Sam Smith Yorkshire Stingo Bottle Harvest?

Has anyone harvested yeast from a bottle of Samuel Smith's Yorkshire Stingo? (Nice beer, by the way.) I had a bottle last night and tossed the dregs into some diluted Malta Goya, and while I know looks can deceive, it appears there's some yeast growing. (Maybe it's just bottle sludge, but that's no way to think).

Any ideas what I can expect from the yeast that is (hopefully) growing?

I've read some references to Sam Smith using Wy 1469 -- is that right?

I assume they bottle condition with their regular yeast -- is that right?

Stingo is aged in wooden casks and in some places I've read that it has Brett, but can anyone confirm that?

If there is some Brett present (I'm no good at telling by taste) can anyone say what this might mean for what happens to the starter I'm growing -- will current proportions of yeast populations continue? Will the Brett die? Will it take over? I'm sure a lot depends on temp and O2 levels and nutrients and what not, but any general experiences would be interesting.

I figure I will just try a small trial batch with pale malt + crystal + Goldings and see what happens, but any input on what I can expect would be appreciated.

I know its several years later...but any luck? Tell me about your experience. Stingo is definitely one of my favorite beers. I don't pick up too much oak in the beer, and I don't know enough about brett to pick up any notes of that. All I know is they use their house strain for primary fermentation, perhaps brett is added later. I have no idea. Hopefully you have some more information, now that it is years later.

I'm resurrecting this very old thread from 2013, as I believe I've just successfully harvested up a small colony of yeast from 2 bottles of Stingo.

It's especially ironic because even though it's 2019, the bottles I found - hiding on a shelf in a suburban New Jersey liquor store - were brewed in 2013! So I will answer the first obvious question: No, Stingo doesn't hold up that long I'm afraid. That part was a bummer. Totally oxidized and undrinkable.

The label tells you when it was brewed (lower left):


I took dregs from the first bottle and watched hopefully for 5 days until finally, something started appearing. It didn't smell very good, and there were also a couple of weird blobs forming. However, there was also yeast activity! I skimmed the blobs and waited. Finally, a definite light krausen appeared, which I top cropped into another small 200mL starter along with the dregs from the second bottle.


A couple of days later, I cold crashed the first starter and decanted the liquid. I pitched the yeast into a still small, but larger starter - maybe less than 500mL.

What you see here is the first collection on the left, now on generation 2 - which smells like clean beer yeast! This one actually had a tiny blowout since it's packed into the pictured jar. The second collection is on the right.


Next step is to wait these out, crash them, decant them, and pitch it all into maybe a 1L starter. Fingers crossed... I have been wanting to do this for years, but could never find Stingo near where I live.

Paolipete said:

I've read some references to Sam Smith using Wy 1469 -- is that right?

I assume they bottle condition with their regular yeast -- is that right?

Stingo is aged in wooden casks and in some places I've read that it has Brett, but can anyone confirm that?

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Traditional British breweries don't use White Lab/Wyeast single strains - but those White Lab/Wyeast single strains may have been isolated from the multistrains used by British breweries. These days 1469 is typically linked to Tim Taylor, but I'm somewhat sceptical - genetically it looks like a Wyeast version of WLP022 Essex.

WLP037 is most often linked to Sam Smiths - there doesn't seem to be much actual evidence either way, but WLP037 is a very sticky, phenolic saison-type yeast, it will be interesting to see how it compares with what McKnuckle has harvested. (great to hear that it worked!).

It's kinda assumed that Sam use their production yeast, but I've not seen any hard evidence either way.

Anything could be hiding in old cellars where beer is aged, not necessarily Brett - for instance Harvey's Imperial Extra Double Stout contains Debaryomyces hansenii.

Northern_Brewer said:

Anything could be hiding in old cellars where beer is aged, not necessarily Brett - for instance Harvey's Imperial Extra Double Stout contains Debaryomyces hansenii.

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Did they change the name of the beer to “Thrush Stout”? (Best of the alternative options)

For anyone still interested, here is the Samuel Smith yeast taking on a small (1.25 gal) batch of 1.049 bitter. This yeast responds to rousing by growing a larger krausen every time. It seems quite lazy otherwise. I still have a small amount that I separated from the last starter that is still working on its tiny portion of DME wort days later.

The krausen looks just like what I've seen online from photos of the Sam Smith Yorkshire squares. I sure hope I don't bugger this up...

6 hours post-pitch:


15 hours post-pitch:


29 hours post-pitch:

This is getting ridiculous. Here it is at 55 hours, about 3 hours after I roused it with a ladle. It doubled in size. Holding steady at 67ºF, I will drop it to 63º soon and allow active fermentation to complete at that temp.

Very nice... I know where I can get some Stingo locally, and this is tempting me to go buy it!

Next thing you need to do though is figure out how to get some Hook Norton yeast over here in the states (nice Avatar pic!)

According to Roger Protz, as of 2010 Hogs Back was a) using a derivative of the Hooky yeast and b) bottle conditioning A Over T, Brewster's Bundle and Wobble in a Bottle but by December 2017 that had gone down to just A Over T. The yeast won't be in prime condition once it's fermented a 9% beer but A Over T might give you another option.

Or get some casks over....

Good eye @cyberbackpacker!

Just wanted to report that "Six year old Sam" has taken this 1.049 wort down to 1.010 in 72 hours. That's nearly 80% attenuation - wow. It tastes normal... just like a 3 day old, yeasty green beer. Gross, but in a normal, expected way.

I have just dropped the temperature to 50ºF, where it will stay for about one week. This is based on my notes from visiting Black Sheep Brewery where the tour guide explained their ferm schedule. I figure it's got to be at least close enough for a first try.

I can't find any details about Sam Smith's practices. They seem very secretive about it, and any home brewers who may have toured there seem not to have shared.

Are you getting any phenolics from it?

I don’t perceive any funky flavors at this point. It’s bitter from suspended yeast, and somewhat fruity on the nose, but no spicy or sharp tones coming through. It’s really too early to judge though I think.

McKnuckle said:

I don’t perceive any funky flavors at this point. It’s bitter from suspended yeast, and somewhat fruity on the nose, but no spicy or sharp tones coming through. It’s really too early to judge though I think.

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So doesn't sound anything like WLP037 then.... We'll wait and see how it develops.

McKnuckle said:

I can't find any details about Sam Smith's practices. They seem very secretive about it, and any home brewers who may have toured there seem not to have shared.

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They don't normally do tours, but in general you can assume that they do things the same way they always have. Which means that one of your best guides to how they operate is the description of their neighbours in the Barnard book from 1890 - the fermentation section starts at p27 but there's a rambling introduction and visit round the hot side before that.

Also there's some videos at https://merchantduvin.com/brew-samuel-smith.php

Thanks! Actually I had found the old Michael Jackson video earlier today. I learned a few small things:

Water is 70°C (158°F) which I assume is the strike temperature. I swear the narrator said that the mash was done in 5 hours, that’s FIVE, no joke. Then a 90 minute boil. Fermentation either “takes about a week” per one video or “after 5 days fermentation is stopped” per another.

I’m going to assume they drop the beer from under the yeast, and that it’s not literally stopped, but forced into maturation with a little residual activity.

I’ll tell you one thing. I dropped my beer’s temp to 50°F and it began to clear instantly. Compare this to the massive krausen pictured earlier.

And... we have beer!

It's not fully matured yet, being only two weeks from grain to glass, but it's quite pleasant and drinkable. It has some nice esters and possibly some diacetyl, but is pretty clean overall. I don't get the Sam Smith vibe exactly. I am sure that their fermentation schedule, which is a mystery, combined with the Yorkshire square rousing, are important to the end product. But I now have a few Mason jars of fresh yeast to experiment with!

You might find this of some interest.

A bigger version, the real thing, in Sam Smith's Brewery, Tadcaster.

cire said:

View attachment 615542

A bigger version, the real thing, in Sam Smith's Brewery, Tadcaster.

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Wonderful picture What a lot of people don't appreciate is that the fermenter (square) is beneath that 'trough'.

McMullan said:

Wonderful picture What a lot of people don't appreciate is that the fermenter (square) is beneath that 'trough'.

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Yes as can be partially seen in this next shot.

Great pics, thanks guys! I love that plastic version, it's very cool!

I know how a Yorkshire square works. What I don't know is the temperature that Sam Smith's uses to ferment. I think it's key to the flavours produced in addition to the rousing.

Having actually fermented once with SS yeast, I now see why they need to do it! The stuff rises on top like nobody's business.

I visited some UK breweries in 2017 and took some good notes at Black Sheep in Masham, where they also employ squares. Actually the primary fermenters are made of stainless steel and are circular, but they operate the same way.

Anyway, Black Sheep pitches at 18ºC and lets the temp rise to 21ºC. Once the krausen forms, they rouse the yeast for a 6 minute duration every 3 hours, over the course of 3 days. Then they cool to 10ºC and hold for 6-7 days. Finally they pump it into conditioning tanks for 3-4 days before packaging, for a total of 12-14 days of fermentation.

I attempted something similar to this with the SS test batch I just completed. The yeast had other ideas, though, and attenuated to nearly 80% only 72 hours after pitching! I then chilled it immediately to 10ºC and held it for 2 days, then dropped it to 5ºC where it's sitting right now for a couple of weeks.

McKnuckle said:

Great pics, thanks guys! I love that plastic version, it's very cool!

I know how a Yorkshire square works. What I don't know is the temperature that Sam Smith's uses to ferment. I think it's key to the flavours produced in addition to the rousing.

Having actually fermented once with SS yeast, I now see why they need to do it! The stuff rises on top like nobody's business.

I visited some UK breweries in 2017 and took some good notes at Black Sheep in Masham, where they also employ squares. Actually the primary fermenters are made of stainless steel and are circular, but they operate the same way.

Anyway, Black Sheep pitches at 18ºC and lets the temp rise to 21ºC. Once the krausen forms, they rouse the yeast for a 6 minute duration every 3 hours, over the course of 3 days. Then they cool to 10ºC and hold for 6-7 days. Finally they pump it into conditioning tanks for 3-4 days before packaging, for a total of 12-14 days of fermentation.

I attempted something similar to this with the SS test batch I just completed. The yeast had other ideas, though, and attenuated to nearly 80% only 72 hours after pitching! I then chilled it immediately to 10ºC and held it for 2 days, then dropped it to 5ºC where it's sitting right now for a couple of weeks.

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Congratulations on reclaiming the Stingo yeast, a very impressive head and must be their primary strain. I don't know at what temperature Sam Smith's ferment, I suspect they have target upper temperatures for attemperation, but suspect their production schedules might take precedence. All I saw in their main fermentation room was a row of partially open very old hand taps (faucets) controling cooling water flow. Most of the brewery equipment I saw was old and well used although some bits have been replaced by more modern equipment, but nothing that I saw appeared to be controlled by computers. So I'll suggest that temperatures and gravities are measured in a traditional manner and the action taken is determined by the human in control.

One modern piece of equipment is seen on the third FV. Manual cleaning of the squares is automated.



Sam Smith's yeast must flocculate well, their cask ales spend 2 days in conditioning tanks then casks are primed with sugar and seeded with fresh yeast.

I've been to Black Sheep too, visit was too controlled and what was said and what might happen I suspect are quite different. Their yeast came from Hardy and Hanson and having used it, wasn't impressed, but it probably didn't take too well to my FVs.

It was exactly one year ago today that my Wife and I met Sam Smith III at the Dandelion in Philadelphia when he was promoting a very limited release of Nut Brown in Kegs.

When I told him we would be very near Tadcaster, and could we possibly have a tour, he said yes!

Cire, above (I don’t know how to tag someone) and his lovely wife were driving us all over the North of England. Fortunately Cire kept his head and asked sensible questions while I was like a kid in Willy Wonka’s chocolate factory.

Sam’s original Well

Beer is still delivered by horse and dray in Tadcaster 5 days a week
Shire Horse Prince getting a Shower. That’s Sam recording on his phone. He posted it to their Facebook page.

Cask filler


Freshly cleaned barrels (they only use barrels and kilderkins, not firkin size)




German oak


Stave cutter


Laying out staves


New barrel

Into Willy Wonka’s Chocolate Factory


Turn of the century grain mill


Mash Tun




Grain chute

Sam buying us all a round


Tap room


Barrel staves in the fireplace


Smoke from the coal fired brewery


Old Rival, now owned by Heineken

What a treat that must have been! I was in several UK breweries a couple of summers ago, but missed out on Sam's due to my itinerary, which brought me near Tadcaster on a weekend when they were closed.

I have brewed a couple of times with the yeast I cultured from Stingo. So far it has produced fairly run of the mill English bitters. I haven't gotten any of the SS character from it yet. It also has a slightly funky flavor which fades after a few weeks. I imagine that the culture may have some other microbiological guests in addition to the yeast, who knows. I will probably try a stout next.

I wonder if Stingo is bottled with the primary yeast.
I had planned to harvest it myself when I saw your thread.
The release late last year wasn’t available in NJ and using the beer finder on Merchant du Vin I found some in the Wegmans in King of Prussia.
I bought 5 bottles and only drank one, with the idea that I would save the yeast of the next bottle I open, but I’m currently busy using CC from Brewlab.

It's definitely bottled with the primary yeast. The stuff is a massive, pillowy top fermenter. Check out the photos early in the thread, like #7.