improve with age. Have a few bottles under the house waiting to hit their prime... hopefully

 

[Joesl8]

Victory at Sea is AMAZING. My favorite imperial vanilla stout. I brewed a pretty decent clone of it, and it's one of the best beers I brewed. Highly recommended.

I thought VaS was great till I tried Sudwerk 3 best friends. Same idea in a lager!? If you can get VaS on tap, it's good, but the bottle versions suck balz. As for them selling out...a sell out is a sell out. Maybe you think it's ok? I'm old school and don't. I don't buy ballast anymore, but they were always aholes IMO.

 

[55x11]

I thought VaS was great till I tried Sudwerk 3 best friends. Same idea in a lager!? If you can get VaS on tap, it's good, but the bottle versions suck balz. As for them selling out...a sell out is a sell out. Maybe you think it's ok? I'm old school and don't. I don't buy ballast anymore, but they were always aholes IMO.

You seem to be blaming Ballast Point for selling 50% share to InBev/Constellation, but I don't blame them at all. They had $200M business, at best and someone offered them $1Billion, just for the brand name? I would take that.

If your house is worth $200K and I offer you $1 Million, if you are smart, you probably will sell, (and you should sell), never mind the fact that your kids grew up in that house etc. Yes, you would be a "sell out" (your words), but you know you can buy 5 houses with the money you have.

If you are so old-school that you won't accept 5 times your house value, good for you (also, I strongly suspect you are a liar in that case). But at least you shouldn't blame your neighbor if he sells out for a similar deal. I don't.

I am not sure how Ballast Point was ever "ahole" to you, except for producing their beer, which you are free to drink or not drink, and their beer, for the most part is very good if not excellent. So what did Ballast Point folks ever did to you to become "a-holes"?

Look, if you don't like Victory at Sea (not sure what you are doing in this thread then, and I can't see how it can be compared to a *lager*), fine - Victory at Sea predates the "sell-out". If you want to boycott all Ballast Point beers past 2015, that's fine too.

Either way, none of this has any relevance to the way Victory at Sea tastes.

 

[Calaeb]

You seem to be blaming Ballast Point for selling 50% share to InBev/Constellation, but I don't blame them at all. They had $200M business, at best and someone offered them $1Billion, just for the brand name? I would take that.

If your house is worth $200K and I offer you $1 Million, if you are smart, you probably will sell, (and you should sell), never mind the fact that your kids grew up in that house etc. Yes, you would be a "sell out" (your words), but you know you can buy 5 houses with the money you have.

If you are so old-school that you won't accept 5 times your house value, good for you (also, I strongly suspect you are a liar in that case). But at least you shouldn't blame your neighbor if he sells out for a similar deal. I don't.

I am not sure how Ballast Point was ever "ahole" to you, except for producing their beer, which you are free to drink or not drink, and their beer, for the most part is very good if not excellent. So what did Ballast Point folks ever did to you to become "a-holes"?

Look, if you don't like Victory at Sea (not sure what you are doing in this thread then, and I can't see how it can be compared to a *lager*), fine - Victory at Sea predates the "sell-out". If you want to boycott all Ballast Point beers past 2015, that's fine too.

Either way, none of this has any relevance to the way Victory at Sea tastes.

Well said! do you happen to have the clone recipe you followed? id love to have it on tap when i want lol

 

[Joesl8]

You seem to be blaming Ballast Point for selling 50% share to InBev/Constellation, but I don't blame them at all. They had $200M business, at best and someone offered them $1Billion, just for the brand name? I would take that.

If your house is worth $200K and I offer you $1 Million, if you are smart, you probably will sell, (and you should sell), never mind the fact that your kids grew up in that house etc. Yes, you would be a "sell out" (your words), but you know you can buy 5 houses with the money you have.

If you are so old-school that you won't accept 5 times your house value, good for you (also, I strongly suspect you are a liar in that case). But at least you shouldn't blame your neighbor if he sells out for a similar deal. I don't.

I am not sure how Ballast Point was ever "ahole" to you, except for producing their beer, which you are free to drink or not drink, and their beer, for the most part is very good if not excellent. So what did Ballast Point folks ever did to you to become "a-holes"?

Look, if you don't like Victory at Sea (not sure what you are doing in this thread then, and I can't see how it can be compared to a *lager*), fine - Victory at Sea predates the "sell-out". If you want to boycott all Ballast Point beers past 2015, that's fine too.

Either way, none of this has any relevance to the way Victory at Sea tastes.

You are probably right, not sure if I'd sell out a brewery if I invested my soul into it but I'm 100% sure I'd give my recipes away because let's face it, I brew but I still buy beers, so a majority of us homebrewers still buy their beer. I guess I was just bitter because it seems that everyone selling out to these piss paddlers, they're even buying supply shops and I just think it's bad for us. I Don't even think ballast is worth the 9 zeros but they do make good beers, even though I stopped buying them because they're just too damn expensive. I've found other beers just as good. Sorry, just ranting but youre probably right, and it is a free market.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=202432&page=2

 

[slym2none]

I don't consider a brewery "selling out" as a bad thing, as long as the taste and quality stays the same. It may also result in lower prices, and farther distribution. It does get a little crazy with some beers like sculpin. Can you imagine Pineapple Headdy Topper, or Habanero Pliny.

ipe: