Recipe OG and FG help

[andy6026]

I'm about to brew this recipe for a stout, but I'm a little worried as to large discrepancy between the estimated ABV and the 'actual ABV'. I don't want this beer to be really high alcohol, but somewhere between 4-5%. So the 'actual ABV' listed is ideal. So I guess my question is, why does this recipe have such a high estimated ABV compared to the 'actual', and how do I avoid hitting it? Thanks!

Recipe:

Midnight Stout
Dry Stout (Irish)

Type: All Grain Date: 8/7/2004
Batch Size: 5.50 gal Brewer: Shakey Dog Brewery
Boil Size: 7.00 gal Asst Brewer: Don Pfeiffer
Boil Time: 60 min Equipment: Shakey Dog Brewery
Taste Rating(out of 50): 40.0 Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0

Taste Notes: Tasted on 8/30/04. The Roast Barley and Chocolate Malt come through really well. Very little hop going on. Next time add some Goldings at 5 min. Very creamy.

Ingredients
Amount Item Type % or IBU
10.00 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) UK (3.0 SRM) Grain 66.7 %
2.00 lb Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain 13.3 %
2.00 lb Roasted Barley (300.0 SRM) Grain 13.3 %
1.00 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 6.7 %
2.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (60 min) Hops 29.8 IBU
2.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00%] (15 min) Hops 14.8 IBU
1 Pkgs Irish Ale (White Labs #WLP004) Yeast-Ale


Beer Profile
Est Original Gravity: 1.070 SG Measured Original Gravity: 1.060 SG
Est Final Gravity: 1.019 SG Measured Final Gravity: 1.028 SG
Estimated Alcohol by Vol: 6.7 % Actual Alcohol by Vol: 4.2 %
Bitterness: 44.7 IBU Calories: 278 cal/pint
Est Color: 70.9 SRM



Mash Profile
Mash Name: Single Infusion, Full Body Total Grain Weight: 15.00 lb
Sparge Water: 2.49 gal Grain Temperature: 72.0 F
Sparge Temperature: 168.0 F TunTemperature: 72.0 F
Adjust Temp for Equipment: TRUE Mash PH: 5.4 PH

Name Description Step Temp Step Time
Mash In Add 18.75 qt of water at 173.2 F 158.0 F 45 min
Mash Out Add 7.50 qt of water at 197.4 F 168.0 F 10 min


Mash Notes: Simple single infusion mash for use with most modern well modified grains (about 95% of the time).
Carbonation and Storage
Carbonation Type: Corn Sugar Volumes of CO2: 2.0
Pressure/Weight: 3.0 oz Carbonation Used: 3
Keg/Bottling Temperature: 60.0 F Age for: 14.0 days
Storage Temperature: 52.0 F

Notes
Brew #9 45 gal YTD.
First running 1.092

 

[Revvy]

Where are you getting the "actual abv" figure from? Those numbers don't exist until you brew the beer, and take gravity readings. You haven't brewed the beer, so anything "actual" hasn't happened yet.

Is this a recipe someone else brewed and these are his numbers, or is this your beersmith file and those numbers are just placeholders until you ACTUALLY brew the beer (get it, actual?) On my beersmith, those fields just pretty much have any old numbers in those boxes....and don't mean anything, until you change them.

If it's someone else's beer and those are his numbers, then he didn't do something correct, maybe his crush was off, or his efficiency, or not enough yeast to do the job, or didn't give it enough oxygen.... But those again are his numbers, and not necessarily going to be yours.

Or if it is someone elses, 1) he didn't bother to fill those fields in in his beersmith, and just cut and pasted the whole thing over into a thread, not paying attention to those actual fields.

Rarely do I remember to go back and fill those in on my brews any more. Especially if my gravity readings hit where they should. But when I'm posting a recipe, I make sure to clear out those fields when I past the recipe in here.

 

[IslandLizard]

Taste Notes: Tasted on 8/30/04....

Obviously someone else brewed this and made (good) notes.

Plug the recipe into BeerSmith and lower the grain bill to get your desired gravity and estimated alcohol level, using your own tested mash efficiency. You can tweak your specialty grains and hops to balance things out to your taste.

Or look for a different recipe that was designed to yield a lower alcohol stout. And may taste better than a tweaked version of the above one.

 

[andy6026]

The is someone else's recipe with someone else's notes - so it's their 'actual' numbers (OG, FG, ABV, etc). This is only my 4th AG batch so I haven't figured out my typical efficiency yet. I've already crushed all the grains, so I'm going to plug ahead and see what happens. Cheers for the input!

 

[IslandLizard]

Yes, and you can use a mash efficiency of 75% as a start. Measure your gravities along the way to get an idea of your real efficiency.

The only thing that really stands out his FG being 1.028. That's why is so far under with his alcohol %. That beer was not attenuated as far as it should have (<1.019), and there are many reasons that could cause that. Your setup and methods will definitely create a different beer, and hopefully as good or better than his.

Stouts are very forgiving, so the odds are on your side. With that grain bill and volume, you should get a higher alcohol beer than his 4.2%.

What temp are you going to mash at? 156°F?

I also see he mashed out, and did not sparge apparently, although those terms are often misused.
With that in mind, I would not mash out, but instead so a single batch sparge. That may yield a better efficiency right there.

Good fortune with that brew!

 

[woozy]

Stouts are very forgiving, so the odds are on your side. With that grain bill and volume, you should get a higher alcohol beer than his 4.2%.

If it's someone else's beer and those are his numbers, then he didn't do something correct, maybe his crush was off, or his efficiency, or not enough yeast to do the job, or didn't give it enough oxygen.... But those again are his numbers, and not necessarily going to be yours.

Bear in mind the OP *wants* those lower "wrong" actual numbers.

 

[andy6026]

Ok, so I finished the brew. It didn't go as smoothly as I hoped. I decided that since I wanted it a lower ABV then I'd bring the volume up to target 6 gallons.

2 problems presented some difficulty. The first, and most serious, is that the thermometer I put in my mash tun showed a big discrepancy with the meat thermometer I had on hand. So, in effect I don't know what temp my mash was really at. The inside thermometer said 148 while the probe showed over 170. Trusting the inside thermometer more, I added some hot water and brought it up to 152 - still lower than the recipes target. However, not knowing if that's accurate, I held it there.

Next my sparge stuck - I must have milled the grains too fine. I ended up dumping the mash back into my kettle and filtering it into the fermenter, cleaning out the kettle and then once sparged, did the boil.

I ended up with slightly over 6 gallons (I hope my blow off tube holds). OG was 1052. Depending on the FG, I think I will likely be pleased with the ABV of this stout. However, I'm not sure if I should have added more hops to compensate for the higher water volume. I did throw in an extra 3/4 ounces of Columbus hops 5 minutes from the end of the boil as the recipe notes suggested that it was a bit short on hops. The Columbus was all I had on hand, but likely wasn't enough.

We'll see. Thanks for the suggestions guys. Now to look into getting a thermometer I can be confident about.

 

[homebrewdad]

I know that some poo poo them as overpriced toys, but man, I LOVE my thermapen. Super accurate results stupidly fast... and it gets a lot of duty as a meat thermometer when I grill.

There are some really nice lower priced thermometers out there, though.