A Flanders sour mash experiment

[HopHoarder]

I already have two carboys of Flanders in secondary using Roselare yeast, but I was curious as to how a similar grainbill would fare using a sour mash technique. I had to adjust my recipe a bit from my original flanders as I didn't want unmalted grains or other complex sugars in the mash, so based on a 9 litre recipe I went with this:


Ingredients
Amt Name Type # %/IBU
1.00 tsp Gypsum (Calcium Sulfate)
2 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM)
2 lbs Pilzen Canada Malt (1.5 SRM)
1 lbs 4.8 oz Superior Pale Malt (3.1 SRM)
4.0 oz Aromatic Malt (26.0 SRM)
4.0 oz Special B Malt (120.0 SRM)
3.2 oz Caramunich I (Weyermann) (40.0 SRM)

0.35 oz Ahtanum [6.00 %] - First Wort 60.0 min 15.9 IBUs
1.00 Items Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 mins)
0.75 lb Dextrose (Boil 0.0 mins)
0.5 pkg BRY-97 (Danstar #)
2.5 lb Raspberries (Secondary 30.0 days)
1.00 Items Oak Spiral-Light Toast (Secondary 30.0 days)

Beer Profile

Est Original Gravity: 1.058 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.015 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 5.6 %
Bitternerness: 16 IBU
Est Color: 13.2 SRM

I soured the entire mash for 48 hours at around 110 degrees, then sparged with 110 degree water and did a 15 minute boil. This beer is nearly done in primary and will be transferred to secondary in a day or two, where the raspberries and oak spiral will be added and then to sit for around 30 days.
I'm not expecting a Crand Cru out of this; it's more of a curiosity thing to see what something fast-tracked like this would taste. For that reason I call it my "Fast Freddy Flanders".
Will keep you all posted on how this one turns out.

 

[janitorjerm]

I'd like to hear how this turns out.

 

[spenghali]

It sounds like you have done a sour mash before and therefore should know what to expect; a sweet/malty red profile with a lot of lacto up front. I understand you are trying to make a quick sour beer here, but I don't think the Flanders red style is conducive to this.

 

[HopHoarder]

No it's probably not, but all the same, I'm giving it a try anyway as just a 9 litre batch. Should still hopefully produce an interesting beer.

 

[HopHoarder]

Bottled my Fat Freddy Flanders today. The BRY-97 yeast chewed it down to 1.012, so fairly dry which was what I wanted. The 1.2kg of raspberries has given it a distinct but not overpowering taste and aroma. I primed with 1.5oz dextrose and added a bit of washed pacman I had lying around to make sure it was adequately carbonated. Tastes pretty darn good already. I'll give it a couple weeks of bottle conditioning and report back.

 

[TimT]

I can see doing this with wyeast brett L. and a sour mash for quicky. By using the roeselare you introduce pedio so it will super attenuate. So eventually your bottles will explode (1012 has ~6 volumes of co2 left to produce) and likely before then the beer will get sick and be undrinkable for several months.

 

[janitorjerm]

I can see doing this with wyeast brett L. and a sour mash for quicky. By using the roeselare you introduce pedio so it will super attenuate. So eventually your bottles will explode (1012 has ~6 volumes of co2 left to produce) and likely before then the beer will get sick and be undrinkable for several months.

I think he was saying he has seperate batches on Roselare.

 

[HopHoarder]

Yeah I have other batches on Roselare. The particular beer I talking about on this thread is sour mash only and using BRY-97 yeast with a bit of pacman for bottle conditioning; no Brett.

 

[Ibrewaletx]

I love this idea and look forward to hearing how it turns out. I have a batch of 1 year old Flanders that has been sitting w/ Roeselare that I'm getting close to bottling & also just finished up my first sour mash berliner-weiss (it's fermenting w/ US-05 now) so this combination you are doing is intriguing.

 

[TimT]

I think he was saying he has seperate batches on Roselare.

I see, the title makes it confusing as this really is not a flanders red at all. It is a very light oude bruin or a sour brown ale.

 

[berebrando]

I don't understand how the title is misleading. The OP is conducting an experiment - trying to obtain a flavor profile close to a Flanders Red using a sour mash and clean fermentation in lieu of extended aging with souring microbes.

I'm interested in the results.

 

[TimT]

I don't understand how the title is misleading. The OP is conducting an experiment - trying to obtain a flavor profile close to a Flanders Red using a sour mash and clean fermentation in lieu of extended aging with souring microbes.

I'm interested in the results.

Because it will come out nothing at all like a flanders red. The brett is pretty much the corner stone of the style. If you did a beer with the wy brett lambicus and sour mashed it you would get a quick and dirty version of a flanders red.

 

[HopHoarder]

I never actually said "Flanders Red", but "Flanders sour mash". Maybe if I said "Flanders-style" instead it would be less confusing to you? Anyway I don't expect this to taste like a Grand Cru but I'm interested (as are a few others) as to how this beer will turn out. When I tasted it going to bottling I thought it had alot of potential as it had a nice tart twang with a distinct raspberry flavour and aroma. I'm posting detailed information on this thread in case anyone else wants to give it a whirl.
One of the things I love about homebrewing is that I can be experimental and also that I don't have to play by traditional rules and recipies. If you happen to be in then Lower Mainland in the near future TimT you can stop by for a beer

 

[HopHoarder]

Tasting it after some aging I and a few of my drinking buddies thought this beer was quite tasty. Distinct but not over-powering raspberry paired with a decent malt body combined with the sour mash twang. Definitely a good one to enjoy on the patio.

 

[Ibrewaletx]

Tasting it after some aging I and a few of my drinking buddies thought this beer was quite tasty. Distinct but not over-powering raspberry paired with a decent malt body combined with the sour mash twang. Definitely a good one to enjoy on the patio.

I just started pulling off my keg of sour mash berliner weiss, so your experiment here might be what I give a shot to on my 2nd sour mash.
Would you brew this again? If so, would you adjust anything?

 

[HopHoarder]

Yes I would definitely brew this one again. As far as the grain bill goes I wouldn't change anything, but I would probably be a bit more aggressive with the sour mash to get more of that tart twang. The raspberries works really well in secondary.