fruit gruit

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mwc9711

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After trying my first homebrewed gruit, i've decided i love it. It definitely needs some time to mellow out because of its high abv and strong herbal presence. Anyway, I'm thinking it would make an excellent ale for Spring, and I was wondering if it would be a good base for a fruit ale (yes fruit with an f, no typo). I think it would work well with raspberry, but if anyone has any other suggestions I would be happy to listen.
 
It really depends what you're going for....how much fruitiness do you want in the end product? How much herbal character do you want?

I find that most fruit beers in general tend to turn out dry and acidic with a touch of the fruit aroma/flavor. Lindemans fruit lambics, for example, are pasteurized before adding the fruit and back-sweetened, if I remember correctly, to achieve their sweet fruitiness.

In mead or wine-making, however, you get more of the fruit profile - I'm guessing due to the high volume of fruit and sugar.

So, if you wanted to make a fruit gruit, I would either go really high gravity with a generous amount of honey to achieve a sweeter, fruitier brew, or go into the direction of a lambic: dry, sour, remnants of fruit, and not so high in alcohol.

You have to pick a base herb with high antimicrobial properties such as yarrow, mugwort, wormwood, or sage (I wouldn't personally choose this as a base herb). Yarrow is the most neutral in flavor although it does make brews quite tart and dry. As a tea, yarrow is bitter and has a medicinal kind of floral note. Yarrow beers never turn out with much of these characteristics - always tart in my experience. The bitterness is not really noticeable, but there is balance.

The artemesias (mugwort and wormwood) add highly noticeable bitters and a very herbal flavor behind - more true to their raw aroma and flavor. Wormwood is mainly a bitter and doesn't have all that much flavor/aroma of its own (unless you use flowers). Used sparingly, it could make a neutral base for fruit beer, but I think the fruit would have to be something very sweet and potent (raspberries are a good choice) for balance. Mugwort is not nearly as bitter as wormwood, and you will get more of its character in the end product. This might compliment fruits in the right proportions.

I have actually made one fruit gruit. Needless to say, the results taught me a lot.....

used a belgian golden ale as the base with yarrow as base herb + german and roman chamomile for flavor (mashed low). I then fermented with a combo of plums and pluots (2lbs total per gallon). It came out very dry and sour. All the flavors pretty much gelled together, can't really tell the yarrow from the plum from the chamomile. I ended up adding a sour mix (bretts and bacteria) so that I would at least have some funky complexity to go along with the sourness, along with some french oak (balanced out the sourness and added some nice vanilla).

This pretty much turned into an experimental beer...
I just went ahead and bottled early with no priming sugar into champagne bottles (wanted to make carboy space for some more intentional batches). I plan to let the bugs do their work in the bottles and hopefully, there will be just enough residual sugar to carbonate (may be low, may be high, happy either way). I plan to wait about a year before opening. My wife and I, though, were quite impressed with what we tasted going into the bottle, so I actually have high hopes for this batch.

With all that said, you're really looking at a balancing game. Herbs and fruits are potent components, so somewhere in the formulation you need to compensate. If you use highly-acidic fruits or yarrow, maybe go for a high mash with lots of unfermentables. If you use strong herbs, go sparingly and choose a fruit that is bold and sharp enough to dominate.

On the other hand, you can just embrace what comes and run with it.

my 2cents
 
I should also add a note about my suggestion of honey:

don't boil or pasteurize!

Honey does ferment pretty completely, but left raw, you will get more of its character and residual sweetness I find. Also, in my experience, it adds balance to something that might have been overly acidic. If a beer starts moving into the sour direction, cane sugars seem to contribute.
 
Thanks for all the suggestions. I can't find mugwort, so im using wormwood. I used it in my first gruit, and made sure not to over do it and I think i will use it in the fruit gruit as well. I think I'm going to go for the higher OG and try and bring out a strong fruity taste to go along with the herbs.
 
It's been a while, but I'm finally getting around to brewing this ale. I'm going to use a belgian base, with honey instead of candy sugar.
8lbs Pilsner or Light Malt Extract
1lb Honey
4 oz Wheat Malt
4 oz Vienna Malt
8 oz Aromatic Malt
1oz mugwort
1/2oz wormwood
.25oz coriandre
Bitter orange peel
2lbs raspberries
3lbs strawberries
1lb cherries

I might replace the cherries with pomegranate to get a more tart flavor and mouthfeel. I'm aiming for a little residual sweetness, but not much. All of the fruit will go into the secondary, and the mugwort/wormwood will be boiled for 20 min. Any suggestions?
 
Have you started this beer yet??

I think your recipe there is a great build! Good ideas!

I have a couple suggestions though....

#1 - I would personally drop the mugwort down to 1/2 oz or even less. As you know, the artemesias are very intense herbs and its really easy to overdo it (if you were going to compare to hops, think in the 10-15% alpha range, you don't need much). I think you're amounts are great on their own, but with fruit added, may be too much. You're right on the for boil time.

#2 - I would just taste your brew after primary to decide if its really fit for the fruit. Berries aren't cheap, so you want to be sure this batch is really worth it first.

#3 - Strawberries are tricky. Unless you've successfully brewed something with strawberries, I would hold off and try something with strawberries by itself to see how it comes out. I've made a mead with strawberries and was quite surprised with the results. Unlike the raspberries and cherries, strawberries really don't have that much sugar and are very acidic.

I've actually done a tasting of my plum/yarrow/chamomile sour beer since the last post. When I bottled, the only flavor I really got was plum tartness and a bit of fruitiness in the nose - couldn't distinguish the yarrow or chamomile at all. After 2 or so months in the bottle.....it is carbonating (will still be several months before its complete), but now the yarrow and chamomile are very detectable. I did not use very much of these, so point being, go easy on the herbs. I think I would actually suggest to use 1/4oz of each now that I really think about it.

Let us know how this batch turns out!
 
Thanks for the suggestions. I was worried about the mugwort, since I haven't found a good guide to the amounts. I'm planning on brewing this next weekend, it's just one of those I haven't gotten around to. I'll let you know the results once it's all done.
 
Well, after two months of intending to brew this, I finally got started. It was a 3 gallon boil, with 8lbs pilsner LME, 8oz wheat malt, 4oz aromatic and 4oz vienna. I also added 8oz candy sugar in the middle, and 1lb of honey as the wort was cooling. I used .5oz wormwood at 20 min, I didn't use mugwort like I had intended, but I don't think it will make too much of a difference, since it was the bitterness I was after for balance, rather than the mugwort aroma. I also added 2tbsp of coriandre and .75 oz bitter orange peel at the end of the boil.

I cooled and poured into the carboy with an additional 2gal of ice water to help cool the wort further. I used Nottingham yeast, and woke up this morning to a strange sound, which turned out to be intermittent squirts from the overflowing airlock. On the bright side, the foam smelled fantastic for the half hour it took to clean up.

I have high hopes for this batch. I'll keep you posted.
 
Well, it has been a few weeks since bottling, and I would call this a succesful experiment. The wormwood aroma is only really present in the first few sips, and seems to be carried away with the CO2, although I think the yeast has reached its limit since the beer is barely carbonated. I had to switch up the fruit in the recipe, due to the outrageous winter prices of raspberries. I ended up going with two cups of raspberry syrup, which was just raspberry juice that had been concentrated to the thickness of syrup and a quart of pomegranate juice. As for tasting notes, there is not a whole lot of bitterness, but the tartness of the pomegranate and the raspberry balance out the rather sweet beer. There is a slightly grassy aroma of wormwood, but everything works together very nicely. Very drinkable, and nice for the warming temperatures.
 
After trying my first homebrewed gruit, i've decided i love it. It definitely needs some time to mellow out because of its high abv and strong herbal presence. Anyway, I'm thinking it would make an excellent ale for Spring, and I was wondering if it would be a good base for a fruit ale (yes fruit with an f, no typo). I think it would work well with raspberry, but if anyone has any other suggestions I would be happy to listen.
I actually did this: mixed mashed red apples, pineapple into a juice, added some extra pineapple juice and apricot extract, pasteurized them, then did a mash with wheat and medium baked grains(i don't remember which one), cooled them both and mixed them together into the fermentor. Then added a package of dry safeale T-58 and let them ferment. After that i bottled them and i tasted one after 2 months. It was still not matured but it has great potentials. It produced co2, low ph, was much clearer, the yeast tasted fine with this combo and there was definitely an apple smell and aftertaste. Dry also. Will taste after 5 months to see the results
 
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