Sick of gusher bottles. New Bottling process.

[Sadu]

I just opened my 3rd gusher bottle last night, which came from batch #5. So that's 2 batches with gusher problems now. I figure the issues are limited to specific bottle sanitation rather than the whole batch since the rest of these batches were fine.

I'm now up to batch #16 and have revised processes a lot since this was bottled, but I really want to make sure my revised process is good and there are no more surprises. I was wondering is someone could sanity check my process please?

So here's how I do it now.

** Incoming bottles start here **
- I have been getting my bottles from the recycling center - some are pretty clean, some are terrible. Going forward I won't need to do this anymore.
- I fill a bin with water and leave them to soak outside until I'm ready to process them. This loosens the crud and the label.
- Bring bottle inside to the sink, empty out the water and crud, fill with hot water and shake, empty again.
- Scrape the label off with a knife, which gets some or all of it off.

** Bottles I have brewed with already start here **
- Put the bottle into a bleach solution (1Tbsp per gallon) and let soak for 30 mins minimum, but usually longer.
- Scrub the inside of the bottle with a bottle brush on the way out of the bleach.
- Scrape off the rest of the label and remove the glue residue with soapy water and a scrubber pad.
- Rinse the bleach off with warm water.
- Spray the bottle inside with Starsan and leave upside down to dry completely.
- Store the dry bottle in closed cardboard boxes somewhere cool, dry, non-dusty until bottling day.

** On bottling day **
- Inspect the dry bottle by holding up to the light
- Spray the bottle with Starsan and allow to sit for 1 minute
- Empty (most of) the Starsan out and fill immediately with beer
- Once 4 bottles are filled I put on a cap that has been sitting in Starsan

Once I drink a bottle I rinse it immediately and immerse it in bleach solution until I have a few bottles to process together. I actually have enough bottles now that I don't need to collect bottles from the recycling center - so this means bottles will be starting in a much cleaner state as I am good about rinsing them straight away.

One thing that is important to me is being able to pre-process bottles a few at a time, which the bucket of bleach works very well for. I like to store them sanitised and dry so that they don't need as much processing on bottling day. I find it no trouble to find 5 mins to scrub a couple of bottles but adding an extra hour to bottling day for sanitation is hard to work around.

Is there anything that you would do differently? I think this process is solid but I'm willing to admit I don't know everything. Is a spray with Starsan on bottling day enough if the bottle has already been sanitised with bleach before storage?

Also interested in how often I should be changing the bleach solution?

 

[Paps]

I

Is there anything that you would do differently? ?

Try these.

 

[Sadu]

Haha yeah. Don't have any more budget for brew hardware this year, that's gonna have to wait a while. Point taken though, Bottle sanitation is such a chore from start to finish.

 

[MaryB]

Skip the bleach and use PBW to eat any organic matter during the soak. I suspect you are having little bits stuck in the bottles you can't see and infection can live there. For donor bottles I use a double strength PBW solution and wear gloves, for my own bottles I rinse well after drinking including running a finger around the inside of the neck to remove any ring that might be there from bottle conditioning then drain and set aside. When I have enough to do a full rack of 24 bottles they go in the sink in a normal strength PBW solution to remove labels and any leftover beer crud. Soak a minimum of an hour, maybe 2.

 

[madscientist451]

Here's what I do for bottle sanitation:
-Visually inspect each bottle for material stuck in the bottom by holding the bottle up to a bright light. Really nasty bottles get recycled, others get a pbw solution added and allowed to sit for 24 hours or longer. Dump out pbw, fill with hot water and use bottle brush, dump out and inspect again, if its not clean at this point it gets recycled, I have plenty of bottles.
Rinsing bottles immediately after using is a big help, and disposing of "problem" dirty bottles instead of trying to clean them can eliminate many problems
-When bottling, I use a bucket of star san and imerse the bottles for at least 2 minutes.
This may be overkill, but I don't have any bottle infections. I know lots of people use the spray star san method, but I like to make sure the star san is really doing its job. I take out two bottles, dump star san out and fill and cap both. Caps are kept in a small dish of star san. The star san isn't wasted, the bottling star san will be used for sanitizing carboys and other things before its finally dumped.
--Keep an eye on your bottling bucket, and siphon equipment, should be cleaned and soaked in star san before use. Take extra care with cleaning any spigots or anything else associated with your bottling equipment. If you suspect any scratches or problems, relplace ASAP.
--Your sugar water priming solution should be boiled, or at least brought up to 180F before adding to your beer to sanitize it.

 

[GHBWNY]

Never had a gusher from an unsanitary bottle.

These are bottles I have used many times. After I pour, I immediately triple-rinse with hot water and leave upside down until dry. At bottling, I re-rinse in hot water and then immerse in a tub of Star-San. Take 8 bottles at a time, shake up the SS to get them foamy inside, drain and set on the counter ready to bottle. Flick any extra SS out of the bottle just prior to filling. StarSan has to be wet to be effective. Do not "fear the foam"!

Never had a gusher from an unsanitary bottle.

 

[xCSx]

After drinking a bottle I immediately rinse, then rinse again, then rinse again, then soak with waterovernight and rinse a few more times.

Bottling day I use a 5 gallon bucket filled with: http://www.northernbrewer.com/easy-clean

I don't use anything but this easy clean as my sole sanitizer/cleaner.

Gushers to me are more about uneven bottle sugar.

Make sure you put your sugar into the bottling bucket, then pour the beer on top of it, give it a stir or two.

 

[mongoose33]

I triple-rinse my bottles after drinking them--I don't fill them up, I just get a couple ounces of water in there, swish, dump, more water, etc. 3x.

Then I put them in the dishwasher. They come out sparkling. They're stored in either cardboard cases or upside down in Fastracks.

On fill day, I use a Vinator to spray the inside of the bottle with Star-San. I know there's an issue of the no-spot rinse agent in dishwashing soap preventing head retention, but I believe the final spray of Star-San mitigates that, as I don't have that issue.

There's one thing, Sadu, that I think you're over-obsessing on, to the detriment of what's really causing the problem. You're highly focused on soaking in bleach solutions, which is a sanitizer, not a cleaner. But it's the left-behind dirt that is likely the cause of the problem. Additionally, did you know common household bleach has a shelf life? Generally it's six months, so if your bleach has been around for a while, it may no longer be effective.

If I were you, I'd do something like MaryB is doing with PBW. It's the dirt that's the issue, not the bleach.

When I give out a six-pack, I implore the recipient to rinse the bottles before returning them to me. Regardless, I'll put a little water in them to soak for a bit, then rinse again before they go in the dishwasher.

 

[Redlantern]

A few questions -
1) Final Gravity - how many days in a row were you at Final before bottling?
2) How much sugar did you add to your recipe? How big was the batch?
3) What yeast did you use and at what temp did you ferment?

The reason I am asking is that I have noticed variation in carbonation ranging from flat to very carbonated in the same batch from time to time.

I have also set aside "suspect" bottles and have been right that they were highly carbonated.

The situation seems to be (on my part) getting a little in a hurry to bottle when I THINK I have hit FG, picking up a little trub from the yeast cake and finding out later that the volume I calculated the sugar for was not the volume I bottled. Additionally, the trub that formed from the yeast with a higher level of flocculation made the best gushers. Head space made a difference too - more head space, more gushing.

 

[kh54s10]

I use Oxyclean when I wash my bottles. Any use of Starsan and then it dries is just a waste of Starsan. Use it only on bottling day and don't let it dry.

Your gushers might be due to dirty bottles or could also be due to uneven priming. What is your priming process.

If you are using bleach solution I would make a new batch each time you clean your bottles.

 

[MarshmallowBlue]

the triple rinse right after finishing / pouring into a glass is key.

 

[Sadu]

There's one thing, Sadu, that I think you're over-obsessing on, to the detriment of what's really causing the problem. You're highly focused on soaking in bleach solutions, which is a sanitizer, not a cleaner. But it's the left-behind dirt that is likely the cause of the problem. Additionally, did you know common household bleach has a shelf life? Generally it's six months, so if your bleach has been around for a while, it may no longer be effective.

If I were you, I'd do something like MaryB is doing with PBW. It's the dirt that's the issue, not the bleach.

I agree that it's more likely dirt that is the problem rather than sanitiser.

My understanding was that bleach was both a sanitiser and cleaner, and as it's cheap and I had some on hand already it seemed like a good option. I'll stand corrected on this though.

Also I wasn't aware of the shelf life, and this bleach will definitely be older than 12 months.

Thanks for the advice on this, will order some PBW.

 

[Sadu]

Hmm so I just opened another 2 bottles from the hefe batch and both are gushers.

This time I released the pressure very slowly so that it didn't spill everywhere.

After 20 mins the movement stopped and I poured the beer. It tastes ok - not what I was expecting at all? It's very clear for a hefeweizen but it's totally drinkable. Oddly it tastes undercarbonated, if that makes any sense. No green apples or weird flavours, although tastes different to the last one I tried (more like a generic lager than a yeasty hefe).

One thing I noticed is that both 12oz bottles had a lot of headspace, maybe 2 inches. I wouldn't normally do this, but maybe these were the last in the batch and I was short on beer to fill them properly?

So I'm totally confused now. It's now 7 weeks since bottling. I'm now thinking that this is looking less like an infection and more likely a combo of high carbonation (2.9 vols) + lots of time at room temp + maybe uneven stirring of priming sugar + lots of headspace in the bottle.

Surely if it was infected it would have a nasty taste to go along with it?