jmcquesten
Well-Known Member
I'm trying to help someone get their 3 tap kegarator system right, and need some advice. I've tried to explain to him the longer line setup, be he just doesn't see how that can help. I don't keg, so I can't prove it to him, but I tell him what I've read here. Here's the problem, more times than not, he complains about not having bubbles IN the beer. It usually pours pretty nice with a perfect 1.5" head, but the beer below is almost flat. When this happens, he cranks up the pressure which makes for a foamy pour, and still flat beer when foam settles out. He has the temperature/pressure/desired volume chart, and tries to follow it, but after a couple years, he (I) is (am) still not completely happy with the final product. I know it's good beer, because we have split several batches and I always prefer my bottled over his kegged. His experience with the kegged beer is pretty much why I have stuck to bottling. So, before I ask for suggestions, I'll share what I've already convinced him to try (he's very doubtful, and doesn't have complete faith in my regurgitated HBT info).
Here's his setup: (not sure of brand) kegarator with 3 tap tower. Tower not cooled, but insulated inside. Single regulator w/ 4 way splitter manifold. 5 lb co2 bottle kept inside fridge. Think he's got 4-5 foot standard size lines, which I believe to be the problem. He has it set to 38-40°F, and typically tries to run 12 psi.
What he has tried:
1. High pressure forced carb with shaking, which I recommended against and never really turned out well.
2. Setting at serving pressure (12 psi) and leaving for a couple weeks. Better, but still not right.
3. Batch priming in keg with proper amount of dextrose for desired carb level and leaving at room temperature for a couple weeks. Then chilling and hooking up the gas. A little better, but still not enough bubbles IN the beer.
4. He's considering using a stone running from the gas in connection thinking that will get the bubbles IN the beer instead of on top of it. I didn't think this would help and told him that's not how it works and I don't have to do that with bottles.
I have my doubts about the 12 psi. being enough for any style, but I know that's what a lot of people suggest, and what the chart specifies. I know it varies by style, but we're shooting for maybe 2.75 volumes for most of his styles. So the higher end of the carb levels for most beers. He will be switching to a 3 regulator setup soon for better control, but that won't solve the problem. I think I finally might have him talked into longer lines and that gets back to my original question. What is too long? I see that a lot of people say 10 ft. Will that cover ALL situations? If he's running a Hefeweizen and shooting for 3.5 volumes, is 10 ft enough friction loss? Would 12 ft be a safer bet? Is 12 too long? What is the downside of going longer than necessary? Will a longer line negatively affect a lower carbed beer? Changing the lines out is a real pain because the connections inside the tower are hard to get at, so I want to make sure the change will cover all possible scenarios. I know there are line length calculators, but I want real experienced advice. I also don't want to waste any more time fixing someone else's problem, but it's really bothering me. I want to see his kegged beer coming out just as good as my bottled. If that happens, then maybe I will make the step to kegging, but at this point, I'm not convinced that the quality is the same. I know that people swear by kegging, but I'm sure they are having better luck with it. Thoughts?
Here's his setup: (not sure of brand) kegarator with 3 tap tower. Tower not cooled, but insulated inside. Single regulator w/ 4 way splitter manifold. 5 lb co2 bottle kept inside fridge. Think he's got 4-5 foot standard size lines, which I believe to be the problem. He has it set to 38-40°F, and typically tries to run 12 psi.
What he has tried:
1. High pressure forced carb with shaking, which I recommended against and never really turned out well.
2. Setting at serving pressure (12 psi) and leaving for a couple weeks. Better, but still not right.
3. Batch priming in keg with proper amount of dextrose for desired carb level and leaving at room temperature for a couple weeks. Then chilling and hooking up the gas. A little better, but still not enough bubbles IN the beer.
4. He's considering using a stone running from the gas in connection thinking that will get the bubbles IN the beer instead of on top of it. I didn't think this would help and told him that's not how it works and I don't have to do that with bottles.
I have my doubts about the 12 psi. being enough for any style, but I know that's what a lot of people suggest, and what the chart specifies. I know it varies by style, but we're shooting for maybe 2.75 volumes for most of his styles. So the higher end of the carb levels for most beers. He will be switching to a 3 regulator setup soon for better control, but that won't solve the problem. I think I finally might have him talked into longer lines and that gets back to my original question. What is too long? I see that a lot of people say 10 ft. Will that cover ALL situations? If he's running a Hefeweizen and shooting for 3.5 volumes, is 10 ft enough friction loss? Would 12 ft be a safer bet? Is 12 too long? What is the downside of going longer than necessary? Will a longer line negatively affect a lower carbed beer? Changing the lines out is a real pain because the connections inside the tower are hard to get at, so I want to make sure the change will cover all possible scenarios. I know there are line length calculators, but I want real experienced advice. I also don't want to waste any more time fixing someone else's problem, but it's really bothering me. I want to see his kegged beer coming out just as good as my bottled. If that happens, then maybe I will make the step to kegging, but at this point, I'm not convinced that the quality is the same. I know that people swear by kegging, but I'm sure they are having better luck with it. Thoughts?