I've been making the Mezza Luna Red by Wine Expert, and they had me add 2 packets of small oak chips into the primary when pitching the yeast. I just degassed and added sulfite/clarifying agents today and had a taste, and there's some oak flavor but I'm searching for a little more. I've got 4 oz of medium toast french oak chips, and I'm wondering how much of it and for how long should I add the chips before racking it off. I plan on tasting it weekly, however I'm worried if there's too much oak and I rack it off to another carboy the wine wont clear. I was thinking just an oz of chips, does that sound good? And how should I go about adding them to the fermenter? Should I boil them first?
How much oak?
- Thread starter Jarov
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Gitmoe
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I would defintely boil. If you're only adding an ounce, put them in a microwave safe container ( I use a Pyrex measuring bowl ) and put just enough water to cover the chips into the container. Put it in the microwave for about 3 minutes or so. You're time will vary. You're just trying to boil the chips for about 30 seconds. Be extremely careful when removing from the microwave. It will be super hot. Let cool for a few short minutes, then dump it into your wine...
I never boil my oak- the liquid that it's boiled it then the water used would take on all of the oak flavor.
If you're really paranoid about infection, I guess you could roast the oak or soak it in bourbon (and then use the bourbon in the wine), but it's not necessary.
If you're really paranoid about infection, I guess you could roast the oak or soak it in bourbon (and then use the bourbon in the wine), but it's not necessary.
Gitmoe
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I just dump all the liquid in. No oak essence lost.
oogaboogachiefwalkingdeer
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Seems the boiling method would give more of what you are looking for faster.
Heavywalker
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there is really absolutely no need to boil oak, by the time the late oak additions are added the ABV is high enough to kill any thing that could cause harm to the wine.
Just add two ounces and taste every week until you get your desired level of oak, keep in mind that it will mellow a bit during the aging process. It typically takes around 6 weeks to extract all of the oak flavor out of cubes, I think chips take a little less time.
Just add two ounces and taste every week until you get your desired level of oak, keep in mind that it will mellow a bit during the aging process. It typically takes around 6 weeks to extract all of the oak flavor out of cubes, I think chips take a little less time.
Gitmoe
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What about Acetobacter? Which lives in coffee and can be found in most homes. That eats alcohol and turns wine into..... vinegar.
Heavywalker
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How do you suppose all the wineries boil their oak barrels before putting the wine into them?
Acetobacter, is prevented by keeping the sulfur dioxide at the proper level as well as preventing exposure to oxygen. Since we do not boil our must in wine the acetobacter could be present in the must itself just as easily as it could be on oak. Again there is no reason to boil the oak before adding it to the must or wine, of course there are a lot of different methods and everyone has their own way of doing things. If it works it works.
Acetobacter, is prevented by keeping the sulfur dioxide at the proper level as well as preventing exposure to oxygen. Since we do not boil our must in wine the acetobacter could be present in the must itself just as easily as it could be on oak. Again there is no reason to boil the oak before adding it to the must or wine, of course there are a lot of different methods and everyone has their own way of doing things. If it works it works.
Goofynewfie
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Hot tubs or swimming pools with the heat turned waaay up
Gitmoe
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Wineries use sulfur to keep their barrels clean. Which is exactly my point. Why not take 30 seconds to reduce the chance of infecting your batch?
Heavywalker
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That is exactly right, which is why if you keep your so2 at an aseptic level the so2 will take care of anything that is living on the oak. We have all the necessary tools that wineries have available to them. Their process is proven time and time again, I don't see why boiling is necessary.
Gitmoe
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I wanna be clear I'm not really arguing with you on any of your points. Everybody has their own process and perception of "sanitary". I've always boiled oak when using it for making beer and continue that practice with my winemaking. I know if So2 levels are kept high enough, everything should be fine. I work at a LHBS and advise lots of winemakers both experienced and new to the hobby. I deal with a surprising number of winemakers who refuse to use sulfites in their wine for various reasons, most of which are myth and not fact. I briefly try to encourage sulfite use and explain the benefits. A lot of my advice to brewers and winemakers covers the worst case scenario. Thus the boiling of oak...
Heavywalker
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No arguing here either, just discussing. I know a few people who don't use sulfites in their wine as well, in that case I would probably advise to boil anything that is being added to the wine. I see where you are coming from, working at a HBS if your advise turns out to cause someone to dump a batch of wine or brew then you have angry customers, so a logical approach is to advise on the side of caution.
I just started making beer, so I have never added oak to it. I would need to research the proper way to add the oak. I would assume that since there is an absence of SO2 in the beer wort that some form of sanitation would be necessary.
I just started making beer, so I have never added oak to it. I would need to research the proper way to add the oak. I would assume that since there is an absence of SO2 in the beer wort that some form of sanitation would be necessary.
oogaboogachiefwalkingdeer
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Heck I thought we were talking about adding oak flavor which will happen sooner if you boil first. Simple enough for me.
